| || |
8th day off suboxone...
i made a very long post before explaining everything and i think it was deleted because i may have put it in the wrong forum.. bottomline, i was a pill popper and i stopped when i started suboxone last year.. my family caught me taking it last sunday and there was a meltdown at my house when they realized that i was still depending on something everyday.. they wanted me to go to rehab.. i told them that i could stop no problem just give me one chance to do it, if i cant i will go to rehab..i really didnt think it was a big deal that i was taking it, but now that i stopped i realized how bad it really was..
the first day was a joke and i actually laughed because it was so easy.. the following days things got much worse because as i learned it stays in your system for a while... and because my friend supplied me and not a doctor i didnt even know that this was opiat based.. i thought it was a receptor blocker.. its been pretty horrible but no where near as bad as pill withdrawl was.. after the fourth or fifth day it became bearable but still no fun.. the worst part is not being able to sleep with feet tingling.. its driving me crazy... but overall i feel much more clear headed.. im realizing that the medicine was doing somehting to me that wasnt good...
i was taking a low dose even though my friend gave me 8/2mg and told me to take a quarter a day i probably took 1mg throughout the day for the last year.. like half a mg in the morning and at night.. i cut it into tiny pieces (sublingual tab)
how much longer until this finally really subsides? i mean its not that bad but its not comfortable either.. i just want to feel normal and move on..
if anyone is curious what helps the WD, tons of advil and lots of liquids helped me.. over the counter sleeping pills made it a bit easier to sleep and i recommend to stay away from alcohol... exercise helps too.. uplifting music in the car is great... i have been listening to a lot of queen instead of my normal nirvana lol... and finally i have been taking tons of baths.. a hot bath when you start getting real anxious or tingly helps immensly in my opinion.. play a game on your phone while you are in there or read a book.. i have probably taken 25 baths over the past week lol
if anyone has any other methods to make this a bit easier let me know please
hey...mike? lol i'm guessing is ur name..
just wanted to stop by and welcome u!
i noticed ur post..and that no-one had responded..
so ..guess ur stuck with my 2 cents
i'm sorry that u had to stop taking the subs so suddenly,as opposed to a taper..but no worries. this wont kill u..
you're pretty much doing everything that i did to help me..except for one biggie..exercise!
the uplifting music?! ur emotions are coming back my friend! awesome right?!
and ummm...i'm not gonna lie to u...this is going to take a month..maybe a little longer..until u start feeling 100% (keep in mind, i'm saying 100%...the percentage of how good u feel WILL be growing before that)
just because most ppl taper down quite a bit more than that..and being on them a yr..ur considered a long time user.. but it's nothing u can't handle! the symptoms are just more of a nuisance than anything.. they're not going to get any worse! they'll just get better and better gradually.. until one day u turn around..and they're gone!
i would HIGHLY suggest getting to an NA meeting though! i can honestly say that without the mtgs i attend..well i don't know if i'd have not only been ABLE to stay clean..but had the DESIRE to stay clean.
i'm 47 days clean from subs myself...and i feel AMAZING! not only physically..but mentally too!
i can PROMISE you that every day will just keep getting better..if u let it.
DONT USE! get a good support group into place..
you're going to NEED to talk about this transition..esp if u want to stay clean..
in meetings they refer to "ppl, places and things"...(from ur past that will trigger using)...stay away from them
LOL! i feel like there's so much i want to say to u..but i'm realizing that this is probably overwhelming..
let's just start with the basics...
exercise helped me with the physical..
a support group helped with the rest..
do u have one in place?
why would you think my name is mike? jk lol
i really appreciate your response, i welcome all the advice you want to give overwhelming or not! i ran today and lifted weights and i gotta say i feel better already, that is great advice thank you.. i really have no desire to go back to it at all.. i feel mentally i have been done with it all for over a year now.. my life has changed a lot and the crowd i used to be around isnt there anymore.. im afraid if i go to a meeting i will begin overthinking this too much..
do you think a support group is a good idea for me? im a little worried..
i gotta say you made me feel SO much better I LOVE YOU!!!! thanks so much
one more question.. the days havent been too bad, but i really cant sleep at all.. i get only like 3 hours of sleep a night.. when will that pass? thats what i really wanna know.. i know u said everything will be normal in a month but will my ability to sleep comfortably come back before that?
