Glad to be here

[icandoitin08]

I am so excited to be posting here! I have been reading posts for the past few months.

I am looking for support! I am 35, married with two kids and I am addicted to Hydro! Hydro has taken over my life, it is not even fun anymore. I have been abusing for 4 years. I have tried many times to stop and I am sure you know the side effects. I have tried cold turkey as well as tapering down. Tapering down is the worst, everytime I have tried that I end up taking more that day than any other. I will admit that I am not strong enough to do it on my own. I have been taking 20-30 hydro per day, either 10 or 7.5mg. I take 4-6 at once depending on the mgs. I have been wanting to quit for some time now. I had knee surgery three weeks ago. I have been waiting to get that over with, I did not want to stop before surgery knowing that I would be given and actually need some pain relief.

Finally, this week I got set up with a Dr. and got my first script for Suboxone! I am excited and nervous. Robert, I am hoping to have some input from you. You really know what you are talking about it and from what I have read, you tell it like it is.

Saturday is my big day. I am all set to take my first dose Saturday evening . The Dr wants me to be feeling some w/d effects before taking the first dose. I do have hydro and I am going to take every last one that I have between now and then. I am sure that sounds stupid...

Thank you all for taking the time to read my hopefully first of many posts. I need support and I have seen how great you all support each other on this site.

[Psyched]

ican,
Congrats! I hope you do well and it seems you have been reading the posts as Robert is a WEALTH of information. He will truly help you out. Good luck and keep posting.

[melinda7.5]

Hi icandoitin08
This is a great site,I found all the support I needed here to help me get off drugs.I was addicted to oxycontin and hydro's.I have been clean for about 3 months now.you will get through this and we would love to help support you.
I cant wait to see all of your progress, I so excited for you...
Talk to you soon, Melinda

[Robert_325]

I am so excited to be posting here! I have been reading posts for the past few months.

I am looking for support! I am 35, married with two kids and I am addicted to Hydro! Hydro has taken over my life, it is not even fun anymore. I have been abusing for 4 years. I have tried many times to stop and I am sure you know the side effects. I have tried cold turkey as well as tapering down. Tapering down is the worst, everytime I have tried that I end up taking more that day than any other. I will admit that I am not strong enough to do it on my own. I have been taking 20-30 hydro per day, either 10 or 7.5mg. I take 4-6 at once depending on the mgs. I have been wanting to quit for some time now. I had knee surgery three weeks ago. I have been waiting to get that over with, I did not want to stop before surgery knowing that I would be given and actually need some pain relief.

Finally, this week I got set up with a Dr. and got my first script for Suboxone! I am excited and nervous. Robert, I am hoping to have some input from you. You really know what you are talking about it and from what I have read, you tell it like it is.

Saturday is my big day. I am all set to take my first dose Saturday evening . The Dr wants me to be feeling some w/d effects before taking the first dose. I do have hydro and I am going to take every last one that I have between now and then. I am sure that sounds stupid...

Thank you all for taking the time to read my hopefully first of many posts. I need support and I have seen how great you all support each other on this site.

I will be happy to help you anyway that I can. I am up early this morning as I have some important business to take care of for my church today that has to be done before noon. We are providing a huge Thanksgiving dinner in Houston for those who might otherwise have nothing and I have some newspaper advertising to wrap up this morning. Won't be on the forum long but will be back later today and will be happy to help you then. You can count on me being here to give you some suggestions. I am just commited to taking care of some church obligations first this morning. Wanted you to see that I was aware of your post and that I would be in touch. We will talk later today. God bless.

[money_chick]

Oh, your habit sounds so much like mine, and I did it cold turkey. You can do this, and on the other side of this nasty addiction you will find so much happiness.

I've been clean, finally, for.... 47 days? I stopped counting. Its so much NOT a part of my life now that I STOPPED COUNTING!

I have money. I just bought a 32 foot travel trailer and a 4 door truck. WITH CASH! I couldnt do that three months ago!


