[brndout]

Originally Posted by 13ghosts

I don’t believe in God, but finding a thread like this makes me believe in something.

I was going to start a new thread, but this seems like the place where this belongs. This is only my second post here, and I don't feel like I was completely forthright in my first one, so please let me know if I am off base by going down this road.

I read with great interest Guitarman's dilemma, because I am in much the same boat, but have not yet taken the leap. I also feel for Imdone.

Years ago I was on a discussion board for opiate addiction—not surpisingly, I cannot remember the name--it helped me to eventually get off methadone via buprenorphine, which was much discussed in the forum as a controversial cure, and then finally approved for use by the FDA. Immediately, I found a rehab and doctor that used it. After being on methadone for three years, I went through a thirty-day program (yes, in Malibu, wouldn’t you know) and I went cold turkey for almost ten days there without needing anything other than anti-seizure meds before I started finally feeling really ********py. I stunned the docs, and I was amazed too, bracing for the worst from methadone withdrawal. But I had put on a hundred pounds on methadone, so I had plenty of fat to store it away. Once the withdrawal symptoms started to raise their collective and ugly head, that’s when they started me on the bup. I stayed on it for about ten weeks, weaning down, and then stopped. I probably did this too soon, but I just wanted off the merry-go-round. I spent two weeks feeling truly deathly ill, but once I was out of the woods I felt blessed to have only the runs for the next five months. Praise Jesus, right?

Why was I on methadone? Because I had been severely addicted to vicodin and couldn’t take time off my six-figure, 60 hour a week job to help myself. Going on methadone was a lot better than running around and lying to doctors, and my life got better. But I realized I could not stay on it forever. Frankly, I was amazed I managed to get clean, but I felt great, and more importantly, was grateful. I didn't want to return to that lifestyle ever again.

Cut to three years later and I develop severe pain in my right knee, and then the left. No OTC drug alleviates the pain. I ask the doc for something NOT narcotic. He gives me ultram. It works.

Then I start reading about the ultram being just as addictive as vicodin; some say it is even harder to get off of. I get paranoid. The orthopedic surgeon who sees me for my knees is alarmed that I am taking 1 or sometimes 2 50 mg ultram a day. He tells me to get off immediately like I am some kind of junkie. At this point I had been taking it for a few months and probably could have gotten off—and just gone ahead with the surgery. But I’m working too hard and don’t relish the idea of knee surgery, so I forge ahead and decide to cut down. When I did, I felt like ********--and the pain in my knees returned. So I resigned myself to taking a few ultram a day until I could have the surgery. And I had to keep reminding myself I wasn’t a junkie at 2 ultra a day because 1) I was in pain; and 2) because I knew what being a junkie really was (more on that in a moment).

A year goes by. Then another. I am up to three, sometimes four ultram a day, and lord almighty, racked with guilt. But I am open with my partner about it, telling her that I’m neither proud nor happy about getting hooked, but it could be much worse. I think to myself, at least I am not a lying, hiding hunk of ******** (been there, done that), and am honest with partner. And I tell myself I have to be on this stuff because when I stop the pain is still there, and so is the withdrawal sickness.

Then, last fall, someone casually offers me a vicodin, and I take it. And, as they say, the rest is history. Soon I was back on vicodin, though nowhere near where I was when I was addicted before. But I started taking it along with the ultram. First a couple a day for a few days, then none for a month or two, then back on again, then off, slowly ramping up to daily use. I build up a tolerance. I want more. I complain to the doctor that neither of these drugs last long, and he gives me ms-contin. Now I am on all three at the same time.

Oh yeah, and taking a xanax or ativan almost daily after three years of using 30 every 6 months. The stress and unhappiness with the job, the economy and fear of losing it, losing the house, losing everything. Well, I have a good reason to start taking it every day, right? So I see myself on a road to nowhere, and I am driving the bus.

If you're still awake and reading this, I am now at the point where I have not taken ultram in about a month, but I am taking the vicodin (Norco, 3-6 a day) and the ms-contin (60 mg, one to two a day). And half to whole xanax or ativan almost every day. I’m really pissed about the benzos because they were going to be my ticket off the painkillers when I was at that difficult point of weaning. Now I have to come off of those first so they can be efficacious when I am truly in need.

