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Robert Could I please get your help - Seeing Dr. for Sub detox tomorrow
  1. #1
    Sub_Detox88 is offline Junior Member
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    Default Robert Could I please get your help - Seeing Dr. for Sub detox tomorrow

    Hi Robert,

    I have read numerous threads that you have assisted other people with suboxone treatment for opiate addiction and I was hoping I could get your direction on the best approach to take.

    I have been taking about 50 mg of oxycodone ( blue 30 mg pills) every day for about 7 months. My use started off small and infrequently but it then became a coping mechanism to deal with stress and day to day life (not good!) I have tried to taper off on my own by reducing dosage every 3 days but had no success. So tomorrow I am deciding to give suboxone a try and would appriciate you guidance.


    I will have been about 36 hours off of meds when I see the dr. and I believe he will simply be writing me a script and I will be administering the dose. Since I'm not sure yet what he will prescribe, I was wondering though what you would recommend I do and provide an estimate of how I should approach this. I am extremely grateful for anyones help who has been through this process and can lend their 2 cents.


    I hope that this will help remove me from my opiate addiction and help me get back to normal.
    Thanks!

  2. #2
    Strong Desire is offline Advanced Member
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    Hello and welcome to the forum. I will provide you with the link to Robert's sub therapy plan for your reading. Come back and post with any questions and someone would be glad to help you if you need it. Take care and congratulations for wanting to get yourself clean.

    Big Hugs,
    Karen


    Sub Therapy Plan
    http://www.drugs.com/forum/featured-...apy-50887.html

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    NoFear23 is offline Junior Member
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    7 months? you really havent been on drugs that long and by your count of mgs youve only been taking about 2 blues a day which is not alot at all. im not saying you dont have a problem cause you can have a problem off one pill a day. alls im saying is are you sure you want to go the sub route? you arent in that deep and you should be able to just get off the blues by itself if you really wanted to. subs is usually for people who have had years of abusing there DOC. im not trying to minimize your problem at all. im just saying think about it. you can tough it out for 7 days and then after that get yourself involved in groups such as NA or AA and learn from people who have had years of addiction and educate yourself on why you dont want this to go on any further then it has to and you can stop this habit before it gets worse. its all your choice though. and dont get me wrong its really good that you caught onto your addiction before it really got bad and you should be proud that your owning up to your habit this early cause most of us it takes awhile before we admit we have an addiction but im saying is since youve caught onto your addiction early i would seriously consider staying home for a week toughing it out and then get yourself active in some meetings so your more aware of your addiction. you can do it. you just got to want it.

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    Sub_Detox88 is offline Junior Member
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    Thank you very much for your suggestion. While you might be right that I should try to "tough" it out. My job, career, and responsibilities don't allow me to slow down let alone take a week off. I know you might suggest that I reassess everything I am doing and that it is causing too much stress, but at this moment I am in a situation where I have ALOT to lose if I were to screw up and have worked so hard to get where I am. I have tried stopping on my own / quitting cold turkey and each time I either relapse because of the withdrwals or stress. I can't withdraw at work and be able to make it through the week without having an emotional and physical breakdown. I know it could be alot worse, but I simply have failed to stop opiates on my own and it is the withdraw effects that are the main reason. I also suffer from high anxiety and occasional depression which is exasperbated even more when withdrawing occurs.

    This option I believe would be one that would be able to help me keep functioning and be able to get off of these drugs for good. I have been seeing a therapist for 7 months now too and she has either recommended rehab or stopping my job to deal with this. Those two options are thigns I would be willing to do, only after I have failed to try other methods and it becomes a life or death matter.

    From what I have read from Roberts Sub Therapy thread, the process is done over 2-3 weeks as to have the person be on Subs for the shortest amount of time possible and taper off. I have come to this site because from everything I have read, it does sound like most Drs could be making a one size fits all assumption with treatment and I want to make sure that I am as educated and informed as possible if I am going to do it to make sure that it does lead to a successful detox and not another addiction.