Originally Posted by MikeMikeMikeMike
I wanted to stop by and introduce myself. I see that you have met my good friend Toni. She is really awesome and full of laughter! And she knows her stuff too! And even better, she is clean!
I have heard over and over here that those sleep issues you mention are really difficult to improve upon. Lots of others say the very same thing as you do. But I myself have had no problems of ANY kind and that is the truth! No withdrawals, no sleep problems, and no symptoms of any kind! Maybe I am one of the few in this class, but I would like to believe that it is because I did ALL the right things. Not saying you didn't of course, only reporting what happened in my particular case.
I was recently inducted and tapered from the subs. I inducted at only 1.7mg's and this is my 2nd day clean and I feel great! Hope you can to real soon!
I have read here also that those sleep problems are the very last thing to return to normal, but the good news is, that they will get much better for you. It simply takes time. You used the drugs for quite some time, and you just can't expect to get better instantly. It will take some time. But all the exercise you can do, or get will certainly help. That and maybe a natural sleep aid like Sleepy Time Tea, or Melatonin will help you as it has others here? And a hot bath at bedtime will do wonders to relax you for bedtime.
So it's nice to meet you and hope your symptoms improve real soon. I'm sure they will with a little more time. Just take it a day at a time and treat the symptoms that are happening right then. You will get through it. You are actually doing fine right now. You seem to want it bad enough and that is really the toughest part....the "want to" or will to improve yourself. Take care and have a great evening!
oh my gosh..i felt like an idiot for a brief second until i realized u were kidding about ur name..
i'm not going to sugar coat..they say that ur sleep is the last thing to come back...
but there ARE things u can do to make urself more comfortable in the mean time..
melatonin. get some. i got it from GNC. it worked wonders for me.
i really didn't have TOO much of an issue with my sleep...
but i would try and wear myself out during the day..seems like ur doing that too..so that's GREAT! i can't emphasize that enough..
and i would take a cpl melatonin at night..
and then i would take a HOT bath (cuz i would get rls too) ..but i would sit in the tub while it filled via the shower head and let the hot water run onto my legs into epsom salt filled water. (just a tip if ur getting the rls too?)...
my sleep was always interrupted for about an hr mid-night for a while..but i..thankfully! would get atleast 5-7 hrs total.
i think it took about two wks until my sleep was rarely interrupted..and i started sleeping 8 hrs..
but yeah..i definitely think that a support group would be ideal.
how about u check out a mtg?! rarely has someone..who's gone in with an open mind..come out of a meeting regretting their time spent.
if not..u can use this forum as a support group..
who do u have around u offering u support?
at the end of the day..we ARE going to come across temptations..and we ARE going have bad days/emotions that are going to make us want to use..
i don't know about u..but i'm having to re-learn life skills. ..coping skills.
i don't know how to go through feeling anger...hurt...pain..without thinking of/wanting to use.
right now..detox is fresh in ur head. so it's easy to think that u'll nvr go bk to that life again.
but complacency sets in after a while..
and it's how we learn to deal with life on life's terms ...and how we learn to deal with emotions..and the support group that we have set in place..someone to call and talk to about how we're feeling..or the want to use etc..that's going to help us prevail..and that's going to help us STAY sober.
basically..the things that u have set into place for WHEN ur addiction starts whispering into ur ear..
as an addict..u don't lose ur addiction. just because u put the drugs down..doesn't mean ur addiction's not there...in fact...it's doing push ups right beside u.
