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Short Suboxone Taper
  1. #1
    garysremodel1 Guest

    Post Short Suboxone Taper

    Howdy,

    The long and short of it: Started taking Hydro one year ago for three bulging disc's(L-2,3 & 4), and spinal arthritis.
    Fast forward one year later, was taking 8-10 Lortabs per day. I had tried and tried to taper off hydro five or six, or seven, or eight times. Tried cold turkey once about a month ago. It lasted approx. 23 hours before I was ready to jump out of my skin and out the $@#&!ng% window! I cannot take the hydro habit anymore. I was C & S for 14 years until I stupidly got behind these damned pills. I know quite a bit about AA/NA/and sobriety's 12 step programs. I know that quitting this ******** is only the beginning. The hardest part is staying off of it .
    Out of shear desperation, I saw a Sub Doc a week ago. He's got me on way too much Bupe (16mg per day). He plans on keeping me on that dose for at least two months! I have already lowered my own dose to 8mg as of today, which is day 6. There is NO WAY that I am gonna stay on this for 3 or 4 months. I want to be clean and sober once again. I do NOT want to trade one drug for another! I have had it with having a damn pill control my life. I also realize that even if I do have a screwed up back, I chose to abuse my medication. Nobody forced me to. The problem is me, not hydro.
    My question is this: Can I taper down to under 4mg and lower without using a benzo for anxiety? I do not particularly like benzo's at all , but I have heard that that they are almost a must if you plan on tapering off this stuff quickly. My Sub Doc plans on prescribing me Klonopin once I start HIS taper two months from now. I ain't waitin' that long. I'll put up with the ********py dope sickness for a week or two if I have to. I really need to get an opinion on the benzo thing. Will it help me, or hurt me? I realize that they are addicting too (what isn't?), but I do not see myself getting hooked on a benzo if I only have to take it for a week or two. I prefer it if I didn't have to use it at all, if you wanna know the truth.
    I see that Robert is very knowledgeable about these things. I am sure that there are others on this board that are also in tune with the taper plan. I have read about people being on Sub for 4,6,8,& 12 months! I've also read about people being on it for 3 or 4 years?! WTF!!?
    Hey, I know that W/D's suck, but from what I have read, the sooner I get off this stuff, the better. I plan on tapering down to 4 mg within the next two weeks at the most. Is that too fast?.....too slow?.......
    From all that I have read, a person either gets off Bupe within a month, or they just ride the Sub Train until the wheels fall off.
    Any help/suggestions/feedback would be totally appreciated. Thanks.

    Gary

  2. #2
    bev49 is offline Banned
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    Robert is definitely the one to talk to but I can tell you, in my opinion doctors overprescribe this stuff. I started on 16 also, couldn't sleep at all and lowered myself down to 8 then 4 then 2 then 1 within about 4 weeks. I don't say everyone can or should do that but I felt better on the lower dose. The general wisdom is don't mix benzo's with sub but I do take 1/2 of a 1 mgs. clonopine at night for sleep. It was originally prescribed for panic attacks. Higher doses of benzos are no advised.

  3. #3
    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    Gary ... I will be happy to help you with the subs. It's about a six week to eight week deal if done right with little or no discomfort. Let me know if you want my help. All I ask is that you follow my instructions. They work. Here is a link showing how I suggest using subs. Let me know. God bless.

    http://www.drugs.com/forum/featured-...apy-50887.html
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

  4. #4
    garysremodel1 Guest

    Default Yes, I'd like your help.

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert_325 View Post
    Gary ... I will be happy to help you with the subs. It's about a six week to eight week deal if done right with little or no discomfort. Let me know if you want my help. All I ask is that you follow my instructions. They work. Here is a link showing how I suggest using subs. Let me know. God bless.

    http://www.drugs.com/forum/featured-...apy-50887.html
    Robert,
    Yes, I would appreciate your vast knowledge in this matter. I read your Suboxone/Subutex therapy post , and it seems very informative. Please let me know if there are any other instructions that you have.
    Sub has worked miracles for the hydro withdrawal. But it seems like a lot of people use this drug for way too long as a crutch, so that they don't have to
    finally endure the W/D's. I don't want to be one of those people.

