gmc012883's Own Personal Thread

[doc.rose]

here it is gina!! Post away. A lot more people will respond to your story if you begin to post here. Feel free to post on other threads too, but I would keep posts that pertain to you on your own thread. Does that make sense?? If you have any questions, go ahead and ask. Take care!

[gmc012883]

well I guess I will tell my story on my " very own thread" thank you doc!!!
I was put on oxycodone about 2 years ago do to endometriosis and cysts. I had SEVERAL surgery's in 2 years so the dr. just kept me on it and upping my dose and upping my dose. I never took more then I was supposed to and I never got it from anywhere but him. I was told by him " you need it so you will not be addicted". I have really never known anyone that was addicted to anything so really had no education about the medication I was taking ( which is my own fault). My Dr. would offer me diff medicines morphine dilaudid ( think that’s how you spell it) and I would always say NO. He said one time to me " you know people would kill for this stuff and you want nothing to do with it". I was just fine with the meds I was taking and did not want more. He assured me MANY times all was ok. Never not ONE TIME told me when its time to get off this you are going to have a battle, a long one. After my last surgery I decided it was time to stop taking medication, I was " all better" SOOOO one day I just decided to not take it.. which was a Saturday. By that night I thought OMG what have I gotten, thought I had the FLU by the next day I was SO MISRABLE I called my dr out of desperation thinking something is wrong, maybe an infection. I spoke with him Sunday morning and he had asked me what are your symptoms and have you done anything differently. I told him no, I was feeling good so I have not taken any medication so I dont know what could be going on. He YELLED saying WHAT?? you cant just stop taking that, you are going the WD!!! I started freaking out hysterically crying and took my medication.. within an hour I felt FINE! So that’s when this battle began that I had no clue I even had a part in. He told me NO to coming of the medication, said I would need it for the rest of my life. After moths of begging he finally agreed but said they only way he would do it was if I went to a SUBOXONE Dr! So I went.... and then the story begins again! I was only on 30mg of oxycodone ( had got myself down from 120) and she put me on 32mg.. that’s right 8mg 3x a day!!!! I again had no clue and started the suboxone. This time I decided not to make the same mistake so I did my research and found that was WAY to much.. so within a few days I was down to 8.. that’s where I stayed for awhile. Seeing so many mixed things I was unsure what to do. Then I came on here and met the MOST AMAZING PEOPLE, PEOPLE WHO I BELIEVE ARE SENT FOR THIS PURPOSE.. TO HELP AND INSPIRE!! :-) Now I have went from 8-.75 in the matter of a few weeks and am DETERMINED to get off this all together. I have NEVER done ANY drug, I dont smoke and rarely drink. I honestly went into this so blind to a lot of things. I know its not going to be easy, it has not been BUT NO WHERE NEAR AS HARD AS I THOUGHT. It make me so angry to know that I really could have just toughed it out a few more days and would have been off medication all the way WAY back before he put me on suboxone. I had no clue. Never again will I take ANYTHING without doing my homework! Melissa and Henry have been angels sent to help me.. not only to help me through this time but to help me open my eyes and heart to EVERYONE... I used to judge people and I can admit that... no more will I ever!! You should never judge a book by its cover because one day you may be in it! I am down to .75 ( its been difficult but only because I went TOO fast .. I read wrong and started wrong so now I am paying for that but getting on track. I even had to go back up a little but that’s ok. Some words of A VERY WISE MAN said " it took you a long time to get here what’s a few more days to get off" its not about being a super hero.. its about getting CLEAN! I will post and update how its going hoping maybe someone, even just one person will see it and it will help them make the best decision of their life! Its not the easiest thing BUT BY FAR THE HARDEST and with AMAZING people like I have found here it makes it all the easier! :-)

[Hellweek]

I also find it odd that doctors say if you need the meds for a true medical reason you will not get addicted.

I do not understand where they get off saying this. Like you I never abused my meds, I never ran out early. Yet, I found myself addicted.

I suspect that addiction and dependent are 2 different things. I do not understand that because if my body thinks it needs the meds then I am dependent therefor I am addicted.

I have found the people on this board much more honest and smarter then many of the doctors and nurses I have talked to.

Please follow the people here, we will see you over this hump.

This is my 2nd time back to these boards for help and I find it very helpful to post.