    I am seeing my dr tomorrow and will post the dosage that he prescribes me and seek out suggestions before I go down the rabbit hole. I wish I could just try to go cold turkey, but I would probably lose my job and breakdown at work or freak out and say thigns I would regret. I have almost gone to tears at work while trying to get off before because the depression kicks in very badly and is hard for me to function. I understand this may be more mental than anything but I am here because I am at my wits end with constantly having to track down pills to make sure I can make it though the week. I really appreciate the advice and you are not the first that has suggested trying to avoid this route if possible. I just need help and at the same time can't put my life on hold.

    So given my background though - what would be an appropriate dose for me to start with, or is the induction process mentioned on roberts thread sufficient to follow. I want to make sure I don't take too much and since I've been told my opiate dose isn't that high, I am not sure if i need to adjust it anymore. I also know that I should be a 26 or higher on the cow scale, but I also do not want to go through WD hell in trying to figure out when that is. I know it is different for everyone, but would 36 hours sober be enough time to take the first dose.

    Thanks so much

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    Strong Desire is offline Advanced Member
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    Sub Detox,

    While I do agree with No Fear that with your level of addiction the cold turkey approach might be the way to go, I will give you my side of things and what I finally had to do to get myself free of those drugs.

    While I did have my addiction for a little over 7 years, I did try to taper and go cold turkey many, many, many times only to fail each and every time because of the cravings. That was from mostly a narcotic pill problem, but I did use nearly every other drug that was offered which was all the time. I thought long and hard and read all the posts here I could and finally decided I really needed to give Suboxone it's chance. It was the very best decision I could have ever made for myself.

    From the moment I took that first dose in the induction, my cravings lowered to almost zero. And with my second dose they completely ended at that very moment. And I haven't had any either since then. Now that is my particular case and what it did for me. I have been completely clean for 18 days today and have had no withdrawal symptoms during the entire process. But again, that's my particular case.

    I gave you the link to Robert's plan and you have read it. All the information you will need is in the plan. But it is not set in stone and you may use it to fit your own needs. Wait for someone with lots of experience to hop in here and answer your questions. Please try to be patient. And remember this is what I had to do for ME. Only giving you my side of things.

    Best wishes to you and I will support you in whatever you decide to do. Take care and hold on for someone to stop by with more information.

    Hugs,
    Karen

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    zabko is offline Member
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    Sub_Detox88, I can't speak for Robert or any of the other experts on this board, but as someone who was just in your shoes a few months ago (starting sub) I can tell you to start with the lowest possible dose. I was started at 16mg/day and flew to 32mg/day at times. No bueno. Robert's plan is predicated on inducting the person on suboxone at the lowest possible dose. Maybe someone can chime in on what people usually induct at for oxy usage, but I would suspect it would be around 2-3mg based on reading Robert's posts to others. Best bet would be have your doc write a script and you take your first dose at home, that's what I did. Then you could easily start off by following Robert's plan.

    I also agree with NoFear23, 7 months of usabuse seems extreme for going on suboxone. I'm in the same boat as you with work and add a family to it. I successfully detoxed three times (with dozens of failed attempts) over the years before trying suboxone, and every time it gets harder. Oxy withdrawals suck especially the sporadic muscular twitching, but I assure you 4-5 days of miserable is better then weeks of mostly miserable. At least you can set a clock and know about when the timer will go off. Just wait for a holiday weekend and take an extra few days to extend it, bada bing bada boom you're clean. Then the real battle begins...

    Good luck and God Bless! Let us know what you decide and how it does.

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    Sub_Detox88 is offline Junior Member
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    Thanks Karen. My plan is to see the doctor tomorrow, get the script and then come back on here to continue to get more educated on the matter before I take my dose. I was told it will be the suboxone film. I have great insurance but have not yet called to find out what the copay will be. For anyone that would consider there insurance to be very strong, how much did you typically pay for a script.