WHAT HAS HELPED ME.. is NA...
it gave me ppl i know i can relate to..and hence ppl i can call..
it gave me accountability for my actions.. (as addicts..we lie about our using. FACT. i i don't know if i would be able to walk in there and lie to all of these people, right in front of their face)
but more importantly..i could do just that...and they would just tell me to keep coming back.
the love and support i get from these ppl is limitless.
and don't get me wrong..i didn't get it right away either. just listened..and 'kept going bk'..just brought my body and my mind eventually followed..as they would say.
so lol don't be worried..oh my gosh..i had the WORST anxiety about going somewhere new. heck..about the unknown in general. but it worked out just fine for me. i can proudly say that 99%of the ppl i surround myself with now are recovering addcits/alcoholics. best ppl i know.
anyways...bit of a rant there.
but yeah.. check it out?
does ur family know about what ur going through? who do u have.. that ur close with, that u can u would consider 'supporting' u through this?
cuz. .i know we like to think we can..and i've tried it many a times myself..but we can't do this alone...
Last edited by toni.s.; 07-17-2012 at 09:12 PM.
You're right about the new people Toni. I do feel like I have been here a while and it's barely been over a month! Your advice/suggestions to Mike were right on the money. Hope he understands how important those meetings are!
Originally Posted by toni.s.
Mike.....I knew that my way of trying to get clean just was NOT working at all. So I had to do something different ths time if I really wanted to succeed. And I did. But getting clean is really the easy part....it's STAYING clean that is so much tougher, and the most important thing you will ever do for yourself!
You need EVERY advantage that you can get and the NA, AA, or CR meetings will give that to you. I was afraid to go also. I was fearful that I might see someone that knew me. But I thought what the heck, I will know that they are there also! So away I went.
And I can honestly tell you right now that I LOVE to go everyday! I go real early...at 6-6:30 am. I have a great sponsor that guides me and stays committed to my goal of staying clean. I look forward to going to every single meeting and will never miss one if I have anything to say about it. You will find so many others with the same exact issues as you have. You will meet so many new friends there. Good friends too! Friends that care about you like no one else will because they know what you are going through, and what it takes to get and remain clean!
So I would STRONGLY suggest that you at least check out one meeting in your area. They are everywhere. And if you go and don't like it for some reason, then find another one to attend. I didn't enjoy my first meeting at all and found another on my 2nd attempt. That one is well suited for my particular needs. The people are awesome! Up to you my friend. How bad do you really want it????
I've only been a member since last month and was wondering how does member status work. I chose you to ask because you are constantly posting, but more so your membership states(Senior) but your profile list you joining last month. I've looked at numerous of other members with a Senior status and they joined almost 3yrs ago.
Is a member status determine by the amount of post, education background, knowledge of a drug, etc..
If a member status wasn't important drug.com wouldn't assign one. So when I see "Senior" or "Platinum" as Roberts membership states, I think, advance, been around the block, knowledgeable, or even length of time, but your Senior status reflects none of these. Drug.com might have possible given you an incorrect membership date?
I have read numerous post of your's and can say your truly encouraging and immensely positive. They might have awarded you Senior on that alone. (:
Look forward to reading more of your positive post..
It depends on the number of posts. The more posts you have made then the greater the status. I think to become a Senior member you need to have over 400-500 posts.
Thanks Murphy that makes sense. StrongDesire does have a lot of post, case in point, you joined 2004 and listed as a Junior posting only 37 within that time.
Quality, not quantity :-)
thank you so much for the post karen.. today was great but its 4:39am right now and i CANT sleep.. i feel like i am starting to go crazy! i was starting to get a bad panic attack and i signed on here and your post really helped me thanks so much for caring
Originally Posted by CRYintheNIGHT
Well.....what a nice thing to say about me! Can't tell you how much I appreciate you saying that! How cool to know that my words have affected someone in that manner!
About the posts. Yes, I do post quite often. But I wanted my thread to become like a journal, or kind of my "diary" about what I went through when going through the sub induction and taper. And of course the more involved I got, the more many members here posted to me and offered suggestions, advice, and many words of wisdom.