[HenryNCBA]

Kudos Gina!
You are doing very well and considering how fast you tapered you are doing very well. A bit of a bumpy ride but seemingly stabilized. It takes time for your system to adjust with opiates unlike other meds such as Tylenol, Advil, etc.. They are not immediate reaction meds so to speak. You don't take them and all of a sudden you feel wonderful and when you are done you just don't take them and expect to feel great.
A quick note about addiction and chemical dependence. I know I will hear flak on this but here goes. Chemical Dependence is your situation Gina. I was in the same boat. You take medications scripted from your doctor and you take as directed. Your mind and body develops a dependence on these meds/drugs and before you know it you are hooked on them. Is it a true addiction? Yes and no. Yes in that you unknowingly got hooked on them. No because you are not doing anything illicit to acquire them nor do you crave them for the sake of getting the so called high or buzzed feeling off of them. Addiction is whey you knowingly are on them yet you crave more and seek more. It starts to occupy most of your thoughts. When awake you are always worried about running out and seeking to acquire more. This leads people to doctor shopping, street buying, and any way of acquiring more of the substance. I too feel into the chemical dependence trap. I took opiate pain meds for years as scripted. One day I came into work on a Monday and felt terrible like I was coming down with the flu. I thought I hope I don’t pass it on to others. That night I did my usual and by Tuesday I felt fine. Then the following Monday again I felt like I was coming down with the flu. During the afternoon something clicked in my mind saying “withdrawal symptoms” and when I researched it sure enough that is what I was feeling. I thought back and found that the two previous Saturday and Sundays I stayed home and didn’t do anything so I didn’t bother to take my pain meds all weekend so by Monday I was in withdrawal. Had I known at the time what to do I would have just C/T’s it as by the time I saw a doctor that specialized in this I was already into day 4 of my W/D. I felt terrible and he put me on Suboxone. I am one of those that do not handle Suboxone well so I was switched to Subutex after I discovered this web site and Robert pointed out so many things to me it made my head spin. He got me straighten out though and the rest is now history.
The effects of opiate withdrawal are pretty wicked. It tests you physically, mentally, and emotionally. You hurt all over and feel like you have a flu really bad yet something is different. You are anxious yet very depressed. You want to run down the street screaming yet you don’t want to move or get out of bed. You feel like there is no tomorrow yet you force yourself to do things because they need to be done. Other things you just let go because at that moment you just don’t care.
I can promise you though that after this ordeal and once clean and free there is light at the end of the tunnel. You will have your life back and more because now you have the knowledge and experience of having gone through hell and back. This can not be learned by listening but by actual experience for you now know what it actually feels like. Don’t ever let anyone criticize you for being hooked on meds. Everyone on this forum are seasoned veterans and has been through their own hell yet here they stand today. Everyone looks down on those of us that have been or are hooked on meds/drugs but it is easy to not experience the actual situation and sit back and point fingers and give advice on how to do things. Easier said than done. A classic example is what was said to you regarding the Suboxone of “well just stop it”. If things were that easy none of us would be here as there would be no need.

Docrose, thank you for starting this thread for Gina!

Henry

[jammymommy]

My story is somewhat like yours, only I KNEW that I would be addicted to the meds. once it was time to come off.

My story is under "With God's Help ..." Please feel free to visit!

At this point I'm on 16mgs of Sub.

God bless you!
jammy

ps I think you're in good hands here!

[gmc012883]

Henry- I wanted to know when to decrease my dose. I am SO scared because I still dont feel good.. I have good moments but have this hot cold, clammy irritated and it seems to be getting worse. A part of me thinks switching back to oxycodone then weening ( however you spell it) would work better but i DO NOT want to take that stuff again,.. I am up and down left and right.. What dose should I have been on right now.. the last thing I wanna do is go back up but have so much fear its going to be so much harder in the end because I rushed it in error now am paying the price... should I stay where I am for awhile more? its been over a week .25 and up to .75 for a few days now. when I take my med I feel good.. then in 6-8 hours start feeling really bad.. I JUST DONT GET THAt.. not why I feel good then bad but why in such a short period of time??????? Most people take it once a day and are fine .. Im just so scared my body is used to having it so many times a day.. last night I did not make it through... I had to take a " sliver" and I took my med at 4 and am alreadt starting to feel the chills... is this in my head???? I need you henry.. I am really getting discouraged.. I feel like such a whiny baby .................. is it really that bad?? I know its the bad guys trying to make me take more but they are winning right now.... I just want to be " stabalized" I really dont think I can go 4 days and reinduct so what are my options?? Thank you henry, for everything!

[mottam]

Henry- I wanted to know when to decrease my dose. I am SO scared because I still dont feel good.. I have good moments but have this hot cold, clammy irritated and it seems to be getting worse. A part of me thinks switching back to oxycodone then weening ( however you spell it) would work better but i DO NOT want to take that stuff again,.. I am up and down left and right.. What dose should I have been on right now.. the last thing I wanna do is go back up but have so much fear its going to be so much harder in the end because I rushed it in error now am paying the price... should I stay where I am for awhile more? its been over a week .25 and up to .75 for a few days now. when I take my med I feel good.. then in 6-8 hours start feeling really bad.. I JUST DONT GET THAt.. not why I feel good then bad but why in such a short period of time??????? Most people take it once a day and are fine .. Im just so scared my body is used to having it so many times a day.. last night I did not make it through... I had to take a " sliver" and I took my med at 4 and am alreadt starting to feel the chills... is this in my head???? I need you henry.. I am really getting discouraged.. I feel like such a whiny baby .................. is it really that bad?? I know its the bad guys trying to make me take more but they are winning right now.... I just want to be " stabalized" I really dont think I can go 4 days and reinduct so what are my options?? Thank you henry, for everything!