    I know that Suboxone isn't the miracle drug cure that will solve all my problems, but my hope is that it will help me get off opiates and try to get my life in order and that I can taper off of it ASAP.

    Karen- how long did you wait in going into withdrawl before you took your dose? I want to be very sure that I do not go into preciptated withdraw.

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    zabko is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sub_Detox88 View Post
    For anyone that would consider there insurance to be very strong, how much did you typically pay for a script.
    One time I paid about $200, the other time I paid $15. Go figure. Insurance companies are a joke.

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    Strong Desire is offline Advanced Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sub_Detox88 View Post
    Thanks Karen. My plan is to see the doctor tomorrow, get the script and then come back on here to continue to get more educated on the matter before I take my dose. I was told it will be the suboxone film. I have great insurance but have not yet called to find out what the copay will be. For anyone that would consider there insurance to be very strong, how much did you typically pay for a script.

    I know that Suboxone isn't the miracle drug cure that will solve all my problems, but my hope is that it will help me get off opiates and try to get my life in order and that I can taper off of it ASAP.

    Karen- how long did you wait in going into withdrawal before you took your dose? I want to be very sure that I do not go into preciptated withdraw.
    I do have great insurance and my copay was $25.00 for my (60) - 8mg sub pills. But everyone's insurance will most likely be different as you probably know. My doctor WOULD NOT take my insurance for the office visit as most won't because they want to make all the money they can from you. Robert advised me to go into the doctors office and leave with the largest script I could for subs and that is exactly what I did. But the pharmacy DID accept my insurance like I said.

    To answer your question about how long I waited before induction the answer is to go STRICTLY by that COWS sheet score of 26 or above! It is foolproof. It could be 12 hours, 24 hours, 36 hours, or longer before you reach that score. That's why the COWS score is so important, it is FOOLPROOF. You just can't put a TIME on how long it may be before you're ready to induct. Use that COWS score! Hope this helps.

    Karen

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    Strong Desire is offline Advanced Member
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    I had Robert guiding me all the way. I was feeling really bad in withdrawals up until I took that very first dose of sub. I made sure my symptoms were scored accuratly and didn't fudge on the score. Then when I got between a 26-28 or so on that COWS sheet Robert had me take that first dose and wait about an hour or so.

    You can go to the Need to Talk section here and read my thread. It is loaded with so much advice and support from others here. Take a look when you get a moment and see how it went for me.

    Karen

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    Sub_Detox88 is offline Junior Member
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    Thanks everyone! I really will think long and hard tomorrow after the doctor appointment before I set down this path. I just cannot continue / nor do i have the source to keep trying to find oxy on a monthly basis and make sure that I don't run out. It has come to that where I am just always asking about the next source before I have even been close to running out. I will say that I'm a healthy 24 year old, but I just honestly cannot handle the withdraws while working. I'm not able to take a week off let alone two days at a time and so that is another issue that complicates my matter. Zabko- you mention that I would be saving my self months of agony over a week or two by just going cold turkey. If by doing Roberts method, will I really have that bad of w/d symptoms for a month. That really scares me and as I mentioned before the reason I can't quit oxy is because of the WD. The high comes second in my cravings for taking it. The first thing I am always focusing on is how bad, anxious, depressed I feel and it is only after I have taken the pills and start to normal out that I think about wanting to take more to get high ( this may be standard addict nature but I am not sure as this is still new to me). Today I had planned to go to work and not take oxy, see my dr. tomorrow and then wait it out till in full w/d before taking the sub.. but I was forced to uphold a commitment to a friend and go out for a couple drinks. I don't drink much so that was not the issue. The problem was that my friend was trying to help me out and set me up with a friend of hers I had met a couple weeks ago, whoI had hit it off really well with. So no complaints there from me, but my problem was that after a long day of work and about 28 hours of no oxy, I was feeling like ???? and I couldn't go out and socialize as the w/d me. So i had to take the oxy to get me to feel fine. Things went really well tonight, and none of it is attributed to the oxy. I was the NORMAL fun me that I would be when I used to go out on the weekends months ago. The oxy just helped me feel fine, but I KNOW it was my old self who was socializing and talking to the girls. I just wanted to say that incase anyone would mention that it was the drugs that were giving me this feeling and not my interaction with people. I will say that the drugs helped me get to feeling normal which allowed me to be myself and that is what I long so much to get back to. I really connected with the girl I met tonight however I know that I don't want to pursue anything further with her until I am on my way to being drug free. It just isnt fair to her and I want to make sure that any relationship we form is pure and has no connection with drugs. It felt great to be out with people and interacting. I just want to get back to normal where I can go out and not worry about feeling annoyed, irritable, and nausiousm to the point that I would rather be in my room all alone not talking to anyone. I am sick of the days when that happens and that I am so dependent on a drug to function.

