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Help! suboxone and dilaudid trouble
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    soundboy1 is offline Member
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    Unhappy Help! suboxone and dilaudid trouble

    So I had a mild hydro/oxy habit. I went to the Dr. and he basically gave me 90 8 mgs subs to start. I totally got screwed by a drug dealer! He had no interest in my maintenance he just gave me a bunch of narcotics and let me go wild...
    Anyway It's 6 months later and I was down to less than 1 mg a day. Pretty much almost done. Of course I messed up and took a 4 mg dilaudid last night at a xmas party... It's now 8 hours later and i feel like ????. I have 2 4 mgs and about 10 mgs of suboxone to last me until xmas is over.(Monday night we go home) What's my next move? I took the dilaudid thinking that i would just use that as my last dose. I was hoping I would wake up in the morning and all my problems would be better. My christmas miracle is not happening the way I wanted.

    tl:dr : I took dilaudid while on suboxone. What do I do next?

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    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    Quote Originally Posted by soundboy1 View Post
    So I had a mild hydro/oxy habit. I went to the Dr. and he basically gave me 90 8 mgs subs to start. I totally got screwed by a drug dealer! He had no interest in my maintenance he just gave me a bunch of narcotics and let me go wild...
    Anyway It's 6 months later and I was down to less than 1 mg a day. Pretty much almost done. Of course I messed up and took a 4 mg dilaudid last night at a xmas party... It's now 8 hours later and i feel like ????. I have 2 4 mgs and about 10 mgs of suboxone to last me until xmas is over.(Monday night we go home) What's my next move? I took the dilaudid thinking that i would just use that as my last dose. I was hoping I would wake up in the morning and all my problems would be better. My christmas miracle is not happening the way I wanted.

    tl:dr : I took dilaudid while on suboxone. What do I do next?




    The subs have a long half life (up to 72 hours or longer). You should be okay through the weekend, but DON'T TAKE ANYTHING so that I can properly re-induct you next week. You know better than to take anymore opiates. If not you don't need to be using the subs. Get some more subs first of the week and I will re-induct you right here. I've done ths for years, I know how to do it, but you have to make a commitment to do as I ask you to do and everything will work out. You have made a common mistake but it's not the end of the world. Let me know if you want my help. God bless.
    Bean222 likes this.
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

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    soundboy1 is offline Member
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    Hi Robert,
    I am so thnkful that you answered. I was hoping you would. I am willing to wait until Monday for sure. I just don't want to be in the middle of terrible w/d's tomorrow morning(1st christmas for new baby). I actually feel 100 times better since i ate a sandwich but the nausea is still there. When should I expect that I will be at my worst? I am trying to get off this stuff because Jan.2nd I take over day care for my children. Although subs don't make me feel high and actually have helped with many of my problems I would really like to be off of them forever. Before subs I was only doing this part time. Now it's a full time habit and I don't want it to be! Robert you have helped many before me and I am more than ready...
    Last edited by ddcmod; 12-24-2011 at 01:04 PM.

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    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    You will need to have some w/d before you re-induct, but it won't be anything you can't handle. Enjoy Christmas and talk to me on Monday when you get your meds. We will go from there. JUST DON'T USE in the meantime! Merry Christmas and God bless.
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

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    soundboy1 is offline Member
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    Robert, I have suboxone here. 10mgs or so. I just was on such a small dose(in my mind) that the dilaudid would have a mild effect and I could just kind of end it on the dilaudid high (i'm not that bright.) I ended up taking another 4 mg dilaudid because I was being rude and angry and that's not like me and my wife noticed. I apologize i just could not wait any longer. It's my daughter's 1st christmas and I don't want to be miserable for it. I know you said not to take opiates but i'm waiting as long as I can between doses. I don't mind suffering after 11 am tomorrow you know? But I need to be in good spirits! Happy Holidays and thanks for the support so far. It's a godsend.