g:
Welcome.
I cannot help you with the sub issue, but I can offer you my support.
Please, do NOT go back to the oxys – that is the opiate that almost put me in the ground.
From everything I have read on the forum w/ regards to subs, you are having a hard time titrating. MANY on here have been there. Robert and Henry are excellent to help you through this.
Know I am pulling for you, and as a fellow addict, you are in my thoughts and prayers. I know the pain you are in. It does end - stay strong.

mottam

[melinda7.5]

Hi Gina
try to remember this is not forever it will onle be like this a short time in your life and it all be behind you,,,so hang in there and tell yourself I can do this today!!!
Melinda

[cheekysod]

you might not like this, but i reckon that its in your head that you need to take something 3 times a day.

sub is very long lasting, namely 36-72 hours, so theres no way y0u should need it MORE THAN TWICE A DAY.

its addictive behavior, thru and thru. rethink the chemically dependant and addicted motives and you might reach a breakthru.

really, its the same thing, come on.

and why re induct now mate, your nearly there......

and if by your logic you are ONLY chemically dependant, then its gonna be ok.

i know it aint what you want to hear, but sometimes i can just see stuff in what people post. and now is one of them times. sorry matey, i want to be encouraging, but i also want you to GO FOR IT.

GO FOR IT. DONT LOOK BACK.

[HenryNCBA]

Henry- I wanted to know when to decrease my dose. I am SO scared because I still dont feel good.. I have good moments but have this hot cold, clammy irritated and it seems to be getting worse. A part of me thinks switching back to oxycodone then weening ( however you spell it) would work better but i DO NOT want to take that stuff again,.. I am up and down left and right.. What dose should I have been on right now.. the last thing I wanna do is go back up but have so much fear its going to be so much harder in the end because I rushed it in error now am paying the price... should I stay where I am for awhile more? its been over a week .25 and up to .75 for a few days now. when I take my med I feel good.. then in 6-8 hours start feeling really bad.. I JUST DONT GET THAt.. not why I feel good then bad but why in such a short period of time??????? Most people take it once a day and are fine .. Im just so scared my body is used to having it so many times a day.. last night I did not make it through... I had to take a " sliver" and I took my med at 4 and am alreadt starting to feel the chills... is this in my head???? I need you henry.. I am really getting discouraged.. I feel like such a whiny baby .................. is it really that bad?? I know its the bad guys trying to make me take more but they are winning right now.... I just want to be " stabalized" I really dont think I can go 4 days and reinduct so what are my options?? Thank you henry, for everything!

Hello Gina,
Sorry to hear you are feeling so crummy. Remember what I said about the so called "bad guys" throwing everything in their book at you? That they WILL make you suffer? That you will feel great then at a snap of the fingers you will feel terrible? Several things here as your mind is reeling and going a million miles a second. That is normal too by the way and it will happen.
1. You are NOT a whinny baby! You are in withdrawal from a substance that does what it is doing to you! You feel bad physically and mentally it WILL make you unstable.
2. You are NOT dying or anything. No on that I know of has died from withdrawal from opiates. You may feel like it for sure but you are not.
3. You took a sliver. That is what it is there for. I need to know what size the sliver was as you did not mention that.
4. You are currently at .75 mg per day with .25 in the morning and .50 in the afternoon. How accurately are you measuing the doses? Remember what I said that even the crumbs make a heck of a difference. I know you are using 8mg tablets and I told you the other day how to divide them to get the most accurate dose.
5. Calm down and try not to panic. I know easier said than done. It is your mind that is controlling your body and emotions right now and your mind is in the grips of the opiates. Take control and as Melinda said you need only do this once. I know it is NOT easy but you CAN do it! Believe me the prize at the end is worth it. It is a long and hard struggle but you WILL get there. As the doses get smaller things seem harder.

Let me know and we will proceed. I do need to know how big that sliver was and also how accurately your doses are as well. Also exactly what times you are dosing. Subs are a med that need to stay on schedules. They do not work very well if you say dose at 09:00 one day then 06:00 the next then 11:00 the following and the afternoon doses bouncing around as well. This will throw your system off.

Hang in there Gina. You will be fine!

Henry

[gmc012883]

you might not like this, but i reckon that its in your head that you need to take something 3 times a day.

sub is very long lasting, namely 36-72 hours, so theres no way y0u should need it MORE THAN TWICE A DAY.

its addictive behavior, thru and thru. rethink the chemically dependant and addicted motives and you might reach a breakthru.

really, its the same thing, come on.

and why re induct now mate, your nearly there......

and if by your logic you are ONLY chemically dependant, then its gonna be ok.

i know it aint what you want to hear, but sometimes i can just see stuff in what people post. and now is one of them times. sorry matey, i want to be encouraging, but i also want you to GO FOR IT.

GO FOR IT. DONT LOOK BACK.