Did I mention that I am no longer honest with my partner? She has no idea that it has come to this, though she sees all the pill bottles. And because of my past, I don’t want to tell her for fear that the worrying and pressure to stop immediately will be unbearable.

When I try to stop these drugs I am reminded that they are there to quell a real pain, but every time I do slow down, even that pain in my knees now seems dwarfed by the creeping onset of withdrawal which I have been through more than a few times in my life and, justifiably, have an intense fear of. And then there is the shame of being here again, feeling helpless, hiding it, having no one to talk to, blah blah, boo hoo. So I have my days when I overdo it. The thought of being addicted again haunts me and consumes more and more of my thoughts. Just a few years ago I had no worries like this and I thought life was great. Now I hate myself for hiding this from my family, I hate the feeling that I failed, that I am on a hamster wheel that I cannot get off of. And that I should have learned.

Of course, I can get off it. But I work like a dog--this is why I did not have the knee surgery in the first place and ended up here--and feel that I cannot let up on my performance for an instant or I will be out of a job. Part of this is paranoia, part of it is an excuse, part of it is true. Every time I try to taper, I start to feel like ********, more work piles up on my desk, and a couple of pills miraculously make me "whole" again. And all the while the voice in my head is telling me I am a complete and utter failure and cannot do this without God and steps and all that. (I was in NA/AA for four years and though I took away some good things from it, much of that indoctrination comes back to haunt me in the worst way, as religion is wont to do).

As I mentioned at the start, finding this forum, and this thread in particular, is like finding the closest thing to God for me. Suddenly, I do not feel alone. I read these painful posts, nodding my head, filled with empathy and hope. I, too, think that I can probably get back to 1 or 2 ultram a day, if I tried, and eventually down to nothing. I am always formulating an escape route in my head (get off the benzos completely, then the ms-contin, then taper the vicodin by switching back to ultram, then taper the ultram with the benefit of the benzos and then….voila!). Yes, it’s a long and circuitous route, perhaps it could work…But the voice in my head says that’s impossible, and it’s not good enough, that "half measures availed us nothing," that I don’t have the strength to do it, and so on and so on. And so I continue with even more negative behavior.

This thread has allowed me to see that the glass can be perceived as half full. I am not taking 40 (yes, 4-0) 10 mg vics a day as I did in the past. I am not on 140 mg of methadone a day. Yes, I am abusing painkillers, but I had a reason to get on them in the first place this time (in fact, my knee is throbbing as I type this, having taken 4 norco in the morning and 1 ms-contin this afternoon—a good day for me, drugwise), and it is probably that neurotic voice in my head that keeps me from going completely overboard. So I need to grateful for where I am, take a deep breath, and plan for the taper, as Swanney says, “To see me through the long night that lies ahead.” I just need to hear the familiar voices and thoughts of folks who have been through it, who are going through it, to encourage me, because I cannot go back to NA/AA (not putting it down, but it is not for me), nor can I continue on this road alone. I have quit before, coming from a much worse position, and I can do it again—and I think can do it without rehab, which I cannot afford monetarily or time-wise anyway.

I am on the edge of my seat here, and flushed with empathy for Guitarman, and Imdone, and the advice of Melinda and others. Thanks for giving me an ounce of hope, which is a start. With it, I just may be able to follow the same path some of you have taken and are taking now, just as I can get my own sh*t together.

I apologize for the long and rambling post. It all came out in single gush of pent-up anxiety. I know this probably should have been a new post, but I wanted to let all of you know how good it is to find you here….and took forward to what is in store here in the future.

U

Hi I just read your post and no it did not put me to sleep. Believe me I feel for you and can relate to what you are going through. There is definatly hope and you can do this. I am not an expert and dont feel that comfortable making suggestions but one. I would write to Robert or Musicman and see what they think about going on Subs or weaning off what you are currently on. You are right it is a long road but at least it leads somewhere.

[brndout]

They made me shorten my post I just wanted too add that I will be thinking of you and looking for your posts Linda

[13ghosts]

Linda,

Thanks for your response. I was beginning to feel badly about leaving such a long and rambling post, when the thread is about Guitarman's journey back to sobriety. Like I said, it all came out at once because I have spoken to no one about this. That's one of the things I miss about the program. It helps to not feel alone.

So your response means a lot to me. I have been reading other threads here, getting to know the players, gaining respect for those who work so hard to help people get off these drugs.