    Yes, I understand my dose of oxy that I take may be low for the norm, but I have failed so many times to get off on my own and I think that this could help me so much. I am on welbutrin which is a med for anxiety and some depression and one of its side effects is that it helps people stop smoking. It does this because when people smoke, they no longer get a buzz or any sensation from it and therefore it makes the cigarette useless (unless you have a fixation just for smoking itself). Over my 7 month period I had gone from never smoking to smoking5-10 cigs a day. That is ALOT for never smoking before. Anyways when I was coincidentally placed on wellbutrin, I was not told of this side effect but noticed it myself when i tried to smoke a week or two after the meds began to take effect. What I described above of no buzz, or any feeling coming from the cig was exactly what happend and I actually was asking myself why i was inhaling this ?????? tasting stick. The elimination of the reward / stimulating feeling was what helped me kick the habit before things got bad as I do have an addictive personality. Without Wellbutrin I would have gone down the same path I am at with opiates where I would take them, feel bad about doing it, tell myself i would stop and not do them anymore, then a day or two later when some stressor would occur I would be back to popping my pill.

    While I know opiate addiction is different, if suboxone can emulate any of the properties wellbutrin does in that it gets rid of the feeling I would normally get as well as cravings and withdraws, I am hopeful that this will help me quit.

    Once again, to anyone who has been on SUBS and successfully tapered off, what was your time frame and did you experience long , painful w/d symptoms or were you able to follow Roberts plan and achieve minimal discomfort over a short period of time.

    Sincerely Grateful

    Rob

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    zabko is offline Member
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    Hi Rob, I bid you good luck at the doctor's and trust in your instinct to make the right decision. A few thoughts on your previous post, (1) I think you quoted my rough timeline of symptoms incorrectly but the fact is suboxone withdrawals will last several times longer than a WD from oxy, I personally didn't taper and jump, rather I just walked the plank and fell off, but there are plenty here who Robert has helped taper down who can shed some insight on the level of suboxone WD to expect even when tapering to a low dose. (2) you are still at such an early stage, I recall needing only a little to feel "normal", then before you know it you're taking 15-20 a day to feel normal, now is the time to quit, have you thought about tapering the oxy down and jumping from there? You may do well with suboxone short term on Robert's plan, but I think it's a risk starting suboxone period especially when you're not in too deep yet; (3) I think you know this one, but don't start a new relationship, or even courting a woman, until you get yourself straight, it will only lead to disaster down the road - God forbid you get her hooked as well, have you considered that?; (4) on smoking, suboxone will only increase your desire to smoke, whereas quitting has completely obliterated by cravings for cigarettes they taste disgusting now - this coming from a 12 year smoker. But quitting cigarettes is a walk in the park compared to opiates IMO.

    Remember, no matter which route you choose, both will have their unique struggles. And there are countless people including your doctor, this forum, etc. to support you along the way. 3-4 days of misery for which the doctor can provide some "comfort" meds to help you get through it, or the potential for several weeks of it. The choice is yours my friend. Good luck and God Bless.