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    soundboy1 is offline Member
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    So I took the other 4mg dilaudid at noon. I just took 2mgs of subs and I am praying that I don't go into full withdrawal. Everything I've read said that dilaudid pills have a much shorter half life therefore you can take subs within 12-14 hours. I waited 13. we will see how my body reacts! I just think that i may have taken more subs than I needed. I want to keep my dose low so I can kick next weekend or so... What's worse Dilaudid withdrawal or Suboxone?

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    if you jump off either at too high a dose, they both suck...

    you are doing this your way anyway, despite some advice to re induct correctly...

    and taking dilaudid while on subs,

    are you sure you want to get clean. or just get by till the next pick up...?

    seems to me to be the latter. apologies if im wrong...

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    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    Quote Originally Posted by soundboy1 View Post
    So I took the other 4mg dilaudid at noon. I just took 2mgs of subs and I am praying that I don't go into full withdrawal. Everything I've read said that dilaudid pills have a much shorter half life therefore you can take subs within 12-14 hours. I waited 13. we will see how my body reacts! I just think that i may have taken more subs than I needed. I want to keep my dose low so I can kick next weekend or so... What's worse Dilaudid withdrawal or Suboxone?


    Taking the subs too soon after taking the Dilaudid is the worst w/d. I hope your method works out for you. I know that no one here said take the subs 12 hours after the dilaudid.

    I thought we were going to do this induction together so I could help you induct at the very minimal dose so you could get this over with more quickly. I guess that I'm confused or something. Wanted to help you do this the right way. Good luck.
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    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

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    soundboy1 is offline Member
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    Robert,
    You said the wd's would not be that bad. Well I couldn't take it. I wasn't at the point of where I had to live in the bathroom but I was really close. As I said I couldn't do that to my family. I was at the in-laws and they are the nosiest people you ever met. When you go in the bathroom they ask you what you were doing in there... Anyway I could not go through full blown withdrawals in that house.

    As far as my method it worked out ok. But again I really just wanted to make it through Christmas dinner or so and actually I did good. I waited on the suboxone as long as I could. I felt like the dilaudid wore off in 3 or 4 hours and then the wd's started kicking in a few hours after that. I waited until I was nearly in the bathroom again. I ended up taking 4 mgs that night. no wd's I felt great.I took another 4mgs yesterday and then I took 3mgs today. I would really love some help but I know you are probably mad because I didn't listen. I apologize for that. I just couldn't be sick in front of my baby on her first christmas. "where's DaDa" "dopesick in hte bathroom" y'know? But I'm dead serious about getting off these subs. I was never an every day opiate user and I should never have been prescribed this drug. It's very helpful and i can see that but I got pushed into using it... I want off.

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    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    Quote Originally Posted by soundboy1 View Post
    Robert,
    You said the wd's would not be that bad. Well I couldn't take it. I wasn't at the point of where I had to live in the bathroom but I was really close. As I said I couldn't do that to my family. I was at the in-laws and they are the nosiest people you ever met. When you go in the bathroom they ask you what you were doing in there... Anyway I could not go through full blown withdrawals in that house.

    As far as my method it worked out ok. But again I really just wanted to make it through Christmas dinner or so and actually I did good. I waited on the suboxone as long as I could. I felt like the dilaudid wore off in 3 or 4 hours and then the wd's started kicking in a few hours after that. I waited until I was nearly in the bathroom again. I ended up taking 4 mgs that night. no wd's I felt great.I took another 4mgs yesterday and then I took 3mgs today. I would really love some help but I know you are probably mad because I didn't listen. I apologize for that. I just couldn't be sick in front of my baby on her first christmas. "where's DaDa" "dopesick in hte bathroom" y'know? But I'm dead serious about getting off these subs. I was never an every day opiate user and I should never have been prescribed this drug. It's very helpful and i can see that but I got pushed into using it... I want off.



    At this point the best thing to do is taper your dose by 25% every four days. You can still be successful, it will just take longer than if you did it like I asked. In a couple months you can be clean but you can't be mixing the dilaudid wih subs and EVER expect to be clean. You have to make up your mind what you want. If you want to be clean follow the 25% reduction every four days. If you want to use the dilaudid then get some and blow off the subs. But they don't go together unless a person is using subs to hold off w/d until they score dilaudid again and then it's off to the races.