Today was like a new beginning. My attitude was so much more positive. I can feel a change, but I know I need to be patient.

So I will read some more threads, and perhaps repost my own, albeit a little less wordy, perhaps.

Thank you again.

[13ghosts]

I meant to add ;-) after "less wordy."

Peace.

[brndout]

Originally Posted by 13ghosts

Linda,

Thanks for your response. I was beginning to feel badly about leaving such a long and rambling post, when the thread is about Guitarman's journey back to sobriety. Like I said, it all came out at once because I have spoken to no one about this. That's one of the things I miss about the program. It helps to not feel alone.

So your response means a lot to me. I have been reading other threads here, getting to know the players, gaining respect for those who work so hard to help people get off these drugs.

Today was like a new beginning. My attitude was so much more positive. I can feel a change, but I know I need to be patient.

So I will read some more threads, and perhaps repost my own, albeit a little less wordy, perhaps.

Thank you again.

You are more than welcome and dont worry about the length of your posts .I think most people that read others posts empathize and can relate and it helps them as much as you. You should just say what you are feeling.I have never met anyone on here who has been critical or judgemental.I am glad you are feeling more positive and are open to a change Keep reading other peoples posts and let me know how you are doing. Linda

[brndout]

I wanted to tell you that you writing back and saying you felt a bit better made all that I have been going through quite a bit more worth it. I would hate to think nothing came from all of this but one disaster after another.So if in any small way I can give any lift ,hope or help in any way to anyone it makes my struggle with this much easier to deal with. So thank you for helping me Linda

[guitarman57]

Your post, lengthy or not, helps us all. Thank you for sharing as we are all in the same boat here.

I remember when I quit smoking, I finally "got it." No one could make me quit - it had to be me that said, "no more." So simple, eh? Well - that's what made it work. 18 years later and no cigarettes. 7 days today and no pills. I said, "no more." Neither my wife, son, doctor, boss or friends told me to stop - I wanted and needed to stop for me. That's why it's gonna work.

Robert - the trams are gone. Slept 4 fitful hours last night, but no w/d signs this morning. A bit tired, but no shakes, sweats, nausea, chills, gooseflesh, nothing. Just a small voice inside saying, "attaboy."

Thank you all for all your posts and caring enough to marshall your fellow man to victory.

God bless.

[Robert_325]

Originally Posted by guitarman57

Your post, lengthy or not, helps us all. Thank you for sharing as we are all in the same boat here.

I remember when I quit smoking, I finally "got it." No one could make me quit - it had to be me that said, "no more." So simple, eh? Well - that's what made it work. 18 years later and no cigarettes. 7 days today and no pills. I said, "no more." Neither my wife, son, doctor, boss or friends told me to stop - I wanted and needed to stop for me. That's why it's gonna work.

Robert - the trams are gone. Slept 4 fitful hours last night, but no w/d signs this morning. A bit tired, but no shakes, sweats, nausea, chills, gooseflesh, nothing. Just a small voice inside saying, "attaboy."

Thank you all for all your posts and caring enough to marshall your fellow man to victory.

God bless.

That is very good news! You can see by the time on my post that I'm not sleeping either. I'm used to it. And I have a clean date with some years behind me.

I am flying to Seattle Wednesday evening to see Melinda ... a five hour plane trip and I should be sleeping right now. I still have several things to do yet before I leave this afternoon. I'm going to be trashed by the time I get there as I probably won't sleep at all tonight it doesn't appear. I don't think I'll ever sleep the rest of my life again properly. But I'm grateful to be alive and for having a reason to take a trip tomorrow. It could be lots worse, I'm blessed daily.

Melinda asked about your progress last night by the way when we spoke. She is getting a new computer service provider Wednesday so she'll be back online then. The sleep part will probably get better for you. It's not as bad as I have it for most people. I'm just paying the price for decades of abuse. Take care and we will talk later. God bless.

[Robert_325]

Originally Posted by brndout

I wanted to tell you that you writing back and saying you felt a bit better made all that I have been going through quite a bit more worth it. I would hate to think nothing came from all of this but one disaster after another.So if in any small way I can give any lift ,hope or help in any way to anyone it makes my struggle with this much easier to deal with. So thank you for helping me Linda

Linda ... What you just said is exactly why I do what I do on this forum. It's helped keep me going and staying in a good focused direction personally for some time now. I know I'm doing what I'm supposed to do to attempt to help others at least some.

