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using subs only for detox
  1. #1
    shawnee35 is offline New Member
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    Default using subs only for detox

    Hi,
    I have been around here ofr like a week or so and have read many post thought maybe i culd get the adive i need from here. I have been on and off opiates for 6yrs. At worse my abuse was 20-25 5mg percs a day i know pretty bad not proud. I wnet on suboxone about 8months ago doc put me 16mg a day alot after reading so much about how hard subs are to come offf of I weaned myself down to .25mg twice a day. Than decided to jump when i started to feel the withdrawls i read some eople using opiates just for couple day to get through sub w/d. I tried needless to say I am have been taking 10-15 percs all over again it will be a week come saturday and I can feel that the addiction has kicked right in tried not to take anythin ghtis morning and wd started to kick in so took a 5perc. I am trying to wean down to only taking 1 perc every 4-6 hrs.

    This what I want to do I can't do w/d I fold I don't wan to be on subs for mnths again nor stay on pills I have 2 8mg subs tabs I want to use them for detox only thats it. just t get through withdrawl can someone pls help me do this right.

    shawnee

  2. #2
    Denny_D is offline Advanced Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by shawnee35 View Post
    Hi,
    I have been around here ofr like a week or so and have read many post thought maybe i culd get the adive i need from here. I have been on and off opiates for 6yrs. At worse my abuse was 20-25 5mg percs a day i know pretty bad not proud. I wnet on suboxone about 8months ago doc put me 16mg a day alot after reading so much about how hard subs are to come offf of I weaned myself down to .25mg twice a day. Than decided to jump when i started to feel the withdrawls i read some eople using opiates just for couple day to get through sub w/d. I tried needless to say I am have been taking 10-15 percs all over again it will be a week come saturday and I can feel that the addiction has kicked right in tried not to take anythin ghtis morning and wd started to kick in so took a 5perc. I am trying to wean down to only taking 1 perc every 4-6 hrs.

    This what I want to do I can't do w/d I fold I don't wan to be on subs for mnths again nor stay on pills I have 2 8mg subs tabs I want to use them for detox only thats it. just t get through withdrawl can someone pls help me do this right.

    shawnee
    Hi Shawnee .... Welcome to the forum! You have come to the right place for help with your addiction. And that is just it, you are caught up with the power of addiction and it is really difficult to break it, but it can certainly be done! You just have to want it more than you have ever wanted anything before, and most likely will ever want anything again either! There are many people here that can and will share their stories and offer you suggestions and advice that will help if you promise to do your part in this ok???

    You just can't go back and forth between the Subs and the other drugs! It has to be one or the other! And hopefully you choose neither of them! It is really difficult to wean down or taper down with your Percocets as it takes so much will power to do so. Most people don't have what it takes and will just end up gobbling the pills right down! Not saying that you are that person, only trying to explain the details as it has happened here on the forum!

    Your very best bet is to just go with the "cold turkey" approach and just be completely done with them for good. Google the Thomas Recipe for a list of supplements and vitamins that will help with your symptoms. Also get some real good protein shakes for energy purposes and there are many other things that will be of help as well. Up to you my friend, but you must be really committed to it, and have what it takes to do this. You have to chase the clean time just as hard as you have tried to get your pills at times!

    If you find that you CAN taper down your dose of the Percs, then try to take less and less every hour of the day and even cut them into halves and quarters to get the dose down to small amounts. When you get finished taking them you are going to be having symptoms for 3-7 days or so and then the majority of the really rough symptoms wil be over and then you will need to deal with the mental aspect of it. You CAN do this and you have already taken the very first step by admitting that you have a problem with addiction! Post as often as possible and please also be patient and others will be here shortly. Again welcome and I wish you the very best! God Bless....Denny

    p.s. If you keep going back and forth between the Subs and the Percs you are going to popssibly get yourself into precipated withdrawals and I can assure you that you do not want that to happen!
    fedupnow likes this.

  3. #3
    shawnee35 is offline New Member
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    I understand that but i have friends who used sub for like 3-5 day and that was it. has anyone on here ever done this.