I felt it necessary to answer every post on an individual basis. So thus the reason for so many posts right now. But I do expect it to slow down a bit now as I am heavily involved in NA and my desire to REMAIN clean! That's the real work part to all of this you know. I've gotten clean so many times, but always relapsed because I didn't ever have a support system in place. But I do now through NA and I am really going to do it this time!
Concerning membership status....MURPHY has it correct. The more posts you have, the higher your membership status grows. And mine did rise quickly. But in no way am I more knowledgeable than many with the same number of posts! No way! Many have years of clean time, but simply do not post for one reason or another. They are living their lives to the fullest is my guess. But I am so new here and want to learn as much as possible so I ask many questions, and try to meet new people all the time. I reach out to as many as I possibly can. But that certainly doesn't mean my knowledge of this addiction business is more than anyone else's as I said. In fact I'm a baby as far as knowledge goes right now. I just simply have quite a few posts considering my time here.
MURPHY said it right again.....it's the QUALITY of the posts, not the QUANTITY! And the membership status rises as your number of posts doubles after a certain amount. So to get to the "senior" level you must have 500 posts. Then the next level is the "advanced member" level, and that takes 1000 posts. Then the next level is "platinum" and that will take 2000 posts, then 4000, then 8,0000 and etc, etc, Robert has OVER 16,000 posts and that boggles my mind! He has LIVED on this forum at times! Hope that helps!
Thank you again so much for the very kind words. Means so much to me really. You take care of yourself and I'll talk to you again real soon I'm sure. Blessings to you always.
I was taking about the same amount you were when I stopped and to be honest the sleep thing is the last thing to get better. My experience was that each day got better and better just a bit until before I knew it I was getting more sleep. I was low energy, heavy achey legs as well for awhile and that hypersensitivity is definitely no fun. I think everyone has the same question "When is this going to end, or when will I feel normal again". For me I felt about 85% at 2 weeks and by 3 weeks I was sleeping mostly normal and feeling great. I'm 7 weeks removed from any type of substances now and I don't even think about it much anymore.
What helped me immensely was working the 12 steps with a sponsor and going to meetings. I "stopped" using at least 15 times but I always went back. Once I felt like "I got this" for some reason I would always go back. That some reason is the fact that addicts have a mental obsession that leads them back to drugs and or alcohol and once we pick it up a physical craving sets in and we're done.
You'll probably be back to almost 100% between 14-21 days but each day gets easier after those first few.
Stopping is easy compared to staying stopped. Support groups or any type of support is indispensible. I for one failed for 15 years to stay stopped for more than a few months without help. We need the help of others. Many, I dare say most addicts are like that.
Good luck man, you're past the worst of it and it will only get easier. Keep busy, exercise if you can and eat healthy.
About 6 weeks ago I started tapering off my suboxone. I was at 6 mg. per day, and I dropped small amounts (about 1 mg. every ten days). Now I am starting to wonder if I should quit at all. I have experienced minor wd symptoms (usually 2-3 days after dropping my dosage), and I expect a whole lot worse when I drop to zero. My biggest reason for stopping the subs is money. Other than that (and a few unpleasant side effects) I am doing very well with the medication and I feel it has improved my life in many important ways. I am starting a full time internship in less than a month and graduating college in December. My plan was to stop the meds completely about ten days before my internship starts so that I can get over the worst symptoms. In addition to my internship, I have a three year old daughter that demands constant attention. I am becoming more and more anxious about quitting subs now. I can't be sick in bed for two or three weeks while my body gets used to the taper. The symptoms I have now are bad enough and I haven't even stopped yet. In the morning before I take my sub my body is achy and I have cold sweats. I wonder if it would be better to wait until after graduation to quit altogether. In my mind, I feel like I could spend less money by taking less than I did before. Now that my dose is so low, I feel like I would do fine taking 2 mg. instead of the former 6 and pay a third of what I did before on meds. I need help. What do I do? And please don't just tell me "it will be okay" or "you'll be fine" because I know that, eventually, the wd symptoms subside. I am just worried about the change in general and I don't want to go back in time and be the person I was before I started subs. Thanks to anyone who reads this. And thanks in advance if you have any words of advice.