Follow Roberts advice to a TEE. Listen to him, he knows his stuff. He is a true hero to me. Without him and INAM (who detoxed with me and became a good friend) I would still be wd'ing, relapsing, wd'ing, relapsing... you get the picture.

I wish you the best of luck. I've been remiss in my duties here, but I'm back now. If you need to talk, about whatever, POST. We will help all we can. We've all been there and understand your frustration, cravings and fear.

God bless you!

[icandoitin08]

Robert, Money-chick,Melinda and Psyched. Thank you all so much for your fast responses! I am grateful to all of you that you are willing to help me, a complete stranger! After I get through this I hope that I can be an inspiration to a newcomer like myself!
Tomorrow is my start day, I am going to hold out as long as I can before I take the suboxone, that is what the Dr suggested. She said when I think I cant take it anylonger try to hold out a bit longer and take a small piece of the tablet. I am going to pick up the meds on my lunch break today. I am very fortunate that my health insurance covers the meds for 30 days. I cant wait to start saving money again. I have drained all of our accounts and all of our bills are serioulsy past due, including our rent. I hope that down the road my husband will learn to love and trust me again, I am sure this is going to take some time but I am willing to wait as long as it takes. I wouldn't trust myself if I were him!

Thanks againg to you all,
Cheryl

[icandoitin08]

47 days on your own, that is so amazing! congratulations to you, I cant wait until I can say that myself!

Oh, your habit sounds so much like mine, and I did it cold turkey. You can do this, and on the other side of this nasty addiction you will find so much happiness.

I've been clean, finally, for.... 47 days? I stopped counting. Its so much NOT a part of my life now that I STOPPED COUNTING!

I have money. I just bought a 32 foot travel trailer and a 4 door truck. WITH CASH! I couldnt do that three months ago!


Follow Roberts advice to a TEE. Listen to him, he knows his stuff. He is a true hero to me. Without him and INAM (who detoxed with me and became a good friend) I would still be wd'ing, relapsing, wd'ing, relapsing... you get the picture.

I wish you the best of luck. I've been remiss in my duties here, but I'm back now. If you need to talk, about whatever, POST. We will help all we can. We've all been there and understand your frustration, cravings and fear.

God bless you!

[musicman48]

Robert, Money-chick,Melinda and Psyched. Thank you all so much for your fast responses! I am grateful to all of you that you are willing to help me, a complete stranger! After I get through this I hope that I can be an inspiration to a newcomer like myself!
Tomorrow is my start day, I am going to hold out as long as I can before I take the suboxone, that is what the Dr suggested. She said when I think I cant take it anylonger try to hold out a bit longer and take a small piece of the tablet. I am going to pick up the meds on my lunch break today. I am very fortunate that my health insurance covers the meds for 30 days. I cant wait to start saving money again. I have drained all of our accounts and all of our bills are serioulsy past due, including our rent. I hope that down the road my husband will learn to love and trust me again, I am sure this is going to take some time but I am willing to wait as long as it takes. I wouldn't trust myself if I were him!

Thanks againg to you all,
Cheryl

We will all be here for you.Congrats on your decision to get clean! Good luck to you! Listen closely to Robert.His advice is priceless.Way to go !

[icandoitin08]

Hello, I thank you all again for your support. I must admit I am very nervous to start the Subs. I keep reading good and bad on here. Robert can you fill me in on your experiences please? How long should I plan on being on the subs? I have been takling 20-30 hydro a day for over two years. The amount of money I have invested in getting the subs I dont want to go to waste. I want this to be successful! I had planned on starting this past Saturday, but, being the addict that I am I called my suregon and asked for some more pain meds, which by the way, I dont even need anymore! I picked up my subs today, that was a big step for me. They gave me 8/2mg.

Robert I am really counting on your advice on how you would go on from here... I am at the end of the rope. If this does not work I am scared this will be the end for me, my poor husband cant take anymore of my bs! I have put him through it and I have alot of making up to do.