    Thanks,

    Gary

  5. #5
    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    You shouldn't need any benzos if you do this like I ask you to. If you do we'll determine that later. I wouldn't go ahead and plan on it though. I always like to expect the best results.

    Stay at 8mg for another three days. Let's give your original opiate detox plenty of time to be over. I don't like to start the taper until after the first week. Let's call it on Friday. Drop to 6mg on Friday taken in two 3mg doses.

    Plan on staying at 6mg Friday through Monday if all goes well as I expect it will. We'll determine over the weekend when you'll reduce again for sure. God bless.
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

  6. #6
    tired2 is offline Advanced Member
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    Hi Gary...you found the right place Robert knows what he is doing...I was put on 16mg of Subs back in March and couldn't wait to get off but now I'm finally OPIATE FREE .....Sunday was 5 weeks and I have no desire to take any pain pills...I have used pain meds for over 25yrs for pain and have been on every pain med out there...now I'm tapering off the Benzo's with Robert..
    Well you are in good hands...
    Pam
    Just to live life free as a bird

  7. #7
    garysremodel1 Guest

    Default Thanks!

    Thanks Robert. Thanks also to you" tired2". Thats a great bit of support knowing that you were on pain killers for 25yrs, and are now opiate free!
    Damn good job!

  8. #8
    tired2 is offline Advanced Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by garysremodel1 View Post
    Thanks Robert. Thanks also to you" tired2". Thats a great bit of support knowing that you were on pain killers for 25yrs, and are now opiate free!
    Damn good job!
    Thanks Gary and it is possible and I'm proof...I'm sure you will also be free from opiates just stick with Robert and you will make it...
    I have suffered from chronic back pain and had surgery on L 2-3 and L 3-4 and have couple herniated disc which is mostly how I got hooked on pain pills but I'm so done and now I just want off the benzo's then I will finally be free of all pills and those Damn doctors...I never want to see a pill again after I get thru my last taper which is the benzo's.
    Pam
    Just to live life free as a bird

  9. #9
    garysremodel1 Guest

    Default Taper On Down The Road.

    Well, its day 8, and I have tapered down from 16mg to 6mg. I feel much better than I did just a few days ago at 12mg. I KNEW that this Sub Doc that I have was starting me out on WAY to much Sub! I was even getting a little high off of it at first. Kind of like a sleepy semi-coma kinda thing, so I know that it must have been too high. And to think that some people start out on 32mg,....WTF?!
    Anyway to Robert, if you are reading this post, I am down to 6mg as you instructed. You said that over the weekend you will give me a scheduled taper schedule. When your ready, I'm ready, me amigo.

    Gary

  10. #10
    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    Quote Originally Posted by garysremodel1 View Post
    Well, its day 8, and I have tapered down from 16mg to 6mg. I feel much better than I did just a few days ago at 12mg. I KNEW that this Sub Doc that I have was starting me out on WAY to much Sub! I was even getting a little high off of it at first. Kind of like a sleepy semi-coma kinda thing, so I know that it must have been too high. And to think that some people start out on 32mg,....WTF?!
    Anyway to Robert, if you are reading this post, I am down to 6mg as you instructed. You said that over the weekend you will give me a scheduled taper schedule. When your ready, I'm ready, me amigo.

    Gary


    Hi Gary .... you don't have to worry. I will always see your posts here. I knew you would start feeling better once your dose was lowered some.

    It's pretty simple even from 6mg down. You'll continue to taper by 25% every four days that you don't have any w/d symptoms. You should continue to sail right through this just like you've been doing.