Cheeky, thanks for your advice but I am good. It may be in my head, that I believe. I have never had addict behvior nor will I ever. I have never done drugs in my life other then the medication rx's by my dr .for multiple surgery's.. I just tried to stop taking it not even knowing anything about it. I am not downing anyone because regardless of how we got here we are all in the same place. Maybe you dont know my whole story but the reason I am so sick is because I went from 4 mg to .25 within a week and a half so its the fact I do not hve near enough in my system. I am not taking the medicaton to feel good.. I am taking it to not feel like hell. I have henry helping me whom knows my whole story and has been with me every step of the way. e is the one that mentioned re-inducting which is why I brought it up.. I just want to do it right. I am going to get through this with his and a few other peoples help. I am not trying to sound rude what so ever but to be honest he and a select few other people are the ones I will listen to. If he tells me to reinduct thats what I will do because I trust him with my life. So just a thought here.. befor you " read into what people post" maybe you should ask questions or go back to post to get the whole story. Being chem dependant is FAR FROM BEING AN ADDICT.... I do not take drugs to get high, I do not nor ever have used more then what I was told to use. My medication has never affected my life. I do not search for " when I will get my next high" I do not lie nor steal to get it. I have real pain and go to the dr who persc. me medication... which I take exact how I am instructed. So there is a whole hell of a diff between the two. I dont want to take it.. and I am going as fast as I can to stop. I just made the decision to listen to my dr which is my fault for not doing my homework. Also my bottle of medication says to take 8mg 3 times a day...... I am taking .75.. This is a medication you have to decrease exact to limit wd so thats what I am doing.. I am doing as henry tells me and will continue. I wish you so much succ in your recovery process but PLEASE do not tell me I am an addict when there is no substance to what you are saying.. I accept all help and LOVE all the advice I get... but have choosen to listen to one person and that is henry and melissa. this may be long winded but your comments were out of line. I hope this does not come off to bad I really do not mean any harm I am just a very direct person and say what I feel. ;

[gmc012883]

Hello Gina,
Sorry to hear you are feeling so crummy. Remember what I said about the so called "bad guys" throwing everything in their book at you? That they WILL make you suffer? That you will feel great then at a snap of the fingers you will feel terrible? Several things here as your mind is reeling and going a million miles a second. That is normal too by the way and it will happen.
1. You are NOT a whinny baby! You are in withdrawal from a substance that does what it is doing to you! You feel bad physically and mentally it WILL make you unstable.
2. You are NOT dying or anything. No on that I know of has died from withdrawal from opiates. You may feel like it for sure but you are not.
3. You took a sliver. That is what it is there for. I need to know what size the sliver was as you did not mention that.
4. You are currently at .75 mg per day with .25 in the morning and .50 in the afternoon. How accurately are you measuing the doses? Remember what I said that even the crumbs make a heck of a difference. I know you are using 8mg tablets and I told you the other day how to divide them to get the most accurate dose.
5. Calm down and try not to panic. I know easier said than done. It is your mind that is controlling your body and emotions right now and your mind is in the grips of the opiates. Take control and as Melinda said you need only do this once. I know it is NOT easy but you CAN do it! Believe me the prize at the end is worth it. It is a long and hard struggle but you WILL get there. As the doses get smaller things seem harder.

Let me know and we will proceed. I do need to know how big that sliver was and also how accurately your doses are as well. Also exactly what times you are dosing. Subs are a med that need to stay on schedules. They do not work very well if you say dose at 09:00 one day then 06:00 the next then 11:00 the following and the afternoon doses bouncing around as well. This will throw your system off.

Hang in there Gina. You will be fine!

Henry

henry, I took .25... I have done as you said and broke them up which I think has worked a little better, feeling a little better today :-) please let me know ! Hope all is going well with you :-) THANK YOU for everything!!!!!

[newyorkgal]

Whoa, Gina.... I have followed your thread with interest and up til now have thought you a very nice person, looking for help and helping others. Just got up to the post where you respond to cheeky and boy, was I taken aback. You think she was out of line? Gina, look up the word addict in a dictionary and you will find this: being physiologically or psychologically dependent on an addictive substance as in alcohol or narcotics (or many other things such as nicotine, food, etc).... No matter what the roots of the problem are. No matter if you took it for pleasure or to quell pain. Addiction is addiction is addiction. I read cheeky's post thoroughly and saw wnothing whatsoever out of line. She was only trying to help. Having said that, Henry is a wonderful guy, a friend who I would trust implicitly also and Melissa has recently gone through it so she can be a great help too. If you don't want anyone elses input and are so easily offended, perhaps you should go private with those two people because this is a forum and everyone can give their bit of advice. Now you don't have to take it but to actually post saying she was out of line when there's nothing in her post that was out of line? To try to differentiate between your problem and everyone elses on here? Well, perhaps THATS out of line. In any case, I know in my heart cheeky was trying to be helpful and once again, addicted is addicted is addicted no matter what kind of spin you put on it.

[Robert_325]

henry, I took .25... I have done as you said and broke them up which I think has worked a little better, feeling a little better today :-) please let me know ! Hope all is going well with you :-) THANK YOU for everything!!!!!