Thanks again everyone for taking the time to share with me.
Cheryl

[Robert_325]

Hello, I thank you all again for your support. I must admit I am very nervous to start the Subs. I keep reading good and bad on here. Robert can you fill me in on your experiences please? How long should I plan on being on the subs? I have been takling 20-30 hydro a day for over two years. The amount of money I have invested in getting the subs I dont want to go to waste. I want this to be successful! I had planned on starting this past Saturday, but, being the addict that I am I called my suregon and asked for some more pain meds, which by the way, I dont even need anymore! I picked up my subs today, that was a big step for me. They gave me 8/2mg.

Robert I am really counting on your advice on how you would go on from here... I am at the end of the rope. If this does not work I am scared this will be the end for me, my poor husband cant take anymore of my bs! I have put him through it and I have alot of making up to do.

Thanks again everyone for taking the time to share with me.
Cheryl

Cheryl ... you need to be off ALL your pain medication for AT LEAST 24 hours depending on the w/d symptoms you experience prior to starting the suboxone. If you start too soon after stopping the RX opiates you will not have a successful induction. In fact you will most likely go into precipitated w/d. That isn't fun at all.

I can help you with this if you want me to. I do it every day. You can expect to be completely off all opiates including the suboxone within 60 days maximum and probably less if you will do this exactly as I suggest. If you are committed to following specific instructions and really getting past all this let me know and we can start making a realistic plan for you.

Following the time on suboxone you need to also start getting into a plan of recovery to make your chances for longterm success greater. It's relatively simple to get clean but staying clean forever is what will save your marriage, your integrity and your life. We have all hurt those we love but do this for you and not your husband. You've got to do this for yourself if it's going to last for the rest of your life.

How much suboxone did the dr prescribe? How often did he say to take it? Did he just give you a script and send you on your way? God bless.

[longroad9785]

How much suboxone did the dr prescribe? How often did he say to take it? Did he just give you a script and send you on your way? God bless.

Just to give you advice to help you help robert help you... lol... This is a very important question. VERY VERY IMPORTANT.

The first few visits to a doc will tell him everything he needs to know about what you have to go on. I've seen far too many people fumble this part up and not talk about the process so that we end up hearing about 5 different ways that the first dosage was set.

Did he do an incremental dosing where he starts with 2mg, waits, then another 2, then waits... so on and so forth? Or did he just talk to you and write you a script?

Details details.

But on another note: Best of luck to you! The journey is easier than you think, you just have to stick to the directions. It will get better!

[icandoitin08]

I went in to get the script, I think she was shocked because I knew much about the drug, probably not enough though.

She told me to wait until i start to feel w/d then try to hold out as long as I can, to break a tiny bit off the tablet and put under my tongue. wait for an hour, if no reactions take the rest of the pill.

she gave me 8mg and told me to take 2xs per day or all at once, which ever I prefer.

Robert, I am willing to follow whatever guidelines you are willing to set up for me. Like I said before, I have been watching your posts for over a month now and I feel confident in you.

THanks
Cheryl

[Robert_325]

longroad is so right. Some people think this is a one-size-fits-all therapy. It's not a deal like "take two aspirin and call me tomorrow." We are all different and this medication needs to be dosed symptomatically. That is why I try to talk to those using subs on this forum almost daily. It's very important.

If you are planning on starting tomorrow as your post suggests it sounds like the dr just wrote a script and sent you down the road. If that is the case we can still make it okay but you need to share all the details of what is going on here with me so I don't tell you something wrong. Starting out on the right foot is very important. If the induction doesn't go properly you will have fits doing this right. Talk to me. God bless.

[Robert_325]

I went in to get the script, I think she was shocked because I knew much about the drug, probably not enough though.

She told me to wait until i start to feel w/d then try to hold out as long as I can, to break a tiny bit off the tablet and put under my tongue. wait for an hour, if no reactions take the rest of the pill.

she gave me 8mg and told me to take 2xs per day or all at once, which ever I prefer.

Robert, I am willing to follow whatever guidelines you are willing to set up for me. Like I said before, I have been watching your posts for over a month now and I feel confident in you.