    I'm not judging you. That is not my place or right to do that. Just saying it like it is. You have to make a commitment to pay the price or forget it because you can't half-do this. It's all or nothing! God bless.
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    soundboy1 is offline Member
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    Hi,
    So I was not taking offense at anythin you said Robert but another poster in this thread insinuated that I am more interested in the Dilaudid than I am in getting clean. Yes I had a moment of weakness and I immediately knew I made a mistake. I then came here to ask for help. Well the problem is that I have too much access to dilaudid,oxy's and other pharmaceutical opiates... That's how I got in this mess.
    anyway i'm back on subs yech. Sunday night I took 4mgs and also monday. Tuesday I dropped 25% to 3 mgs. so tomorrow will be my last day at 3 mgs. I want to just drop down to 2mgs. is that too much of a jump? I don't mind some w/d's. Before suboxone I never experienced withdrawal like this.

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    soundboy1 is offline Member
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    So Robert thanks for the support. I'm glad someone out there cares it really means a lot. I didn't tell my wife about the suboxone treatment because she barely knows about the oxy's and dilaudid... So of course she found my script and is understandably upset. Her brother is into >>>>>> pretty bad and she freaked when she saw the bottle. He had been on it before to no effect... So she is somewhat happy that I am attempting to get clean but overall is not very happy with me. So we have some issues right now. She's also really pissed at my dr's and is very confused how they could prescribe it to me when I wasn't in full withdrawal or high when I went to the Dr. Do you think the dr holds any fault in this? I mean obviously I'm the user so it's my fault but the dr. carries no fault? What's your take on that?

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    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    soundboy .... Absolutely some drs can have a partial guilt in getting us addicted to different drugs. There is an old saying in recovery circles that while we are not always responsible for our addiction, we ARE responsible for our own recovery. Perhaps we got addicted due to injury or illness, but we only get clean by making up our minds to follow through with the doing next right thing.

    There will always be temptations with drugs being available. I've always said that you could drop me off on a country road on foot that I've never been on before and I could find drugs by noon if I wanted them badly enough. We have to make up our minds that we are NOT going to use no matter what or we are wasting our time. This isn't something we can do half-heartedly. It's hard enough being totally committed, but when we let others lure us in to using we are beat before we start. I am not judging, I am just explaining the severity of this problem and that it will always exist. So you need to get control of your emotions and not allow others to affect your better judgement.

    So many people come and go around here coming on saying they are going to get clean and then they simply disappear without even a goodbye and it's usually because they went back to using. So the comments made questioning your sincere commitment were meant to be taken in that context. Everyone here is behind you wanting you to be successful. It's just that those of us that have been down this road for several decades tend to tell it like it is and sometimes people get their feelings hurt. Take criticisms in the way they were intended, only meaning to help you however blunt they may seem to be.

    You can drop your dose as rapidly as you choose. The suggstion to reduce by 25% every four days is what has proven to be the least painful method while maintaining a good steady titration down. If you are asking me, I would stick to what has been proven to work the best. You'll find those that follow the program have very few problems. Hope that helps. God bless.
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

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    soundboy1 is offline Member
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    Well the reason i dropped to 2mgsi from 3mgs is because i have a really hard time figuring out how to measure a 12th of a milligram. I wont go back to that dr so all i have is 8mg pills.
    As far as sobriety goes suboxone is the worst most painful addiction ive had. I hate it and its ruining my life. So im really not buying into the whole suboxone as a cure thing. Its just a substitute.. and again Robert i was not mad at you. You have been great to everyone on this board. Its just frustrating when you come to a place of knowledge and you have to deal with trolls. But its worth it for the support im getting from you. Thanks again and Happy New Year!