In Christianity the greatest form of prayer is that of interscession. It's praying for someone else's well being, a totally self-less prayer for another human being. It doesn't even have to be for anyone you really know if one is in to that sort of thing with prayer like I am. I'm just trying to make a point here and not preach. I always take advantage of that. So while this isn't necessarily the exact same thing the principle is pretty much the same if you think about it

It definitely feels good to see someone turn their life around for the better. I believe God cares as much about that person as He does you or me. He led the person you help directly to you as He is trusting their care with you and feels you are worthy of that trust He has in you. I know some will think that is corny but I have to have some reason to continue to spend the time I do here and that is what it is that you broght up. I've been asked so many time WHY??? do this.

I assure you that I get a rush seeing people come here and transforming from being a total mess and in a short time they're suddendly helping others with suggestions that helped them get better. It's probably a little selfish while being self-less at the same time helping others. Knowing I have even a small part in providing that help is a good feeling and for me it's also a responsiility as a Christian. That's why I look at this as a ministry.

I basically keep to myself about this forum with even those closest to me away from here. Very few people even know about it. It's just a really personal thing for me. I totally understand how you feel about maybe just helping a person or a few people or whatever. The greater the miracle of your recovery the greater the testimony you can share. And every one you help is another life saved potentially and that is very cool! It should make you feel good. God bless.

[april31shwrs]

Guitarman57-
I have been reading all of your postings and let me begin by saying WOW! If the tramadol has been working for you with your withdrawals, more power to you. I am going to be down right open, honest, straight to the point here hon. I started off with an addiction to Vicodin in 2001, taking approx. 5-500mgs a day. It all started with a trip to the emergency room and I took one pill and did not feel it. So, I decided to take another and BAM!!! Approximately 30mins after taking the 2nd pill, all of a sudden I got this warm, fuzzy feeling all over my body and from that moment on, I wanted to feel like that every day, all day for the rest of my life. The pills gave me energy, made me work harder and faster, made me do things around the house (clean, organize, cook, etc.-i have no children or spouse) that I wouldn't want to do AT ALL when I was completely sober, study & write papers (when I was in college) and anything else that required ALOT of work, time, effort and concentration. Everything was PERFECT when I was on pain pills. I couldn't wait to wake up the next morning so I could start the new day all over again ONLY as long as I had my pills. The 5 pills a day lasted a few months when this all started and ended 2 yrs ago with my addiction exceeding 50+ pills a day and they were either Norco 10's, Percocet 10's, Oxycodone 20mg (the light pink ones) or Oxycontin 80mg-6 to 8 a day (which I would take the time release off and put under my tongue). I was eating so many pills that I was literally making myself vomit so eventually I ended up doing the oxycontins for the last year of this miserable time in my life. I quit the vicodins/percocets (when I was taking around 8-12 5mg pills a day; WAAY before it spiraled out of control)cold turkey(completely cold turkey-no tylenol or anything) back in 2004 and I thought I was going to DIE. I couldn't sleep, I had the chills every 15 seconds all over my body, severe diarrhea, NO ENERGY AT ALLLL, horrible leg jerks, the worst-ever stomach cramps, severe flu-like symptoms, no appetite and I cried ALOT. I would not have wished my withdrawals on my worst enemy and every single minute seemed like eternity. I prayed to God that if he helped me to get through this, I would never ever take another pill again....Like I said, that was back in 2004....YEAH-

Well, like I mentioned above, my addiction escalated to the point of no return beyond my wildest dreams. Over the course of the next few years after 2004, I relapsed, entered treatment, relapsed again, went to treatment as in-patient again, relapsed, more treatment, relapsed, lost my job, cars were repo'd, screwed up my credit due to late late payments, quit school, lost my house, sold ALOT of sentimental items like jewelry and collectables (things of that nature) to get money to feel "NORMAL" because I was beyond the point of getting high. I was no longer getting high by this time. I was feeding an addiction to just feel like normal drug-free people feel.