THanks
Cheryl

Cheryl,

That was what I thought had happened. Forget what you were told. This is a little more exact than what she said. It DOES make a difference how you do this and NO WAY you need to take two 8mg pills a day. This dr is typical of the problems with this medication.

My link is not coming up for some reason so go to Google and type in clinical opiate withdrawl scale. This is known as a COWS worksheet. It explains in detail how to determine if you are in severe enough w/d to begin. You MUST score at least a 26 when you score your w/d symptoms. That places you in moderately severe w/d. And you need to be objective and don't cut yourself any slack when doing this. The induction is so important. Let me know after you study the COWS sheet and then we will proceed forward. God bless.

[Robert_325]

Here is the COWS link

http://www.suboxone.com/pdfs/OWR.pdf

This is the worksheet from my previous post. My Adobe Reader was acting up for some reason.

[longroad9785]

I went in to get the script, I think she was shocked because I knew much about the drug, probably not enough though.

She told me to wait until i start to feel w/d then try to hold out as long as I can, to break a tiny bit off the tablet and put under my tongue. wait for an hour, if no reactions take the rest of the pill.

she gave me 8mg and told me to take 2xs per day or all at once, which ever I prefer.

Robert, I am willing to follow whatever guidelines you are willing to set up for me. Like I said before, I have been watching your posts for over a month now and I feel confident in you.

THanks
Cheryl

Wow. I would strongly recommend either not goin back to this doc (unless you just need more meds to continue with Robert helping you) or calling her up and confronting her about why she isn't following the proper steps to induct/dose you.

Seriously, its like she did the complete opposite of what she was supposed to. Seriously.

Regardless, you have an abundance of meds to be flexible with for the time being. 16mg is the brand recommended dose for everyone. The reality is that it shouldn't ever take that much, and everyone is different. Mu receptors are still mostly a mystery to the world, especially Rx company reps who follow a script when telling docs what to do.

You're in the right place!

[icandoitin08]

Here is the COWS link

http://www.suboxone.com/pdfs/OWR.pdf

This is the worksheet from my previous post. My Adobe Reader was acting up for some reason.

I went to the link, I printed out the sheet and will use tomorrow and get with you. So how much should I take tomorrow when I cant stand it any longer?

[longroad9785]

All I can say is that since you know what w/d is like, start accepting it. Luckily with Sub, it will be gone as soon as you complete the first few steps. You need to be in moderate w/d at the very least. When you're at least 24 hours out from the last dose of your meds, and really its better to be farther, you can bust out your sheet and do your very best to honestly score yourself on it.

The rest is Robert, but you're in great hands, so just be ready to take the w/d up front, and realize that if you do this right, thats all you'll have to experience.

I can tell you that my doctor brought me in for 1/2 a day and would do a very simple process: take my vitals, do the COWS sheet, and then administer 2mg. We'd wait a little over an hour and come back in and do all of that over again. When I hit 4mg, my w/d was COMPLETELY gone. I can't explain to you this feeling, as you're going to experience it soon, but follow the steps. Understand that Sub is a very powerful medication and dosing it just right is the best way to ensure a great experience with it.

So basically, get ready to feel awful, and then you'll feel great.

[Robert_325]

I went to the link, I printed out the sheet and will use tomorrow and get with you. So how much should I take tomorrow when I cant stand it any longer?

Longroad offered very good advice. The thing is that the way your dr said to do this induction will stop your w/d symptoms but you want to do this at the lowest effective dose possible. It may take you 8mg instead of 4mg like it did longroad and if it does that is okay. But why automatically take a pre-determined amount that you likely won't need like the high dose the dr suggested? Starting at the right dose will help you get this over with and have you off everything in a short amount of time. Start out just like longroad suggested with 2mg and add 2mg every hour until the w/d symptoms are COMPLETELY gone. You should feel great after the induction. That is how you know you have taken the correct amount. You should feel completely normal. Talk with me when you are doing this. I will be able to help you. God bless.