Gina ..... Henry and I discussed your situation in detail today. He knows how to reach me personally anytime it's required. I worked with Henry when he got here and he is more than capable of directing you through your taper. If he gets stumped I am at his disposal. Too many people giving instructions tends to mess things up. I will only get involved at Henry's request. Otherwise I suggest you listen to him and know that we are in counsel together making suggestions that will end in your ultimate success. You're in my prayers and in good hands. Just listen to what will help you and let the rest go. It doesn't do any good for you to argue with anyone about recovery when they are still using themselves. Stick with the winners and you'll end up one too. God bless.

[Robert_325]

Whoa, Gina.... I have followed your thread with interest and up til now have thought you a very nice person, looking for help and helping others. Just got up to the post where you respond to cheeky and boy, was I taken aback. You think she was out of line? Gina, look up the word addict in a dictionary and you will find this: being physiologically or psychologically dependent on an addictive substance as in alcohol or narcotics (or many other things such as nicotine, food, etc).... No matter what the roots of the problem are. No matter if you took it for pleasure or to quell pain. Addiction is addiction is addiction. I read cheeky's post thoroughly and saw wnothing whatsoever out of line. She was only trying to help. Having said that, Henry is a wonderful guy, a friend who I would trust implicitly also and Melissa has recently gone through it so she can be a great help too. If you don't want anyone elses input and are so easily offended, perhaps you should go private with those two people because this is a forum and everyone can give their bit of advice. Now you don't have to take it but to actually post saying she was out of line when there's nothing in her post that was out of line? To try to differentiate between your problem and everyone elses on here? Well, perhaps THATS out of line. In any case, I know in my heart cheeky was trying to be helpful and once again, addicted is addicted is addicted no matter what kind of spin you put on it.

Cheeky was trying to help but no one asked for her additional support. Henry is actually a success story and clean while others here are still addicted to opiates over a year after they started on subs.

I would choose to listen to Henry's advice as well over others still using. Seems like this conversation continues to come up. You have no business telling Gina what she needs to be doing when she specifically asked to be left alone.

Okay .... now blast me. I don't care, it's happened too many times before. I'll say it again that people who have successfully gotten clean are better sources of information on the subject than people who can't get off .25mg after a year.

If cheeky is clean that is great. But you Bev are not and don't decide for everyone when they are out of line. There are moderators for that purpose.

[Melissa B]

Gina,
Just keep doing what you are doing and listen to Henry. He is awesome like I told you from day one. You are doing geat girl and you will be crossing that finish line sooner then later. I have never doubted for one minute that you were not an addict and there is a difference so don't let anyone tell you different! It's not your fault that you had to take those pills and it's surely not your fault you had to have those surgeries. Hang there and do what Henry tells you!

Peace
Melissa

[newyorkgal]

I would never think of telling Gina what she should be doing and I don't think I told her one thing to do in my post. In fact, if you read my post you'd see I said "Henry is a wonderful guy, a friend who I would trust implicitly and Melissa has just been through it so she will be a great help too". Gina said cheeky was out of line. You just said that's the moderators decision. Well, is it or isn't it or does it depend who says the words? I didn't see cheeky out of line at all and said so. My decision to maintain on sub has nothing to do with my response to the post..I still have opinions. I wasn't advising her how to stop subs. On the other hand, cheeky was trying to be helpful. She wasn't rude. Also, I have no intentions of "blasting' anyone and never have. That's not my purpose for coming on here. However, since this is a forum for all, all can advise. As I said, no one has to take any elses advice but to call someone "out of line" for trying to help is just not nice. Also, addiction, chemical dependency, habit - its all semantics. If you can't stop something without withdrawal, it's an addiction no matter how you came by it. Look it up. Noone plans to become addicted and its nobody's fault. It's unfortunate when you've had surgery and get put on pain meds but the end result, whether you call it chemical dependence or addiction, is that you have to withdrawl from the thing your own, hopefully as painlessly as possible.. Another thing, look at most threads here. Someone comes on with a problem, many people come to their aid... Some advice is good, some not so good. That's the nature of a forum however... People trying to help people which is all cheeky was doing in any case. Her help might not have been wanted, but she wasn't out of line for trying.

[doc.rose]