But the reason I am replying to your posts is because it seems to me like you have legit pain also. So, here are two options that I know would work for you- #1-When I was in treatment as in-patient, I was detoxed off of the opiates with DARVON (which is a lower form of darvicet). I had absolutely NO WITHDRAWALS FROM IT and it took 8 days to get me off of the opiates. Also, whenever I was not in treatment and didn't have anything to get me by, I took darvicet and it really does work. It keeps you from having withdrawal symptoms and keeps you from getting sick and I believe it would also help with your pain issues. Talk to your doctor about it...seriously-
#2-SUBOXONE-This is what I currently take prescribed by my doctor because of my opiate addiction. It is a partial opioid blocker (basically it blocks your opioid receptors) and it also keeps you from craving opiates. I LOVE IT-IT IS THE BEST THING THAT HAS HAPPENED TO ME! AND, in some uses it is prescribed for pain management also. Suboxone was the best thing for me since I have a very high relapse rate, obviously....
Talk to your doctor about it also, or look it up online or even get a pamphlet and read up on it....Any questions, feel free to ask!!
Have a great one ....and GOOD LUCK!!
April

[guitarman57]

April: Thank you so much for posting. I realized a long time ago that I have an addictive personality, but with each substance, I go into denial. I mentioned cigarettes - i forgot to mention the alchohol (years ago, but made more than one trip to rehab). The pills are just the newest member of the banned substances family.

Last October, I had the first of what was supposed to be 2 back surgeries. I have multiple herniations in the lumbar back, but needed cervical surgery so I could survive the lumbar without permanent paralysis. Well - my wife lost her job (was voted out of office) last year and I simply can't afford to be out of work for 3-6 months recuperating from the 2nd surgery.

Anyway, the point I'm trying to get to is, I realized that I may never get the surgery I need. So, my choice(s) were (as I saw them) live on narcotics the rest of my life or see how I could alternately handle the pain. Now, I don't know if this is from God or what, but since I stopped the pills, I HAVE NO BACK PAIN. I've been on pills for over 3 years and have always hurt (but could manage because of my "little friends"). I haven't taken so much as a tylenol today for any discomfort, and even when I was using a few tramadol to help with the detox, I didn't have any back pain.

I don't think I'll be pain free, but this is an unexpected bonus I didn't even contemplate.

I have so much to be grateful for this week - I want to remember feeling like ******** (like I remember coming off alcohol) so I don't do this again. I want to remember feeling better, knowing that the ********py feeling was worth it and I want to keep coming back here to offer any encouragement to anyone who finds themselves in a position they want to change.

Thank you

[brndout]

Originally Posted by Robert_325

Linda ... What you just said is exactly why I do what I do on this forum. It's helped keep me going and staying in a good focused direction personally for some time now. I know I'm doing what I'm supposed to do to attempt to help others at least some.

In Christianity the greatest form of prayer is that of interscession. It's praying for someone else's well being, a totally self-less prayer for another human being. It doesn't even have to be for anyone you really know if one is in to that sort of thing with prayer like I am. I'm just trying to make a point here and not preach. I always take advantage of that. So while this isn't necessarily the exact same thing the principle is pretty much the same if you think about it

It definitely feels good to see someone turn their life around for the better. I believe God cares as much about that person as He does you or me. He led the person you help directly to you as He is trusting their care with you and feels you are worthy of that trust He has in you. I know some will think that is corny but I have to have some reason to continue to spend the time I do here and that is what it is that you broght up. I've been asked so many time WHY??? do this.

I assure you that I get a rush seeing people come here and transforming from being a total mess and in a short time they're suddendly helping others with suggestions that helped them get better. It's probably a little selfish while being self-less at the same time helping others. Knowing I have even a small part in providing that help is a good feeling and for me it's also a responsiility as a Christian. That's why I look at this as a ministry.

I basically keep to myself about this forum with even those closest to me away from here. Very few people even know about it. It's just a really personal thing for me. I totally understand how you feel about maybe just helping a person or a few people or whatever. The greater the miracle of your recovery the greater the testimony you can share. And every one you help is another life saved potentially and that is very cool! It should make you feel good. God bless.

I have to believe that something good will come out of every bad situation.It just makes no sense otherwise I know that is why you do what you do on this forum and you have made such a life changing difference in so many peoples lives, and in doing that those people than make a difference in someone elses life etc... Who knows how many people you have actually reached. That is really cool Thanks for your kind words .It means alot Linda

[Robert_325]

Originally Posted by guitarman57

April: Thank you so much for posting. I realized a long time ago that I have an addictive personality, but with each substance, I go into denial. I mentioned cigarettes - i forgot to mention the alchohol (years ago, but made more than one trip to rehab). The pills are just the newest member of the banned substances family.