[icandoitin08]

Longroad offered very good advice. The thing is that the way your dr said to do this induction will stop your w/d symptoms but you want to do this at the lowest effective dose possible. It may take you 8mg instead of 4mg like it did longroad and if it does that is okay. But why automatically take a pre-determined amount that you likely won't need like the high dose the dr suggested? Starting at the right dose will help you get this over with and have you off everything in a short amount of time. Start out just like longroad suggested with 2mg and add 2mg every hour until the w/d symptoms are COMPLETELY gone. You should feel great after the induction. That is how you know you have taken the correct amount. You should feel completely normal. Talk with me when you are doing this. I will be able to help you. God bless.

Thank you both so much for your fast replies. I will take your advice. I am going to hold out as long as I possibly can. Knowing that relief will be coming should make it more bearable. I am going to take 2mg wait an hour and if still not feeling good gor for 2mg more. I will post progress tomorrow evening if that works do I take anymore the first day or just the 4mg? Reading through your posts I am guessing when I find the dose that works I should stick with that about 4 days? Then decrease 25% for four days?

My insuance only covers the first 30 days of meds so being that i got the 8mg and can get 4 doses out of one pill, that is good news to me.

After all is said and done I will be talking to the dr. about how they handle their process but for now I need them so if I do need another script I can get it.

You guys are all so great on here. Thank you for taking the time to help me! I hope I can return the favor to someone in need when I get my act together!

Fondly,
Cheryl

[icandoitin08]

for the aches and pains that go along with the w/d can I take motrin or tylenol? Any recomendations? I see alot of talk about imodium so I picked up some of that. I just dont want any interactions with the sub.
Cheryl

[Robert_325]

I am not trying to make this harder on you than necessary but if you try to take a bunch of stuff for w/d it will be harder to tell accurately if you are ready to be inducted. You should not have diarrhea the first 24 hours and I really don't want you to take anything for the other symptoms. You need to be able to see them plainly. Don't take anything. Just drink water and eat if you feel like it. You can make it for a day or so. Remember that when this is over you will be clean forever. You could stand on your head for one day if you had to. It will all be okay. You will be glad you did this when its over.

There is no limit (within reason) to the amount of suboxone you can take during induction. The amount of 4mg was an example longroad used and it was what worked for him. 4mg would be wonderful for you but it took 12mg to stabilize me when I was inducted. But then I backed off to 8mg when induction was over after three days. So as long as you begin at 2mg and increase in 2mg incraments you will be okay. Give it an hour at each level. That allows you time to be sure you are stable before calling it quits. I don't want you just better when you stop increasing, I want you to feel GOOD. Not high but straight.

Let me know how badly you feel tomorrow when you think you are getting ready for induction. Touch base regardless and let me know how you are doing. You will soon be completely clean. God bless.

[icandoitin08]

I am not trying to make this harder on you than necessary but if you try to take a bunch of stuff for w/d it will be harder to tell accurately if you are ready to be inducted. You should not have diarrhea the first 24 hours and I really don't want you to take anything for the other symptoms. You need to be able to see them plainly. Don't take anything. Just drink water and eat if you feel like it. You can make it for a day or so. Remember that when this is over you will be clean forever. You could stand on your head for one day if you had to. It will all be okay. You will be glad you did this when its over.

There is no limit (within reason) to the amount of suboxone you can take during induction. The amount of 4mg was an example longroad used and it was what worked for him. 4mg would be wonderful for you but it took 12mg to stabilize me when I was inducted. But then I backed off to 8mg when induction was over after three days. So as long as you begin at 2mg and increase in 2mg incraments you will be okay. Give it an hour at each level. That allows you time to be sure you are stable before calling it quits. I don't want you just better when you stop increasing, I want you to feel GOOD. Not high but straight.

Let me know how badly you feel tomorrow when you think you are getting ready for induction. Touch base regardless and let me know how you are doing. You will soon be completely clean. God bless.