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    Strong Desire is offline Advanced Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sub_Detox88 View Post
    Once again, to anyone who has been on SUBS and successfully tapered off, what was your time frame and did you experience long , painful w/d symptoms or were you able to follow Roberts plan and achieve minimal discomfort over a short period of time.

    Sincerely Grateful

    Rob
    Hi Rob,

    Like I told you I used Robert's sub therapy plan and I was on the sub for a total of 35 days, or exactly 5 weeks. But you have to understand that my example was a "perfect" example of how the sub experience should go. I had absolutely zero problems or withdrawals at all. But again my experience is not what most people experience. It seems that most experience some type of symptoms.

    My total induction was only 1.7mg per day. And because I was having no trouble I tapered every 3 days instead of every 4 or so as the plan suggests. And I am in excellent physical condition. I jog 2-5 miles every single morning, go to the gym 3 days per week, and I am on the go from the time I get up in the morning until the time I go to bed in the evening. I believe in my own opinion this makes a great big difference in how the plan goes. That is my story. That is what I myself believe.

    Like I told you in my above post, go to my thread in the Need to Talk section and read through it. There is lots of advice, suggestions, and support from many here with all the answers. And I followed directions from Robert right to the letter as he asked me to do. I didn't waiver one bit from the overall plan and instructions he gave me. Read the thread and you will see. It's long, but has good info there for you. Hope this helps.

    Karen

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    iloerose is offline Platinum Member
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    Hi, Rob, two things you need to remember: everybody is different, and that you need to score a 26 on the COWS worksheet. If you do not, you could precipitate w/d from taking the subs too early and you do not want to do that. Be careful. I wish you could tough out the c/t as it is only around 3-5 days of feeling like you have a very bad flu. Subs are NOT a miracle drug, they are an opiate. Read around this thread and see what others have experienced. Follow Roberts directions to the letter (the link that Karen put up for you). Only seven months and 50mg per day is not a large habit. You also need to know that subs, being an opiate, can be addicting as well. Be careful and good luck.

    Peace,

    Iloerose

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    Sub_Detox88 is offline Junior Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by iloerose View Post
    Hi, Rob, two things you need to remember: everybody is different, and that you need to score a 26 on the COWS worksheet. If you do not, you could precipitate w/d from taking the subs too early and you do not want to do that. Be careful. I wish you could tough out the c/t as it is only around 3-5 days of feeling like you have a very bad flu. Subs are NOT a miracle drug, they are an opiate. Read around this thread and see what others have experienced. Follow Roberts directions to the letter (the link that Karen put up for you). Only seven months and 50mg per day is not a large habit. You also need to know that subs, being an opiate, can be addicting as well. Be careful and good luck.

    Peace,

    Iloerose
    Thanks for the reply. I am having second thoughts about the Subs as that could take me down another rabbit hole. I am at the dr right now and I think my plan will be to start cold turkey and see how long I can make it. I will take Monday off and try my best to make it that far. If the w/d are too bad, then I will start the Subs. I am Prescribed Xanax and so maybe with the help of that I can try to get through this on my own. My real issue is going to be getting past this part and handling the cravings. Not sure if I can do it. I only have 3 -30 mg oxy left and so I don't think that's enough to successfully taper down, maybe I'm wrong? Just from the failed attempts before, I just am not sure if I can cope through the whole process and want to stop my cycle of constantly trying to find more to not run out each month.

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    Strong Desire is offline Advanced Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sub_Detox88 View Post
    Thanks for the reply. I am having second thoughts about the Subs as that could take me down another rabbit hole. I am at the dr right now and I think my plan will be to start cold turkey and see how long I can make it. I will take Monday off and try my best to make it that far. If the w/d are too bad, then I will start the Subs. I am Prescribed Xanax and so maybe with the help of that I can try to get through this on my own. My real issue is going to be getting past this part and handling the cravings. Not sure if I can do it. I only have 3 -30 mg oxy left and so I don't think that's enough to successfully taper down, maybe I'm wrong? Just from the failed attempts before, I just am not sure if I can cope through the whole process and want to stop my cycle of constantly trying to find more to not run out each month.
    I think that's a good plan and I certainly wish you the very best with it. I will support you all the way as you attempt to get yourself clean. I'm not sure about the Xanax, but others will advise you on that. All the best to you and please keep posting as much as possible. Others will want to see how you're doing all the way through as will I. All the best in your attempt.