Cheeky, thanks for your advice but I am good. It may be in my head, that I believe. I have never had addict behvior nor will I ever. I have never done drugs in my life other then the medication rx's by my dr .for multiple surgery's.. I just tried to stop taking it not even knowing anything about it. I am not downing anyone because regardless of how we got here we are all in the same place. Maybe you dont know my whole story but the reason I am so sick is because I went from 4 mg to .25 within a week and a half so its the fact I do not hve near enough in my system. I am not taking the medicaton to feel good.. I am taking it to not feel like hell. I have henry helping me whom knows my whole story and has been with me every step of the way. e is the one that mentioned re-inducting which is why I brought it up.. I just want to do it right. I am going to get through this with his and a few other peoples help. I am not trying to sound rude what so ever but to be honest he and a select few other people are the ones I will listen to. If he tells me to reinduct thats what I will do because I trust him with my life. So just a thought here.. befor you " read into what people post" maybe you should ask questions or go back to post to get the whole story. Being chem dependant is FAR FROM BEING AN ADDICT.... I do not take drugs to get high, I do not nor ever have used more then what I was told to use. My medication has never affected my life. I do not search for " when I will get my next high" I do not lie nor steal to get it. I have real pain and go to the dr who persc. me medication... which I take exact how I am instructed. So there is a whole hell of a diff between the two. I dont want to take it.. and I am going as fast as I can to stop. I just made the decision to listen to my dr which is my fault for not doing my homework. Also my bottle of medication says to take 8mg 3 times a day...... I am taking .75.. This is a medication you have to decrease exact to limit wd so thats what I am doing.. I am doing as henry tells me and will continue. I wish you so much succ in your recovery process but PLEASE do not tell me I am an addict when there is no substance to what you are saying.. I accept all help and LOVE all the advice I get... but have choosen to listen to one person and that is henry and melissa. this may be long winded but your comments were out of line. I hope this does not come off to bad I really do not mean any harm I am just a very direct person and say what I feel. ;

Gina, Cheeky meant no harm. It seems like you are awfully defensive. Only you can decide if you are an addict or not. What Cheeky was saying is you are showing signs of addictive behaviour. I suffered from
Endometriosis and I had a hysterectomy at the age of 34. I had to take pain meds on and off for a few years, but never had a problem stopping. I am shocked that your doc would put you on subs rather than taper you off of the oxycodone. You said you were on a low dose anyway. Also, this is a open forum, so you are gonna get advice you might not want to here. NYGal said it perfectly. And she said if respectfully. Here is how I feel about people giving advice, NYGal is just as qualified to give advice as Robert and Henry. I know some people on here who give advice who still drink beer and use muscle relaxers and also take sleep meds. And these people are supposed recovering addicts. An addict is supposed to refrain from using ALL mind altering drugs, right?? .

[mottam]

Seriously? Enough.
This person has chosen their path on the forum to get to where they want to be. Why can't all of us just offer support, and let them work to bring this to an end?

REM: The end goal here is to help anyone who asks for it.

gmc012883 - stick w/ whom you feel comfortable - all of us will offer support and prayer.

Kindest Regards - Best of luck!
mottam

[Robert_325]

Proud of you girl for sticking it out and getting clean. I know it was a struggle but you've done great, even with the ups and downs, and deserve a big old pat on the back! Just wanted to acknowledge your accomplishment. You're a winner! You never have to use again. God bless.

[gmc012883]

newyork, i am a very nice person. I welcome all help but not someone whi us trying to tell me I am an " addict" there is a diff between addict and addiction. I ABSOLUTLY 100 percent ADDICTED... I get that.. but with me its not mental .. its physical. Just for I got the definition of " addiction"
compulsive need for and use of a habit-forming substance (as heroin, nicotine, or alcohol) characterized by tolerance and by well-defined physiological symptoms upon withdrawal; broadly : persistent compulsive use of a substance known by the user to be harmful
so really none of your definition was correct.. I do not have a compulsive need to take the medication.. I dont/... I take it and always have taken it as I should have.. never once more. Please notice the " physiological symptoms upon wd" which is craving which I have never had. I AM BY FAR SAYING I AM ANY BETTER THEN ANYONE ON HERE.. I MADE THAT CLEAR IN MY LAST POST IF YOU READ IT.. DOES NOT MATTER HOW WE GOT HERE WE ARE ALL IN THE SAME PLACE AND ARE LOOKING FOR HELP. Out of line was cheeky saying she " can read into what people post" I am a very blunt person so there is not need to read into.. its all out there... just all the hinting that I am a drug addict I am not ok with. I dont even know if chem dependant is the correct word... my body is addicted to the medication... it is used to having it and I will suffer wd without it. I really WELCOME all advice but what cheeky said was not advice.. telling me to re-think the chem dep and start thinking about addiction?? Anyway, cheeky is the one that posted and I replied to her. Not sure where you came in BUT I welcome cheekys input when its helping.. I am private with both of them. I still come on here because I feel it helpful to me and I post to other people which I will continue to do. I am in the same place everyone else is.. no matter how I got here...

[gmc012883]

Thanks mel , henry and robert. I do not mean to be ugly its not me but I am still someone who will notlet someone tell me what I should or should not or what I am or am not. So now that said to her I am over that. :-) now on focus again!! I cant wait.. I for sure see the light ( thanks to you all). I still say angels on land!!!!!!

[HenryNCBA]

Thanks mel , henry and robert. I do not mean to be ugly its not me but I am still someone who will notlet someone tell me what I should or should not or what I am or am not. So now that said to her I am over that. :-) now on focus again!! I cant wait.. I for sure see the light ( thanks to you all). I still say angels on land!!!!!!