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    Denny_D is offline Advanced Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by shawnee35 View Post
    I understand that but i have friends who used sub for like 3-5 day and that was it. has anyone on here ever done this.
    If the Subs are to be used then they should be used the correct way Shawnee! And that is to be inducted at the lowest most effective dose and then remain on them and give your brain time to heal properly. And then you can begin the taper process! I will put the link at the bottom here as to how they should be used properly ok? Take a look at the link and then if you would like to do it properly then please come right back for help. God Bless.....Denny


    Sub Induction and Taper Plan

    http://www.drugs.com/forum/featured-...apy-50887.html

  5. #5
    Denny_D is offline Advanced Member
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    Using the Subs for only the 3-5 days as you mention almost always leads to a relapse! If you want to use the Subs the proper way then you need to have enough of them to do it properly!

  6. #6
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    you have only been using for a week... if you stop now you can get a hold of this... dont go back to subs at all. you jumped at .5mg which is ok for some....

    stop using now... before this gets way out of hand.... what makes you think that using subs this time is going to help. if you tapered down and then jumped off. and went back to pills again....

    if you choose to use those subs, (which it seems like you are going to do) you are going to have to take a bare minimum or you will be back to square one, and then when they run out you will likely go back to the pills...

    YOU WOULD BE FAR BETTER GRITTING YOUR TEETH AND GETTIN ON WITH IT. after a week only of pills, its do able, but the longer you wait the harder its gonna be...

  7. #7
    fedupnow is offline Member
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    You should stop what your doing ASAP...

    Your most likely not feeling any withdrawal from the perc's, they are most likely the after affects from the sub's which can last for the most part from 7-14 days.. If you do have anymore perc's then u can dose very slowly and distance your doses.. this is however uncharted territory and there is no guarantee's what will happen..

    I'm currently tapering my sub's and have gone down from 8-6-4 now trying 3mg's all in a few weeks. It has been hard but do-able..

    If I were you, I would stop, re-think and flush.. I know it's extremely difficult but why did you stop the sub's in the first place? because you wanted your freedom back.. you must pay the piper to get it... You can do this if you stop now, before you truly get addicted to the perc's again..

    good luck and post, there are a ton of people around more then willing to help you get through this! stay positive!
    Last edited by fedupnow; 01-19-2012 at 04:25 PM.

  8. #8
    shawnee35 is offline New Member
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    I truely appreciate the feed back from everyone and i read the plan that dennyd posted thats pretty much what I did I was n 16mg of subs. and went down to .5mg so I took the .5mg again than had read of people useing opiates just for the week to get through with drawl of subs yes I am taking my percs to much and have cut way back from the other day more like 5-6 so 1 perc about every 4hrs.

    I understand that the plan posted is the way most people on this forum have dome it and it worked for them fr me it felt like a trade off. I have friends that in clinics used week tops and it wrked for them. The difference you have to be prepared to do the mental work right away the cravings the depression its by far taking the easy way out of the long hall just easing the wd thats all i want. I have my supprt system have councler just tired of always being in some form of wd.

  9. #9
    fedupnow is offline Member
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    Hey if your truly think that's going work for you then more power to you!

    I've also heard of people using mild opiate's to ease withdrawal and it can be dun but you will still feel some withdrawal at some point.. Everyone will recommend against it because it can become habit forming and set you back... just take control after and remember why you got off sub's

    I wouldn't pass that 10 day mark though. sub withdrawal should be eased up and you should be able to pull through the rest. just use a sleep aid and it will make you feel better..

    Good luck and keep us posted..

  10. #10
    INDCNTRY is offline Junior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by fedupnow View Post
    You should stop what your doing ASAP...

    Your most likely not feeling any withdrawal from the perc's, they are most likely the after affects from the sub's which can last for the most part from 7-14 days.. If you do have anymore perc's then u can dose very slowly and distance your doses.. this is however uncharted territory and there is no guarantee's what will happen..

    I'm currently tapering my sub's and have gone down from 8-6-4 now trying 3mg's all in a few weeks. It has been hard but do-able..