    Karen

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    zabko is offline Member
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    Sub_Detox88, if you're going cold turkey, I would recommend perusing the Thomas Recipe, while it won't fully eradicate your w/ds, it can certainly (and only) help.

    Check it out:
    The Thomas Recipe - For Opiate Withdrawal

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    Sub_Detox88 is offline Junior Member
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    I got back from the dr and was given a script for 15- 8mg subs film. The doctor did not seem that well educated on the matter as when I asked him how long to wait in w/d before i would know when to take the pill he said -hmmm thats a good question, just wait until you feel pretty bad. He also said to take 4 or up to 8 mg the first dose and see how i feel before seeing i would need more. I will follow roberts method as it sounds very logical and a much better approach. That way minimizing the amount that i need. It would be great if .5mg or 1 mg will do the trick and hopefully allow me for a much faster time period on this drug. I am gonna see what happens with the cold turkey attempt but I have a feeling it will be the same old story and that though instead of using my percs, i will take the sub instead and at least get back SOME control of my life while I figure the rest out.

    My two sisters who are my age know of my problem, and while they are trying to help, one of them told my parents I guess - this is news I found out today. My therapist told me on the phone that she received a letter from my parents asking about the issue and letting her know that they were wanting to help if possible. They are on vacation / havent confronted me about it and may not until I tell them because they probably don't want to tell me that my sister told them and cause a possible feud around the issue of trusting them.

    While I'm okay and a little relieved that they know, this was something I wish I would have been able to do on my own and not have my sister telling them behind my back. While I know she means well, she still did violate my trust. My issue problem wasn't getting worse and I was actually and have been trying to fix it. So my parents finding out is also something I may have been able to avoid had I been given more time to fix this. It is what it is and I am going to think about what I will do with the issue as my parents get back from vacation soon.


    Well... I have certainly digressed from the main issue which is getting off the opiates. I am still just grinding it out at my place waiting for the massive storm of withdraw symptoms to show up :-). Can't wait to start getting the flu like symptoms, non stop yawning,sweat on my upper lip and of course complete lack of energy and nausea.

    I guess I'm gonna go get in one last workout as I have a feeling I won't be wanting to go to the gym for the next couple days however this plays out.

    Yet another issue


    With induction... can someone explain the process of finding the appropriate dose. Like for instance lets say I find that it takes 1.25 mg to feel better after the ramp up to it. Is that the dose that I should take the next day or could I feel worse the next day and find that 1.5 is a better amt?

    I have tried the thomas recipe - or say did a variation of it because I did not have everything that it consisted of but maybe was unsuccessful because I was trying to do it while working. I can't take time off to do that and I could go on and write a novel about how lost I am in that situation but I don't think anyone would like to hear about those issues.

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    Strong Desire is offline Advanced Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sub_Detox88 View Post
    With induction... can someone explain the process of finding the appropriate dose. Like for instance lets say I find that it takes 1.25 mg to feel better after the ramp up to it. Is that the dose that I should take the next day or could I feel worse the next day and find that 1.5 is a better amt?

    I have tried the thomas recipe - or say did a variation of it because I did not have everything that it consisted of but maybe was unsuccessful because I was trying to do it while working. I can't take time off to do that and I could go on and write a novel about how lost I am in that situation but I don't think anyone would like to hear about those issues.

    I can tell you how it was for me in my particular case. I followed Robert's suggestions exactly. I was finally inducted and stable at 1.4mg the FIRST day. But the next day I knew that it just wasn't quite enough to remain that way. So Robert had me add another .25mg to the 1.4mg dose. That ended up being a total of 1.65mg to be completely stable. He then had me just round that amount off to be 1.7mg total daily dose.