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    soundboy1 is offline Member
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    Suboxone has been very effective in reducing my alcohol habit. I had a bit too much champagne last night though and I felt terrible in the morning. But I didn't take any other drugs which I was a bit nervous about. My will power has been fine through this whole thing except the one mess up with the dilaudid. The holidays have always been tough on me and that was when I would party the most... So I just thought i would give an update... Peace and Happy New Year!

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    I could use some advice in how to come up with some of the more obscure measurements you need to take as you get to a very low dose. For instance my last taper was from 3mgs. so that means my next dose should be 2.25 mgs. split that in half and you have 1.12 mgs.... And that one is easier than most!.

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    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    Quote Originally Posted by soundboy1 View Post
    I could use some advice in how to come up with some of the more obscure measurements you need to take as you get to a very low dose. For instance my last taper was from 3mgs. so that means my next dose should be 2.25 mgs. split that in half and you have 1.12 mgs.... And that one is easier than most!.



    You can use a single-edged razor and get it as close as you can eyeballing it. Once you get to 2mg pieces it's pretty easy to get close enough for our purposes. You can round it off on really strange numbers. God bless.
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

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    Soundboy,

    I am nearly done with my tapper. Went down to .50mg, .25 in the morning and will take .25mg tonight. This was not my first attempt mind you and I bounced back and forth between sub and using a few times. I must confess I was the problem with that. Part of me wanted to get clean but only when my pills were all gone and I was feeling down about my addiction. Would try a sub tapper that was always doomed to fail, either dropping to quickly or speeding through the process. But at the same time in the back of my mind I wasn't giving it 100% and part of me wasn't ready to get clean. Of course I would bang around on other forums talking the quit talk, saying the right things, etc. And then when it was new script time, my Dark Passenger would tap me on the shoulder and I would walk away with him, vanishing from those forums just like Robert said happens. And all the guilt would fill me every time I failed. But it was my responsibility and I think I have gotten to the bottom of "me" for once.

    I didn't like "me" prior to becoming an addict. I didn't like I was a nervous person with an anxiety issue. I didn't like how I thought people saw me. Opiates made all those feelings go away. But in the long run it made everything much worse. I have forgiven myself finally for becoming what I had become and the people I hurt in the process. It really can be a scary thing to truly face what we may have done to our loved ones and ourselves. It can cause a lot of anxiety to be honest with ones self.

    I have learned to like myself. I'm not a bad guy even thou I did bad things to people I love. And I have learned I can't control what people think of me nor do I care. What matters is how I see "me". Everything is seeming to fall back into place.

    I am not saying all this is "you". Nor am I judging you, that's not my place nor do I have the right to do so. I'm not calling you a liar either. I am NOT clean yet, still in my sub tapper and I know this journey is far from over. Pain pills aren't going anywhere and its amazing how just in the normal course of life they cross our paths and a lot of the times we aren't even trying to score. I use to make excuses "oh how can I quit when I always run into them" or "those damn stupid doctors". The truth is those circumstances will never be gone. Sure we can avoid them the best we can but pain pills aren't going anywhere anytime soon. What needs to go somewhere else is the way we see ourselves and where it takes us.

    Sorry for the long babble and I hope you are successful in your quest, I hope everyone is. I wouldn't wish this life of hell on anyone. Once last thing I also noticed about myself is that during my active addiction, I stepped away from god. I even thought he packed his bags and left me on my own. That's not the case. He was always there but was waiting for me to help myself. I'm not pushing religion on to you but if you have ever spoke to god prior to addiction there's no reason you can't now. Good luck to you and I hope peace finds you.
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    soundboy1 is offline Member
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    Peace to you and everyone else as well... I guess I am doing some finger pointing when in the end it's me who chooses what enters my temple. I wonder though the prescriptions you talk about? are they suboxone scripts or pain pills? The pain pills in my house are just there and they are not going anywhere. But like Robert said he can be dropped off in the desert and 4 hours later be getting high....
    the suboxone pills though. those are mine. I haven't filled a script since october and if I finish my taper I will have a bunch left over. my buddy and i are going to flush them or something....only problem is I wish they were 2mg pills.