Hello and welcome to the forum. The reason you have been feeling those symproms after each drop is because you have been reducing by too much sub! It is an extremely strong and powerful medication and must be reduced slowly. I'm going to give you the link to the sub therapy program that is used by most people here. Basically you reduce your dose by 25% every 4 days or so. And you have been reducing by 1mg and that is just far too much of a reduction. Take a look at the plan and pay attention to the "taper" section. It explains everything is complete detail. If you still have questions after reading post again and someone, maybe me, will get right back to you with offers of help. So here you go and again welcome. Hope this helps. Have a great evening.
Originally Posted by newmama
Suboxone/Subutex Induction and Taper Plan
Thanks for the response and the info. You're probably right about my tapering too quickly. I have already dropped to 1 mg. per day, but I'll try to reduce to .5 mg. before quitting completely. The tapering, I feel, has been a piece of cake compared to what I expect when my dose drops to zero. That is what I am afraid of. Right now, I feel bad in the morning but at least I have a small dose to give me relief for the rest of the day. Not having anything is what scares me. I am craving suboxone, honestly. I never thought I would say that
Last edited by ddcmod; 07-21-2012 at 04:54 PM.
Ok, firstly good job OP toughing it out, it ain't easy. If your dose was really 1mg a day you should be nearing the end of any wd. Suboxone is a bastard for hanging around & making life miserable, you need to taper off if at all possible. Trust me, I once went 7 days jumping off 4mg & realised I just couldn't do it. I had to get back to work & life. But 1mg shouldn't be anywhere near as bad.
I suggest checking out this guide.
This is how I'll be ending my 11 year dependence on this drug.
As Robert_325 says, it's not something you wanna be stuck on for years and years, the side effects are very subtle but it definitely takes away certain normal impulses & desires. I find I look back & realize my creative side has been completely extinguished by this drug, it saved my life don't get me wrong, I was a terrible mess addicted to alcohol, meth, heroin, & using as much coke, lsd, ex as I could afford, which was a bit. Without subutex then suboxone I wouldn't be here, I was totally at the end of my rope, I tried everything, being alcoholic & opiate dependent is a special hell reserved for the worst of us, nothing could stop my drinking before subutex. But I've been complacent in attempting to get off. I urge you all to not do this. get stable, then do the reduction & get off.
Here's the guide.
as long as you go slowly and taper off, you can get down to zero by using subs. also, its better to get off slowly as long as you get off... take your time. i know the feeling of being worried about having ''nothing''' but seriously, its so good when you get thru that and you are FREE. ive used for 25plus years, and i so enjoy not being chained to a 'dose' of some sort or another.
Originally Posted by newmama
hang in there and get thru this. taper as low as you possibly can. some people skip days at the end, some of us just taper to zero. it depends how you feel.
good luck and go for it
hey toni, sorry i havent been on lately.. i just try not to think about it.. but i think the worst is over.. this is day 17 and i still dont feel great.. ick.. im going to see a doctor in a few days hopefully he helps me.. sleep still hard.. and bathroom stuff still hasnt changed.. im having trouble working still.. i hope i just snap out of it soon
Originally Posted by toni.s.
17 days?! that's great!
i know it sux right now..but u've made it so far!
i PROMISE u that it gets better..
why are u going to the doctor? helps u with what?!
don't like the sound of that...
Me neither. Doctors are notorious for making things worse. Are you taking vits? Exersizing? Watching your diet? Trying anything like Melatonin for sleep?
Originally Posted by toni.s.
COMPLETELY CLEAN (Sub FREE) as of 7/20/12
"I don't like the drugs, but the drugs LIKE ME" Marilyn Manson