    That is why the induction is a 4-day process.....so if needed the dose can be "tweaked" during that 4 days. I then remained on the 1.7mg for 4 days and then began my reduction. Robert also had me take that 1.7mg in 2 separate doses of .85mg each. One in the am, and the other in the late afternoon. It worked perfectly for me. No withdrawals, no cravings, no problems of any kind.

    And Robert had me continue to take my doses as I reduced in 2 doses per day until I got down under 1mg dose. Then I took it in only one dose per day around the noon hour. That was the time it worked best for ME. It could be different for you. You can take the entire amount in one dose if YOU choose to do that. Others have done it that way and it has worked great. Up to you.

    Please take a look at my thread in the Need to Talk section. It's called "Tired of the Games...May Try Suboxone...Need Help Please". You will see how it went for me and maybe you can use some of the advice and suggestions that were given to me and apply them to your individual case. Hope this helps you. Best wishes and please know that you CAN DO THIS. You only have to want it bad enough!

    Hugs,
    Karen

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    Sub_Detox88 is offline Junior Member
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    Hi Karen,

    I have been reading your thread. A lot of valuable knowledge that I will definitely use and lean on through the process.
    Strong Desire likes this.

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    Sub_Detox88 is offline Junior Member
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    withdraws are starting to kick in and i think tomorrow i will be taking my first dose. Robert - if you see this at all and would be able to help with the first crucial process, I would be extremely grateful!

  22. #22
    Strong Desire is offline Advanced Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sub_Detox88 View Post
    withdraws are starting to kick in and i think tomorrow i will be taking my first dose. Robert - if you see this at all and would be able to help with the first crucial process, I would be extremely grateful!
    Hey Rob,

    Just checking on you to see how you're doing today? Are you still trying the cold turkey approach, or have you decided to use the subs after all? I know the withdrawals really stink, but like it has been said before, you only have to do it ONE TIME, so just be committed no matter which way you want to go. Make you're mind up and go with it. Lots of people here with advice and suggestions for you either way. Take care and give us an update please.

    Hugs,
    Karen

  23. #23
    Sub_Detox88 is offline Junior Member
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    So I ended up calling my parents and letting them know the situation - since my sister had already told them. They suggested that I continue to try to taper with the remaining 90 mg i have left and get down as low as I can first before deciding the next step to to. That will get me through the week until next weekend in which I will have to make my decision. I am still just not sure what to do as I am scared about taking the subs but also know that I can't go cold turkey unless i am able to get down to a very low dose 5mg or less in which then i somehow can then bare w/d symptoms. I will continue to post this week and let you know of my progress and the net step with my treatment. Thank you so much for your help and am grateful for your continued support.

  24. #24
    Sub_Detox88 is offline Junior Member
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    I am going to see my general physician tomorrow to hopefully try to get a more educated opinion on what I should do / if suboxone is the best approach. Does anyone know what drs can or usually do to try to help someone with opiate addiction. Obviously suboxone is one method, but from what you all have said here, that may not be the best thing for me to do yet. I am still just very lost and now just feel like i'm kicking the can and dragging out what the next plan of action is. Once again I'm about 30 hours without taking oxy and plan to take tomorrow of from work to try to figure something out. If anyone can give me any suggestions I would be so thankful. All I know of at the moment is cold turky (not an option), subs, or trying to taper off on my own - this would require me having to try to locate more pks since i am almost out and I'm not sure if i can find more before I'm completely out.

  25. #25
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    if you really cant go cold turkey. USE THE SUBS. at the lowest dose possible that releives your symptoms. they are easier to taper off with.
    i know some people will say cold turkey at your stage, but we all were at your stage and couldnt stop. and used for years and years. (like me)

    BUT pay notice to the cows sheet. and use the induction as per roberts taper plan. and you will end up on a low dose, and can taper off while working. i did.

    karen has an inspiring story. but like she says, it was textbook perfect. we all dont have it run as smooth as that. but i beleive subs were the answer for me to get off over 25 years of drug abuse and addiction.

    you can do it mate. you are doing your homework. read a lot. and dont be a hog when you first start. be patient and wait it out. it will be better for you in the end...

    go for it.
    Strong Desire likes this.