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    oh but seriously I seeked out suboxone because I wanted to get high. Stupid stupid me. I messed up. I only blame the Dr. because I feel it was unethical to offer the drug to someone who wasn't in withdrawal or high. I went in as a drug seeker. Only because my many tries for oxy did not work.

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    Sorry for the many replies but I don't really do religion besides daoism....which is not a religion per se...

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    soundboy1 is offline Member
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    Reporting back in here... I am down to 1.5 mgs a day. I'm finding that 4 days is not quite long enough. I get sick the night of the third day which lasts usually 36 hours... Anyway tonight I am so sick. Puking my guts up. yech. My next taper is supposed to be tomorrow but I don't know if I can go down. I feel bad tonight...ugh
    Last edited by ddcmod; 01-10-2012 at 11:33 PM.

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    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    Stay at your current dose another day. Don't reduce while having the symptoms you describe.
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    Feeling better tonight. Moving to 1.12 mgs tomorrow. My wife is on board and that's a big help. She thought I was being shady(I was) Once I let her know the deal she was more receptive. She's just pissed that I hid my pill problems from her for so many years. Well we've been through a lot and we will weather this storm as well...
    Oh and Thanks Robert! You are always there when I need you and It's most appreciated...

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    So I forgot the main reason I came which was to ask... Is it safe to take suboxone and theraflu(nighttime)? I can't find any in the drug interaction checkers but I figure that you guys know best...

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    Ok so here's my latest update. First of all I've been a stay at home dad for two weeks and it's been great! I tapered to 1.12 on Friday and felt ok all day. I woke up the next day at 7 30 am with terrible stomach problems. Not going into details... so lucky my wife was home on Saturday morning to watch the baby. That would have been a problem.

    I was pretty much nauseous all yesterday afternoon but no bathroom trips... my attitude totally sucked though. I was a miserable prick...my mother od'ed on xanax and booze last weekend and we have been having a lot of problems with her so I am really in a foul mood anyway....

    I woke up today feeling chipper though. I think I figured out a good way to take the 1.12 measurement wise. And the stuff with my mom will never change I mean she's always been that way as long as I can remember.
    Robert if you are reading is it possible that 4 days isn't enough time for me? I seem to have a w/d episode within 24-36 hours of tapering. so basically i'm waiting to taper I wait until I feel ok. Is that what I'm supposed to be doing?
    once again thanks everyone!

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    This 1.12 thing is totally screwing with me. I thought I had it but then I realized i took like 80 % of it in the morning. So for my night time i took 20% of that... It may not mess with me but who knows? I was in a pretty bad mood all day but I got some bad news. Nothing earth shattering but depressing all the same...
    I'm due to taper to .84 tomorrow! Getting excited because I'm getting closer! If I wake up sick though I will probably hold off until I feel better. The last few days at 1.12 have been pretty smooth except my bad attitude... I know I'm getting ahead of myself but I wonder about the jump?
    Peace out Cub scout

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    ok so I really could not figure out how to take .84 correctly. So i upped my dose to 1mg .5 half a day.... that was two days ago. I woke up this morning with terrible withdrawals. puking dry heaving and diahrrea. I took my meds. will this go away? I can barely move withouth intense nausea

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    I have to find a new doctor in the NY area to help me with this final little bit. I'm just floating at this 1 mg point it seems. When I first posted here I was at 1 mg. until I messed up at Christmas and began this post. But one of the reasons I screwed up then was that I was getting really sick when I would take less than 1mg...
    I will not be on this stuff the rest of my life and if that means I need 5 days or more to clean it out than I will have to do it. I would prefer to do it the right way though so I'm going to have to find a substance abuse counselor who can help with the dosage. I have enough meds to get through(30 or more 8 mg pills) My insurance will not cover subs so I am not able to pay another copay. Anyone else have this problem? Anyone got any ideas? Thanks!

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    So im at 1 mg a day right now. Im scared to go below that because previously. I've gotten reallybsivery sick when i tried that. First few days were fine but that third day is a killer. I need 2mgto pills.

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