Last October, I had the first of what was supposed to be 2 back surgeries. I have multiple herniations in the lumbar back, but needed cervical surgery so I could survive the lumbar without permanent paralysis. Well - my wife lost her job (was voted out of office) last year and I simply can't afford to be out of work for 3-6 months recuperating from the 2nd surgery.

Anyway, the point I'm trying to get to is, I realized that I may never get the surgery I need. So, my choice(s) were (as I saw them) live on narcotics the rest of my life or see how I could alternately handle the pain. Now, I don't know if this is from God or what, but since I stopped the pills, I HAVE NO BACK PAIN. I've been on pills for over 3 years and have always hurt (but could manage because of my "little friends"). I haven't taken so much as a tylenol today for any discomfort, and even when I was using a few tramadol to help with the detox, I didn't have any back pain.

I don't think I'll be pain free, but this is an unexpected bonus I didn't even contemplate.

I have so much to be grateful for this week - I want to remember feeling like ******** (like I remember coming off alcohol) so I don't do this again. I want to remember feeling better, knowing that the ********py feeling was worth it and I want to keep coming back here to offer any encouragement to anyone who finds themselves in a position they want to change.

Thank you

What's happening is that you're beginning to get better. Thank God too! He definitely helps us I think when we are doing the next right thing. But this pain thing that you describe is what we've been preaching a LONG time here. You get off the pain meds and you don't have pain usually. It's the goofy addiction causing most of the pain for most people addicted to opiates. Granted some people have no choice about taking RX pain meds, I would never question that. But for the majority of opiate users what is happening to you happens to most people when they get off them. This is a HUGE sign for you that you're finally improving my friend. God bless.

[guitarman57]

Well, all is well except for this unrelenting insomnia. Unfortunately, I've had to work through this ordeal and now my work is beginning to suffer because I simply cannot sleep. Today, I was so tired at work that I hurt all over. Couldn't wait to get home so I could get to bed, only to toss and turn and toss and turn and stay wide awake, yet exhausted.

I have to get up in another 5.5 hours to again go to work and I'm really not sure I'll make it. The sweats, shakes, aches, etc. were nothing compared to this lack of sleep. I'm wondering when (if) it will finally release me.

[melinda7.5]

Originally Posted by guitarman57

Well, all is well except for this unrelenting insomnia. Unfortunately, I've had to work through this ordeal and now my work is beginning to suffer because I simply cannot sleep. Today, I was so tired at work that I hurt all over. Couldn't wait to get home so I could get to bed, only to toss and turn and toss and turn and stay wide awake, yet exhausted.

I have to get up in another 5.5 hours to again go to work and I'm really not sure I'll make it. The sweats, shakes, aches, etc. were nothing compared to this lack of sleep. I'm wondering when (if) it will finally release me.

Hi guitarman
Your sleep patterns should start to get a little better...Have you tried some excedrin PM or valerian root they seemed to help me a little...I still take ambien once in awhile when I get in a bad sleep cycle...
Your going to make it you have come way to far now...
hang in there it's almost the weekend..YEA !!!
Talk to you later, Melinda

[guitarman57]

Melinda: Yes - I've been trying everything from Nyquil to Tylenol PM to Valerian Root to Melatonin - nothing helps. I've managed a total of about 8 fitful hours the last 4 days. I feel like I'm going to fall over when I walk.

No way am I going to use any pain pills, but this lack of sleep is simply nightmarish (no pun intended).

[Robert_325]

Originally Posted by guitarman57

Melinda: Yes - I've been trying everything from Nyquil to Tylenol PM to Valerian Root to Melatonin - nothing helps. I've managed a total of about 8 fitful hours the last 4 days. I feel like I'm going to fall over when I walk.

No way am I going to use any pain pills, but this lack of sleep is simply nightmarish (no pun intended).

Guitarman ... once again like I often tell people look at the times I reply to posts sometimes. It's in the middle of the night half the time and I'm retired. I haven't slept in years. Don't worry though I'm not your typical example.

Sleep is usually the last thing to return to normal in this deal. You've been doing this w/d thing for only a short while. Give it some time. You will get better as long as you don't use anything you shouldn't. God bless.