  26. #26
    Strong Desire is offline Advanced Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Strong Desire View Post
    Hi Rob,

    Like I told you I used Robert's sub therapy plan and I was on the sub for a total of 35 days, or exactly 5 weeks. But you have to understand that my example was a "perfect" example of how the sub experience should go. I had absolutely zero problems or withdrawals at all. But again my experience is not what most people experience. It seems that most experience some type of symptoms.

    Karen

    Hey Rob,

    Cheeky said it exactly right, my experience was perfect, and like I said in this post to you, most everyone has some sort of symptoms.

    But I will tell you right now that I had 2 things going for me in my favor when I began. First I really wanted it bad enough. And two, I had and kept the most positive of thoughts throughout the induction and taper. The mind is a very powerful thing, and you can make yourself believe all sorts of things.

    Take your time. And like Cheeky says, if you do decide to go with the subs make sure you induct on the lowest dose possible. It makes it so much easier to get off of later! Cheeky can guide you all the way if she has the time. This girl knows her subs! She's been around here a long time and knows what she's talking about.

    I'll give you all the support I can, you know that. But it's YOU that has to want it bad enough. You're doing great. Just admitting you have an issue is a great start to getting clean. Now continue with the program you choose and see how great it is on the other side! I'll be waiting for you!

    Hugs,
    Karen

  27. #27
    Sub_Detox88 is offline Junior Member
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    I saw my general physician and he has recommended to go the sub route as he said cold turkey could be somewhat dangerous and that he has not seen many people have success tapering off of their pk of choice and stopping.

    That being said I am about to take my first dose. I have been off of opiates for 48 hours and have pretty bad w/d symptoms. What should I do if I do go into precipitated withdraw? Do I just have to deal with it, go to the hospital, take opiates to fix it - this one probably a big NO just throwing out options. Appreciate the help. I am going to follow Roberts plan.

  28. #28
    Strong Desire is offline Advanced Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sub_Detox88 View Post
    I saw my general physician and he has recommended to go the sub route as he said cold turkey could be somewhat dangerous and that he has not seen many people have success tapering off of their pk of choice and stopping.

    That being said I am about to take my first dose. I have been off of opiates for 48 hours and have pretty bad w/d symptoms. What should I do if I do go into precipitated withdraw? Do I just have to deal with it, go to the hospital, take opiates to fix it - this one probably a big NO just throwing out options. Appreciate the help. I am going to follow Roberts plan.
    You have read the sub therapy plan. The only way to lessen, or completely eliminate the chance of PW's is to make sure you use that COWS sheet and score a MINIMUM of 26. Score your symptoms accurately. You CAN do this!

    Karen

  29. #29
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    I don't know very much about subs bur I do know this...it doesn't matter how long it's been since you took opiates, or that you feel very bad...you have to score at least a 26 on the COWS worsksheet! Please score yourself accurately and if you're not at 26, wait until you are before taking the sub...the worksheet should be here on the forum...i never want to speak out of turn, or give advice I'm not capable of giving, but I've read enough here to know that if you put yourself in precipitated WD's, it will be a huge hurdle to clear! Hang tight and wait for the score...I'm sure one of the sub experts will help you out once you get to that point.

  30. #30
    Sub_Detox88 is offline Junior Member
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    So I have taken the first dose .5 mg and I hope to god I waited long enough. I was probably not a 26 but I think that I may have been masking the symptoms to truly tell. I have been going through on and off 2 day periods of opiates which may have reduced the w/d the second time due to just taking a minimum amt of opiate on saturday when I was starting to get real sick.

    I will be posting over the next several hours for guidance.

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