Hello Gina,

First of all I am not going to get into the middle of all this. I am here to help Gina and that is what I am going to do period. We all have our beliefs and know what we know. As Gina stated not everyone knows everyone’s history especially in detail. Cheeky has gone through hell and is struggling with many factors but she has the guts to hang in there to try and get clean. I respect that and admire that tenacity. She WILL make it. Everyone is different so some just need the right "trigger" so to speak to open that particular door to walk through to "clean".
Gina, Melissa is a success story. She fought 3 true addictions and won. She is also in the process of moving on with her life personally and is now dealing with that aspect which is a very complex and perplexed situation. She also landed the job she has been looking for a very long time that was tough to get. Everyone here that knows her I am sure can tell from just the way she writes that her mind is razor sharp and no longer clouded as before. Opiates will do that to you and anyone. It is a wicked substance that people take for what ever reasons but the fact remains that if you stay on it for any length of time be it illicit or legitimate you will wind up right were we all are. The advantage we all have here over the rest of those out there is each other. We talk amongst ourselves and discuss things. Sometimes there is friction. We are all human and have feelings, emotions, and all the wonderful things that we want to improve to enjoy what is here. There is a big world out there for all of us to enjoy and not abuse. To not abuse we need to stop the abuse of anything right here which is why you are here. Everyone has valid points but Mottam said it best. Enough is enough so let’s move on.
I will get off my soap box now. Gina if you are somewhat confused about terminology I hope this helps.
Now I need to say this first. What I am about to list is NOT out of the dictionary or medical journal but what I have heard from doctors and others be it addicts, medical professionals, regular people and it sounds good enough for me.
Addict: One who is obsessed with one or many substances or items of addiction. Will think about this item and will do what ever is necessary to acquire said item to achieve the high, fulfillment or whatever goal they seek from use of said item.
Addicted: One that is physically, mentally, and emotionally affected but any particular item.
Addiction: Generalized term for being "hooked" on something be it drugs, booze, porn, stealing, baseball, gold, computers, what ever. Something that one can not just give up easily.
Chemical Dependence: When a body for example is dependant for said chemical. If said chemical is not introduced into body adverse reactions occur usually negative.
Chemical Tolerance: Where one’s body builds up immunity to any given item. Example is when one feels high when taking say 1 mg of any substance and in the matter of a couple weeks (more or less) that same 1 mg no longer provides the same feeling so the amount of substance is increased in order to feel the same effects or more than originally situated. This is why you see people taking well over a hundred pain pills in a day.
Chemically Dependant: One that takes substance be it legitimate or illicit for what ever reason but becomes hooked on said substance unknowingly and this person has unknowingly become addicted to said substance. This person may or may not be an “addict” but their body, emotions and mind are never the less affected.
Clean/Clean and Free: Term we use for being off said item completely. No longer consuming said item.
Dose/Dosage: Amount of item to be taken usually measured in Mg (milligrams).
Medication: Chemical or substance recommended and approved by governing entity for use for bettering health usually.
Mind/Mood Altering: A generic and very generalized term used to say that said item affects the way one thinks and feels mentally. Can be positive or negative and quite often both.
Substance Abuse: Any given item that is abused meaning not used in the correct format.
Substance Addiction: Same as Chemical Dependence but not necessarily a chemical.
Subs: Term, in our case, used for medication prescribed for specific us for detoxing and tapering off opiates. Originally coined from “Substitute” or short for Suboxone, Subutex, etc…
Symptoms: Variables of conditions at any given time, setting, feeling, emotion/s, etc… Eg: I have a back ache. Possible cause? Perhaps cleaning my yard and picking up too heavy of an object. In our case it can be sweating, chills, aches, bone pain, muscle pain, joint pain, depressed, anxious, etc…
Taper/Tapering: A narrowing down from large to small in our case going from more subs to less subs dosage being adjusted in smaller increments accordingly. Term used for the process of getting clean off opiates.

There are many others but in general these are the ones you will run across.