    If you come to a bump in the road let me know. Just continue to post regularly so I can see how you're doing. Take care. God bless.
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

  11. #11
    garysremodel1 Guest

    Default Down to 4mg a day

    Well, I'm at day 14, and I have tapered down to 4mg from 16mg. a day. So far, so good. I have read that getting down to 4mg from any dose isn't that big of a deal. But tapering down 25% every third day from here on out without w/d's is "where the rubber hits the road".
    I am following Robert's taper directions to the letter, so we'll see how things go from here on out. I will be so glad to get off of this stuff. It's only been 14 days, but it seems like 14 months!. I'll post again in a few days.

    Gary

  12. #12
    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    Gary .... good job! Just stay with the 25% reduction every four days and keep us posted. You're doing well.

    Don't expect problems under 4mg. Expect the best and you'll have a better chance of it going that way. God bless.
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

  13. #13
    garysremodel1 Guest

    Default Day 17 sub taper

    Day 17 since I started Sub, and I'm down to 3mg from 16mg. I am using the taper plan that was suggested by Robert. So far, so good. In another week and a half to two weeks and I'll be done with it. I Will post again in a few days.

    Gary

  14. #14
    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    Gary .... good job buddy! Seventeen days living a new life is good I know from experience. It won't take long and you'll be done with the subs too. God bless.
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

  15. #15
    garysremodel1 Guest

    Default Day 21 of Taper

    Down to 2mg per day of Sub by following Robert's taper plan. To all out there that don't / can't believe that it can happen......believe it!
    The shorter the time on this stuff, the better. I will taper down to 1 mg in a couple of days, then its 1/2 mg, then 1/4 mg, then no mg. To all people that have just started Bupe, you CAN get off of it in little over a month if you follow Robert's taper plan. Don't stay on Sub for any longer than a month or two at the max! It makes it a lot easier to taper, when it has not been in your system for a long time. I'll give a holla in a couple of days.

    Gary

  16. #16
    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    Gary ... I received your email that you were getting ready to drop to 1.5mg. I've tried to email you with replies a couple times and for some reason they aren't getting to you. I don't know why, but wanted you to know I hadn't ignored your emails. Dropping to 1.5mg sounds perfect to me.

    It always cracks me up when I hear stories like your's from so many people. I think it's funny when patients go back to see the sub dr (who thinks this person is on 16mg indefinitely basically) and they find out you're done already and totally clean.

    Stay in touch .. keep me posted as you reduce like you've been doing. Being at 1.5mg you don't have too much longer to go and you'll be done. You've already won, now you just have to put the time in finishing off the subs. God bless.
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

  17. #17
    garysremodel1 Guest

    Default Down to 1mg

    Well, I've managed to get down to 1mg of sub in 28 days time. Two more days and I'll lower to 0.75. Amazingly, I have experienced no major withdrawals! Robert was right! I can't believe it! I must admit that I have felt very minor anxiety & lethargy from time to time, but nothing to speak of. (We are talking maybe once a day for a few minutes every other day or so) No big deal, what so ever!
    I will post again in a few days. To all that reads this, and wants to taper. Get a hold of Robert. That dude knows what he's talking about my friends.

    Take Care,

    Gary

  18. #18
    garysremodel1 Guest

    Default Down to .125mg

    I am down to .125mg and well, it is getting very interesting. I am ready to make a jump tomorrow to zero. Then do one dose the next day, then see what happens. I must admit that I am starting to feel a little lethargic, and are having some stomach issues. Nothing horrible. I've had to take a semi-sh!tload of Imodium AD's the past few days. There's some rumblin' and grumblin' going on down there. If this is the worse that it gets, or even a little bit more sh!tty, then I will not complain. I was having stomach issues when i tried to taper off hydro 20 times, so it's not unusual for this to happen .I'll post again in a few days.