    If I were you, I would stop, re-think and flush.. I know it's extremely difficult but why did you stop the sub's in the first place? because you wanted your freedom back.. you must pay the piper to get it... You can do this if you stop now, before you truly get addicted to the perc's again..

    good luck and post, there are a ton of people around more then willing to help you get through this! stay positive!


    Yes I agree. This is 4 people now Shawnee all saying Stop Now. And by the way...you ARE addicted to Percs. Fortunately (this time) you were able to cut back. Time to Cut Out. I quit my sub at 2 mg/day....which is to say, while still opiate dependent. I was able to do so because I believed I could and most importantly...I didn't have any pills around. 3 weeks clean as of today and you can do it too. I tried what you are talking about after my first introduction to subs (between Drs.) Let me tell you...You have got to know Tapering with your DOC is really only "using less for now". Quit it Shawnee. All of it. When you start feeling that wd, keep on fighting, wait and repeat. Seriously, you can make it after just a blip in the scheme of things.
    God Speed

  11. #11
    shawnee35 is offline New Member
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    I am stpping tonight i have 4 percs left but I'm confusedd am I readdicted to the percs or is the sub withdrawl hanging around. I plan to induce very low like between .25 or .50 today is day 6 on the pers day 7 off subs this where im stuck.

  12. #12
    INDCNTRY is offline Junior Member
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    I am confused too. Do you mean to say "induction" with .5 of your perc rx? And you have been off subs for 7 days correct? If so, there is no induction with your DOC. you are talking about tapering...yes?

    Denny....help Please? This boy/girl needs advice...again. Stay with us Shawnee. I want to make sure you don't hurt yourself. No sub in your system with your percs...etc. And make sure you are doing everything to give you the best chance of getting clean.
    D

  13. #13
    shawnee35 is offline New Member
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    no I jumped off subs at ,5mg about 8days ago and made the mistake of taking percs fr the past 6 days to ease wd from subs but now when i don't take perc i feel like ???? is this the sub wd still running course or is it the opiate withdrawl thats why if so I'd rather go back to the sub taper at low induction like .5 and be don in couple days to get me throughbthe maybe opiate wd.

    >> this sun withdrawl still hanging on cause it strong but it feels like opiate wd to be honest this where i'm confused. I pland n not taking anymore percs but if it gets to ontence i gonna induce a sub at .25 up as little as possible just make it tolerable just can't do the full on opiate withdrawl again i can't

  14. #14
    Denny_D is offline Advanced Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by INDCNTRY View Post
    I am confused too. Do you mean to say "induction" with .5 of your perc rx? And you have been off subs for 7 days correct? If so, there is no induction with your DOC. you are talking about tapering...yes?

    Denny....help Please? This boy/girl needs advice...again. Stay with us Shawnee. I want to make sure you don't hurt yourself. No sub in your system with your percs...etc. And make sure you are doing everything to give you the best chance of getting clean.
    D
    Shawnee ..... Like I told you in my first post, if you keep going back and forth between the Subs and the Percs you risk the chance of putting yourself into precipated withdrawals which means that the withdrawals come on instantly and are the worst withdrawals that can happen to anyone! They are in a word, horrible! And I can assure you that you DO NOT want that to happen to you!

    You are at the point that you should like I told you, just stop cold turkey and deal with the withdrawal symptoms for the 3-7 days, and then you will be finished with the physical symptoms. Then you will need to deal with the mental aspect of it.

    With using the Subs it needs to be done the correct way or you are just wasting your time. If you keep going from the Subs to the Percs and back to the Subs again you are really asking for trouble in my opinion Shawnee! Your decision of course!

    After you have been on the Subs for a time and then begin to use the Percs, the Subs are covering up, or blocking the feeling from the Percs. And then attempting to go back to the Subs right after using The Percs, without waiting until you are in withdrawals according to the COWS sheet and obtaining a score of 26 or more, is really asking for trouble! You must use one or the other, or nothing at all Shawnee, and I am in favor of you using nothing to get yourself clean at this time with what you have told here.