Gina going forward you are down to .75 mg per day. I upped you to this amount to help stabilize you as you were down to .25 mg per day from the original starting point of an 8mg pill which was scripted for “One 8mg tablet 3 times a day” which is a ridiculous amount. That was the same dose my sub doctor started me on and although I didn’t take that much because my gut told me something wasn’t right I did take 16 mg and for a few days felt terrible. You went down to 4mg then down to your final .25 mg per day in less than 2 weeks and I am positive that due to this super fast, large amount taper your system is reacting in a negative way. That much sub in your system all at one time then down to a tiny .25 mg per day in just about 10 days it is no wonder you are feeling crummy. I bumped you to .50 mg and you still didn’t feel very well so we increased to .75 per day. You take .25 in the morning about 09:00 and .50 mg about 4:00 pm. The larger amount in the evening so it will help carry you through the night as that time frame you go without for more hours to the morning dose. If you feel that you would rather take one dose instead of two then you can do that. Take the .75 mg about noon time to 2:00 pm to balance and help offset the splitting into two doses. The sliver you took of .25 mg is fine but unless you really feel you need it try not to depend on slivers as that will only prolong the taper and eventual “clean” goal. Your mind and body are trying to make sense of all that is happening and what you are feeling and this affects your emotions. It WILL cause you to be short, snap at people, indecisive, confused, hyper, depressed, anxious, and a ton of other things with many at the same time. I do not see the need to reinduct at this point as your system is still stabilizing from the large and rapid taper and basically it threw your system into a state of semi shock. Robert and I have been talking about you and we discuss the issues you are having. If you feel more comfortable talking privately you have my contact information and feel free to contact me at any time. It won’t hurt to keep you at this dosage for a few more days as I can see by the way you are writing that you are still stabilizing. This is natural and it WILL happen. Opiates are an evil and very wicked substance. Wonderful if used as it should be and that means that doctors use it for their patients with full knowledge of possible addiction/dependence to said substance. The scary thing that you experienced was you trusted your doctor/s and did as instructed thinking that they are trained medical professionals and would have know everything and one day you found out you were hooked on this substance. You knew nothing of this because you put complete faith in your medical team. They are human too though and are also prone to make mistakes. The problem with that though is a doctor will not tell you then don’t know or made a mistake as there is a suit waiting to happen. The advantage of all of us here on the forum is a combined years of knowledge and experience that no medical professional can come close to as we all are the real deal and have been there and done that or we know of someone close we are supporting and know what it feels like to go through the logistics of said perplexity.
I will talk with you later today and see exactly how you feel. Personally if you choose I see no problem staying where you are at for a few days more then proceeding to the next lower dose.

Henry

[newyorkgal]

Gina, you ARE a nice person and the last thing I want is to get into a sparring match with you. We all need help. I guess the addict, addiction definition is just semantics and unimportant in my personal opinion. You are correct when you say we all end up in the same place. I understand you never used for pleasure, never overused and it is shame that the meds got you to the point you are at today. I was just surprised because I read cheeky's post and thought she was only trying to be kind and helpful and you came back at her hard. It's unimportant, You are certainly in good hands with Henry. He's been there done that. ANd the same goes for Melissa. I wish you the very very best of luck with your taper and staying drug free. I know you will be successful at it, especially with the help you have.

Robert, what I meant was chemical dependence, addiction, whatever you wanna call it; we all end up in the same place in the end. Some take it per doc's orders, some swallow em like candy, some take it for pleasure, some for real and true pain. We all end up unable to stop on our own. That's all I meant. I don't think the name you call it is the important thing. It's how we deal with it that matters. This is my personal opinion. No "blasting" is EVER going to happen. We are adults and can be civil, in spite of all that's happened and even when we don't agree.

[cheekysod]

i guess i hit a nerve calling you an addict then,


my bad, obviously those withdrawls, and creepy crawlies, and sweats and all that, not to mention the mental stuff, is for some other reason, than drug addiction .

hey call it what you want. good on ya

i just hope you kick its butt and get well

[mottam]

gmc012883:
How are you doing?
Just stay focused like a laser on the path you have chosen - it is ALL about you right now.
It is tough when you are going through this and you get some flack on your thread.
Stick to your plan; work with whom you are working. I know them from this forum and from talking to them via email, telephone - good people who know their stuff.
Any other posts that offer nothing then 100% support is background noise - treat it as such.

You can and will make it through this. In life, business, etc. you become successful by using the tools of those who are successful - stick with your current path.

In my prayers.

Kindest Regards
mottam

[cheekysod]

i have always given gina 100% support since she came to this forum.

the truth hurts, gina im sorry if i hit a nerve, it doesnt matter how you became addicted, but the fact remains that you are. my post was not meant to get you angry but get you off that track of thinkin you are different.

i wish you all the best with your taper, and your "recovery",
no one can say i don't mean that either, coz they dont know.

cheeky

[newyorkgal]

Erica, it is so nice to see you back here. You were a sane voice for sure. Why not stick around for awhile. There a re alot of people who could use your wise words...I, for one, have missed you here. Hope all is well in your neck of the woods. Well I know it is since I do see you on FB but hope everything is GREAT!!!!

[EricaMarie]

Thanks so much! I've been great! Still stable on my methadone, going back to school (that's where I've been ALOT too) and happy! I will stick around, I've missed it. If my story can help just one person then it's more than worth it to me! going to send ya an email in a few! xoxo

[Melissa B]

Proud of you girl for sticking it out and getting clean. I know it was a struggle but you've done great, even with the ups and downs, and deserve a big old pat on the back! Just wanted to acknowledge your accomplishment. You're a winner! You never have to use again. God bless.

Thank You Robert! Really appreciate your support and feedback. Life has never felt so right and I do feel like a winner. It's as if a huge weight has been lifted from me and now I feel like I can go anywhere and do anything that I put my heart into. It's funny that when you finally decide that you've had enough it all seems to happen miraculously. Your sub plan really does make it easy to do and it was only fear that was holding me back. I thank my lucky stars everyday that I found this forum and the wonderful people on it. My life will never be the same and that is a good thing! Thanks again and have a wonderful day!

Peace
Melissa