[Freedom4me]

13 Ghosts are you still around? Was hoping you were doing better. Wanted to offer you some support and let you know that we are all pulling for you and Guitarman. This is a great place to let your feelings out. Everyone here has been through what you are going through and is more than willing to help in any way we can. Keep in touch. I am worried about you.

[guitarman57]

Finally happened - stayed in bed from 9:30 p.m. until 4 a.m., sleeping most of the time. Not the artificial sleep of a pill addict; the restful sleep of a tired 57-year old man who works a little too hard sometime.

Thanks to all.

[melinda7.5]

Originally Posted by guitarman57

Finally happened - stayed in bed from 9:30 p.m. until 4 a.m., sleeping most of the time. Not the artificial sleep of a pill addict; the restful sleep of a tired 57-year old man who works a little too hard sometime.

Thanks to all.

Hi guitarman
That is good news...I wish I was so lucky tonight its 1:30 where I'm at and here I am ...LOL
have a good day, Melinda

[Robert_325]

Originally Posted by guitarman57

Finally happened - stayed in bed from 9:30 p.m. until 4 a.m., sleeping most of the time. Not the artificial sleep of a pill addict; the restful sleep of a tired 57-year old man who works a little too hard sometime.

Thanks to all.

You've turned the corner buddy! That is very cool. Hang in there, it just gets better from this point forward. God bless.

[Lindsay988]

hi my name is lindsay and my mother hurt her back severly last week and a friend of hers gave her some pills and she and myself have no idea what they are! so if someone could please help us identify what they are it would be greatly appreciated, i have 2 different ones the first one is a tablet that is half green and half white,and the markings on it are r 076.(the r is like the symbol for Rx i think anyway its not just a regular R it has a line through it) and the other pill that we have is a white circle shaped tablet with the markings 100 er, (the 100 is on top of the er) and there is no markings on the otherside of pill,please please please someone help her until she can go see her doctor next friday!!:confused:

[Robert_325]

Lindsay .... You should post this on the pill id section so one of those people will see your post. They don't look here generally. God bless.

[guitarman57]

Wow - groggy! Slept from 9:30 - 4:30 a.m. straight and feel like I'm 30 years younger. (Although I'd love to get back under the covers - 29 her this morning!)

It's amazing that the physical stuff is over. I have a doctor's appt. tomorrow and I plan on telling him that I've gone off the meds and that the pain can be managed with motrin (if it even does come back!) I'm sure he'll be shocked and I'll get a lecture ("You should have told me! I could've put you on suboxone!") Oh, well - the pharmacy is just out my co-pay, I guess.

Thank you all again so much. Robert - you are a prince among men - Melinda, thank you so much.

I'll be back, but hopefully to help others this time.

[melinda7.5]

Originally Posted by guitarman57

Wow - groggy! Slept from 9:30 - 4:30 a.m. straight and feel like I'm 30 years younger. (Although I'd love to get back under the covers - 29 her this morning!)

It's amazing that the physical stuff is over. I have a doctor's appt. tomorrow and I plan on telling him that I've gone off the meds and that the pain can be managed with motrin (if it even does come back!) I'm sure he'll be shocked and I'll get a lecture ("You should have told me! I could've put you on suboxone!") Oh, well - the pharmacy is just out my co-pay, I guess.

Thank you all again so much. Robert - you are a prince among men - Melinda, thank you so much.

I'll be back, but hopefully to help others this time.

Hi guitarman
you just made my day...your life will just keep getting better every day now.
come back and check in sometimes to say hi...
Life is good...
Talk to you later,Melinda

[guitarman57]

Just got back from my pain doc appt. He came in as usual and pulled out his prescription pad and said, "just a refill today?" I said, "I don't think I need anything, doctor. I stopped taking those about 2 weeks ago and I'm feeling fine, thanks." I thought he was going to drop his pen! He said he could've given me something to help. I said, "Well, then I'd just be taking something else now, right?" He gave me the strangest look!

Anyway - it felt good to turn down 120 Percocets and 120 Oxy's without batting an eye!

Best to all!

[Robert_325]

Originally Posted by guitarman57

Just got back from my pain doc appt. He came in as usual and pulled out his prescription pad and said, "just a refill today?" I said, "I don't think I need anything, doctor. I stopped taking those about 2 weeks ago and I'm feeling fine, thanks." I thought he was going to drop his pen! He said he could've given me something to help. I said, "Well, then I'd just be taking something else now, right?" He gave me the strangest look!