    It takes the Sub almost 30 days or even longer to get fully dissapated, or removed from your system. And you are trying to use the Percs to hold the Sub symptoms at bay right? Like I told you one of these times you are NOT going to get away with it and go into precipated withdrawals! So you should stop right now before you get into real trouble with both drugs! Like I am saying right now you should just completely stop everything and be completely finished Shawnee. That is your very best chance RIGHT NOW for getting clean! And YES, you ARE addicted to the Percs! Hope this helps. God Bless.....Denny
    INDCNTRY likes this.

  15. #15
    Denny_D is offline Advanced Member
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    And also YES, the Subs are still in your system!

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    shawnee35 is offline New Member
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    otay but i was only taking .5mg of sub a day and i can feel the percs thats what scares me. so i'm gnna have to g through full opiate withdrawl than

  17. #17
    Denny_D is offline Advanced Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by shawnee35 View Post
    otay but i was only taking .5mg of sub a day and i can feel the percs thats what scares me. so i'm gnna have to g through full opiate withdrawl than
    That's right...you need to go through the withdrawals and get this over with the best way, and the quickest way Shawnee!

  18. #18
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    yeh but the longer you keep taking them the worse it is going to be...

    stop now... get something to help you sleep. and push on thru... you were on a low dose of sub,, roberts taper recommends jumping off at .5 ...

    you have to get this right, or you will be back to square one...

    and it wont be as full on as your original withdrawl, you have only been using for a week.... STOP NOW
    INDCNTRY likes this.

  19. #19
    shawnee35 is offline New Member
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    I took 8 perc 5's today so if doing the sub thing is worse at this point

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    shawnee35 is offline New Member
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    last time i did cold turkey it was horrible i was n 20-25 a day i'm scared

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    well you cant take subs after taking percs... you will go into prec wd. which means the percs will be knocked off your receptors quick smart, and the sub works differently and you will suffer. trust me ive done it, and it sucks...

    how many percs you got left..

    why dont you taper them...

  22. #22
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    look, you used subs to get off opiates right..?

    and now youve gone back to opiates to releive you sub withdrawl.... you are only into this a week, (back on the pills that is)

    it is NOT GOING TO BE AS BAD as this stage, but the more you take, yes the worse it is going to get...

    you need to decide how much you want this...

  23. #23
    shawnee35 is offline New Member
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    and I don't have the money or resources for all the thomas recipe all i have is allergy pils and couple zanax

  24. #24
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    when i came off subs, i used something to help me sleep. didnt use thomas recipe stuff...

    how many percs you got left..?

  25. #25
    shawnee35 is offline New Member
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    i'll give it a go but i don't know the legs are the worse fr me they ache s bad i know i'm whining just though i'd back on my sub taper and avoid all this oh well

  26. #26
    shawnee35 is offline New Member
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    I have four left

  27. #27
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    soooooo when ya gonna take em....??

    i would suggest you save 2 for tomorrow... then 1 for next day then one more on day 3.... then go cold turkey and get this over with...

    it seriously is a situation where the longer you use at this point the harder it is going to be... one week in.,.. its not going to be as bad at this point...

  28. #28
    shawnee35 is offline New Member
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    so i shouldn't just take them and be done all together

  29. #29
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    your choice that was just a suggestion.... if you pop the lot, are you likely to go thru with cold turkey...

    why not flush them now and just start NOW, that would show how serious you are to get clean wouldnt it...??

  30. #30
    fedupnow is offline Member
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    you are ahead symptom wise...7 days clean from sub's, your probably already done the worst part.. I would stop it with the perks and hang on another few days to see if you start feeling better..

    physical symptoms should be over soon... The problem tho is you took perc's.. there is a chance it may prolong things just a bit but at this point I don't think so.. If you continue this then you are making it worse for yourself.. if you don't want to trash your perc's then do like cheekysod told you..

    I'm sorry to tell you, but there is absolutely no easy (no symptoms) way off this!

    Dig deep my friend and get a hold of yourself.. you are so far already and would hate to see you go through this again..

    unless you want to just stay on sub's, perc's forever... that's the only pain free way... well somewhat..

    If for some reason you do decide to take a sub then i would take .25 and skip for 3-4 days or be done... but I think you will have symptoms all over agian.. Day 1.....
    Last edited by fedupnow; 01-20-2012 at 08:05 PM.

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