Robert, I am shocked about the diarehha, I have been having it for the past three hours. I feel like little suckers are eating my intestines. I also am getting very warm then cold. Cant concentrate. Runny nose

[Robert_325]

So how long has it been since you took your last pills? Usually the diarrhea takes a little longer than just a few hours into the detox but this could be a blessing in reality. Some people struggle for over a day getting to where they can start successfully on the suboxone. You seem to be getting close pretty quickly. So try to keep focused on the positive side of this. I know that is difficult when you barely leave the bathroom and you find yourself heading straight back again. So how long has it been Cheryl? Describe your symptoms briefly but mention all of them if you can sit long enough to type. I think you are getting really close from the little bit you have shared. Talk to me. God bless.

[icandoitin08]

[QUOTE=Robert_325;215680]So how long has it been since you took your last pills? Usually the diarrhea takes a little longer than just a few hours into the detox but this could be a blessing in reality. Some people struggle for over a day getting to where they can start successfully on the suboxone. You seem to be getting close pretty quickly. So try to keep focused on the positive side of this. I know that is difficult when you barely leave the bathroom and you find yourself heading straight back again. So how long has it been Cheryl? Describe your symptoms briefly but mention all of them if you can sit long enough to type. I think you are getting really close from the little bit you have shared. Talk to me. God bless. [/QUOT

it has been 19 hours, Very hot and pickey, gnawing in the stomache,
not all they way there yet

[icandoitin08]

forgot to mention terribly runny nose! sweating pretty good

seems like in the past when I would not have the pills i would w/d like this until i landed some hydros

[Robert_325]

You are getting very close Cheryl. You're only talking about a short time remaining before you begin the induction. Forgive me for laughing but I do this every day and everyone has different descriptions for things like the way you describe the little suckers eating your intestines. That is a really accurate way to describe it. I know this isn't fun at all. You know we have our dues to pay for our errors in judgement that landed us in this spot.

I will be here on and off all day and I am watching for your posts. I know you want to get started on the suboxone so you can get some relief. The place you are at right now is a drag. I always pray that people will remember this when they have a little clean time and begin to forget the misery that they caused themself getting into the opiates.

I will be watching for you to post. I can see that you are doing this part of the process correctly and not allowing yourself too much sympathy with your symptoms. It isn't necessary to overdo it though. I hardly ever tell anyone that as most people want to start the subs the first time they pass gas. You are doing very well. Remember that you can begin the induction as soon as you hit the 26 score. You don't do better on the subs if you wait until you hit a 35. As soon as you are satisfied that you are at 26 let me know and I will walk you through this. God bless.

[icandoitin08]

[QUOTE=Robert_325;215683]You are getting very close Cheryl. You're only talking about a short time remaining before you begin the induction. Forgive me for laughing but I do this every day and everyone has different descriptions for things like the way you describe the little suckers eating your intestines. That is a really accurate way to describe it. I know this isn't fun at all. You know we have our dues to pay for our errors in judgement that landed us in this spot.

I will be here on and off all day and I am watching for your posts. I know you want to get started on the suboxone so you can get some relief. The place you are at right now is a drag. I always pray that people will remember this when they have a little clean time and begin to forget the misery that they caused themself getting into the opiates.

I will be watching for you to post. I can see that you are doing this part of the process correctly and not allowing yourself too much sympathy with your symptoms. It isn't necessary to overdo it though. I hardly ever tell anyone that as most people want to start the subs the first time they pass gas. You are doing very well. Remember that you can begin the induction as soon as you hit the 26 score. You don't do better on the subs if you wait until you hit a 35. As soon as you are satisfied that you are at 26 let me know and I will walk you through this. God bless. [/QUOTE

I just scored a 20! six more to go, I did not answer the pupil question, i cant judge that

[icandoitin08]

Ok, how long are we talking now. I cant stand this gnawing in the stomache! Now I am getting scared that the subs arnt going to work for me, what if they dont.... what if i have a reaction... i am getting a bit panicked here

[longroad9785]

Don't worry Cheryl, they work . I felt the same way right before I took my first dose. I started to panick thinking I may be doing it too soon, that maybe I'd throw myself deeper into w/d.

But you know what? It'll all be over soon, just hang in there! Subs work, and you're gonna make it through this .