  19. #19
    purpledog is offline Banned
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    Talking gary

    choice one dude, you nearly off.

    i am following along behind you, not sprinting along, but jogging, or should i say a brisk walk. anyway the point is thanks for inspiring others, wow, 28 days man you were going for it ay.

    awesome, you should be really proud of yourself.

    purpledog

  20. #20
    pattycakes is offline Member
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    Gary,
    I am so proud & happy for you for having such a resolve to be done with the subs. Robert is a blessing to us all. I have been also tapering with a little guidance from Robert. Had a minor setback due to some surgery, but, am happy to say I am down to .5 mg twice a day and will follow the tapering by 25% every 4th day. I made my doctor prescribe the 2mg subs instead of the 8mg. He is amazed that I want to be off of them. It is much easier to cut the lower dose pill. Anyway, enough about me.
    You are an inspiration to many of us I am sure. Keep it up and I look forward to your success & thanks so much for sharing. Patty
    (PS) Will get back with Robert & soon as I remember how to get to him. I'm a not so computer literate blond!

  21. #21
    bev49 is offline Banned
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    Gary, you're doing phenominally well and you should be proud of yourself. I will cross my fingers that it doesnt get any worse than grumbling belly controlled with Immodium. Guys like you inspire me to go the distance myself.

  22. #22
    garysremodel1 Guest

    Default Thanks!

    Thank you bev49 & pattycakes for the kind words.
    My last itty bitty pile of orange dust was taken almost 24 hrs ago. I might be feeling a little better, but no worse than yesterday. The stomach troubles will pass. One big thing about tapering of this stuff, if done correctly like Robert told me too, it's not that bad of a jump at all. But then, It's only been one day. If it gets any worse, I'll just hunker down & ride this sh!t out....... Literally.
    One other thing to mention is no restless leg troubles. This is huge. Every time that I tried to taper off Hydro, my left leg would drive me Nuts! Without some kind of benzo, It was impossible. Actually it was impossibly futile for me to think I could successfully taper off hydrocodone. I liked hydro, I do not like sub. So that is a big motivative factor right there. It's really easy to get "lost" on sub, and forget that you ARE taking a very powerful drug. I think many people get lured into a false sense of security with sub, and the Doctors love that, and the Pharms love that too. There was no way I was gonna stay on this for 6 months to a year, like my sub doc wanted.......Ha!
    Anyway, thanks again. I'll post again later on.

    Gary
    .



    Gary
    Last edited by garysremodel1; 08-31-2009 at 05:38 PM.

  23. #23
    Anonymous Guest

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    Hi Gary
    I hope this thread is OK to reply to your e-mail...
    Robert and I did a two week detox on me, I had to have surgery and had been clean for a year, I did not want to go thru w/d so that is why I chose to do subs...Im doing Ok...the subs helped my fibro pain so no I did not want to stop them, but new I had to or I would abuse them....Im a drug addict at heart...
    I did have some anxiety...but I tend to have that anyway.
    I hope I answered everything if not ask away...
    I have been watching your progress and I think your doing great

    Talk to you soon, Melinda

  24. #24
    garysremodel1 Guest

    Default Melinda 7.5

    Wow! You did a two week detox?! I had absolutely no idea that was possible.
    I presume Robert started you at 1 or 2mg? And started your taper immediately?
    When you have a chance, explain how you did it.

    Gary

  25. #25
    Anonymous Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by garysremodel1 View Post
    Wow! You did a two week detox?! I had absolutely no idea that was possible.
    I presume Robert started you at 1 or 2mg? And started your taper immediately?
    When you have a chance, explain how you did it.

    Gary
    Hi Gary
    yes you are right,to tell you the truth he doled out the subs and I think it was 2mg and then he played with it a bit,you will have to ask him I just told him how I felt and he said ok this is what wil do...I just went along for the ride...but it sure made it easy...
    Talk to you soon, Melinda

  26. #26
    BlackKats is offline Member
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    Default Three down & ? to go

    Day three of the end of my sub aper and I'm starting to feel better. My stomach has settled down somewhat, and I'm getting some energy back. I hear that days 7, 8, and 9 may bring up a few issues, I'm ready for it. This beats the he!! out of trying to taper off hydro. My head is clearer now than its been in over a year. So far, so good.

    Gary

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