Anyway - it felt good to turn down 120 Percocets and 120 Oxy's without batting an eye!

Best to all!

That is awesome buddy! Felt pretty darn good looking at his face when you said that didn't it! I know it did cause I did the same thing years ago. He thought he had you in his grip for as long as he wanted you there. Joke's on him. HA HA

It felt for me like for the first time in a very long time I had done something that I believed in, something that had some value. You just made one of the biggest accomplishments you could make in your life. I don't personally know you but I couldn't be any more happy for you if you were my best friend. Congratulations. I'm very proud of you for what that is worth. God bless.

[melinda7.5]

Originally Posted by guitarman57

Just got back from my pain doc appt. He came in as usual and pulled out his prescription pad and said, "just a refill today?" I said, "I don't think I need anything, doctor. I stopped taking those about 2 weeks ago and I'm feeling fine, thanks." I thought he was going to drop his pen! He said he could've given me something to help. I said, "Well, then I'd just be taking something else now, right?" He gave me the strangest look!

Anyway - it felt good to turn down 120 Percocets and 120 Oxy's without batting an eye!

Best to all!

Hey My Friend !!!
You just made my day I KNEW YOU COULD DO THIS.... HAPPY DAY...
be very proud of yourself....
Life is GOOD...
Have a great day...
Talk to you soon, Melinda

[13ghosts]

Guitarman, what a great GREAT day for you. That's some feeling, isn't it? My god, you must be proud, and should be proud of yourself. You are one more fantastic soul walking around this planet who proves we can all day do it. You, and all of you here who have welcomed me, have truly inspired me. I have had one of the best weeks I have had in years. I've managed to cut back on the norco to three a day, and the ms-contin to one a day. No ultra, but ambien or lunesta for sleep, and 1/2 an ativan every other day for nerves. But I am getting more done at work and home than ever. And my plan is to get off the norco completely, try the ms-contin twice a day as doc suggests for pain management, and see how that goes. I think this is better than taking all that norco a day, but of course, my fear is that the ms-contin tolerance will build and then where will I be? I try not to worry and keep the positive vibe going (I have not felt good about myself or my life in a long time and this board turned it around).

Slight problem, though. I need the norco for breakthrough pain, and have had a lot lately after pulling my back out worse doing some heavy lifting. This past month, I was taking 5 to 6 norco a day and only one ms-contin, so naturally I ran out of the norco early. When I called to have it refilled a week early, the doc had no problem with that as long as I stuck to our ms-contin plan, and insurance would over it. But the pharmacy says they will not fill it for a week because that's when the 30 days will be up. WTF? They fill scrips early for me all the time. In fact, last month, they filled the norco five days early. Not sure what to do here because I do not want to start taking the ultram again for breakthough in the interim, nor double up on the ms-contin. I'm pissed at the pharmacy, and if I switch to another, I figure they will attempt to collude on this 30 day thing. I honestly don't understand. If the doctor thought it was too early, he would not have called it in. If insurance thinks its too early, they would not approve it. Can the pharmacy do this? And do you think I should just try to tough it out for the week (though I am in pain now, having taken my second ms-contin mid-afternoon), attempt to transfer the rx to another pharmacy, or make a stink at this one? Yes, I have used up these meds too fast (while I was two weeks past the due date on the last ms-contin), but am NOT drop shopping nor trying to pull a fast one since my doc knows the score. Anyway, I figure some of you must know about this than I do.

Linda, Freedom---thanks again.

And Guitarman, I can't say how much you inspire me. You've given me new hope. You all have. And that's something I haven't had in years.

Bless you all.

[guitarman57]

13Ghosts - Not sure why your pharm is giving you a tough time - my insurance always let me get my scripts after 3 weeks on a month's supply. Perhaps different insurance companies?

For what it's worth - the Percs I was taking were for "breakthrough" pain and the MS Contins were for day and night pain management. Usually, the Contins were sufficient for the pain and the Percs were the party favors. If you absolutely had to wait for any breakthrough meds, it might make it easier to really get off what you may not need.

As I've stated, my back hurt constantly...until I stopped taking all the meds. Then - it stopped hurting. Hopefully a common phenomenon.

Best of luck to you and keep coming back.