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Dr. Shopping
  1. #1
    Rangers is offline Member
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    Unhappy Dr. Shopping

    Hope someone can help as I did something real stupid. I suffer from two bad diseases, Crones disease for 38 years, and and I am a Type2 diabetic and have a bad naopathy in my feet. (irriversable nerve damage) Both are incredibilly painful. I have had 4 surgeries from the crones. I have a pain Dr. who is very strict. I have been seeing for about 7 months. I lost my script on a business trip. I told him and he said he could not rewrite them, and I would have to wait until my next office visit. Instead I went to two Drs. and my dentist. They each wrote me a script, two for percs, different strength, and 1 vicodin ES. It was enough to hold me over. I paid cash for 2 of them, insurance for the third. These transactions were filled at the very end of September. I immediately stopped the insanity. I have an appointment with my Oct. 9th. I read on line that most states including N.Y. participate in a centralized computer program called: Prescription Monitoring Program or PMP. They issue whats called a Threshold Report, which goes to Drs. and pharmacies notifying them if a patient is filling duplicate controlled substances. This report is sent out every 3 months or quarterly. Assuming I never do this again, which I won't, cause it's driving me crazy. Is there anyone out there who would know if there is the possibilty of them not catching me? Please help as I am scared to death. It will be devistating on my family.

    Thanks....Fred

  2. #2
    Freedom4me is offline Advanced Member
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    Fred,
    I don't know too much about this but I have read tons of stories on here. Assuming you don't do this again I think you will be ok. There are a couple of posters on here that have been caught dr. shopping and not much happened. I'm sure they will chime in and give you some reassuring news. Glad you learned your lesson and I am very sorry for all of your pain. Are you thinking about quitting all the medication? Do you think you have an addiction problem? This is the place to be if that is the case. Melinda and Robert can help you decide what is the best way for you to get off all these pills whether it be tapering off, going cold turkey or using suboxone. Best wishes Fred

  3. #3
    Rangers is offline Member
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    Unhappy Dr. Shopping-i need your help!

    I would really very much appreciate it if some people out there can help me with my thread--------Dr. Shopping. I am scared to death. If you all can shead some light maybe I can get some sleep tonight. Please see my thread titiled Dr. Shopping.

    I could use your support.....Fred:

  4. #4
    Magdalena12 is offline Member
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    Dear Fred:

    I'm an no expert on the subject of Dr. shopping but I'll tell you what little I know, as I am an RN and have worked in Drs. offices, hospitals and as a pharmacy assistant when I was very young.

    As far as I know, this "Prescription Monitoring Program" is a fairly new thing and many states do not have it in place yet. I do know that doctor offices CAN send a list of their patient's to the DEA and the DEA can track every prescription you have had filled and can notify the physician's office of your prescription drug usage, but this is only if the physician's office fills out the necessary forms and requests that information from them. There is one doctor in the town I live in that routinely does this, sends a list of his patient's to them, then, if anyone is getting pain medication elsewhere, he sends them a letter discharging them from his care. They can do this because when you first see the doctor you almost always sign an authorization for "release of medical records", allowing that physician to obtain medical information about you from almost anyone if he feels it is relevant to he/she treating you.

    Did you have all the prescriptions filled at the same pharmacy? If so, even if you payed cash, chances are they will notify your pain management physician. If you had them filled at different pharmacies and paid cash for them, you are probably okay.

    I believe it will not be long before it is impossible for people to doctor shop once this "prescription monitoring program" is implemented, which I think will be soon, as I heard on the news that President Obama wants it up and running in all states ASAP.

    I hope you learned your lesson, it's just not a good thing to do, most doctors will immediately either stop prescribing for you, or discharge you from their care if notified.

    Good luck Fred and I am sorry you have to deal with your medical issues.

    Best Wishes,

    mags

  5. #5
    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    Fred .... Mags is correct. It's a toss of the coin and that is all anyone can say. If you get caught your dr will likely release you immediately as their license can be compromised and no dr is going to risk his/her livelihood to protect someone who went to multiple drs to purchase the same controlled substance. You'll know soon enough but NO ONE can tell you for sure what will happen.

    What you did is against the law and you can be arrested. You would likely get a probated sentence if you don't have a criminal record. You'll just have to wait and see what happens. You'll know within thirty days I would think. Good luck and God bless.
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

  6. #6
    Rangers is offline Member
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    Dear Mags,

    Thanks for your reply. The 3 scrips were all filled at different pharmacies. Two of them were for cash, the third one was on my insurance. When I get my scrips (if I get my scrips) from my pain doc. it will also be filled at a different pharmacy. I am really nervous. I am not the type as I had a DWI (misdomeanor) over 3 years ago. That's the extent of it. I do not drink anymore. It's been over a year since I had my last drink. Can you shed somore light?

    Thganks...Fred

  7. #7
    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    Fred ... if your not under suspicion by the dr or pharmacies you'll likely slide through this okay. If they have a reason to be watching you then the probable outcome is obvious.

    No one can tell you what will happen saying it's for sure. You SHOULD be nervous for what you did. It's against the law and they could cuff you and drag you out of your home. They probably won't but you broke the law and the authorities take what you did seriously. So I surely wouldn't do it again.

    We have a tendency to be sorry when we think we may get caught at something. lol I'm not judging you, I've done worse trust me. Just don't do it again and pray. That's my best advice. I will keep you in my prayers. Keep us posted if you hear anything. God bless.
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

  8. #8
    iloerose is offline Platinum Member
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    Fred,

    As Robert says, no one can tell you for certain what will happen. Any doctor or pharmacy can pull a PMP (in states that have this computerized service). Doctors, emergency rooms, etc. all have a name and password to connect to the PMP. Doctors use this service to monitor pain patients (some of them and where this service is up and running).
    Sometimes pharmacies pick up on controlled medications that are overlapping, especially through insurance. Then they may contact your doctor. If they do the doctor could drop you, or worse as mags and robert say. Since you paid cash for two and went insurance on one, you may not have any problems, but no one can say for sure. Overlapping prescriptions, ie. prescription for the same thing from different doctors may show up at the pharmacy.
    I have been caught by a doctor when I was taking 10-12 pills a day. He helped me to get off these things. I will never, never do that again. If you are getting too caught up with pills, that you think you need more than your script says, stop now. DO NOT get caught up Dr. Shopping. My heart seizes when I think about this.

    Peace,

    IloeRose

  9. #9
    Freedom4me is offline Advanced Member
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    Rangers,
    iIthink you need to look at the bigger problem, and that is why you are doctor shopping? I am NOT judging you my friend, we have all been there, but the "lost the script" line is not enough to do a google search on the Internet and I know the docs have heard much better stories. My bosses wife is a doctor and some of the stories she has heard have prevented me from using them lol. I spilled pepsi on a script when i was 20 and got my wisdom teeth pulled and didnt think twice about calling my doc, which he rewrote right away. But back in Feb of this year? It would have been an excuse because I was thinking of over using my medication. Rangers, i was you. I know about real pain that tuns into the temptaion to over use. You are not alone and it is not your fault. It just happens slowly. You are in the best place to help you quit. I hope you decide to do that. I will be here for you all the way.

  10. #10
    fragile1 is offline New Member
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    Rangers: Based on what you had written that concerns you, you're fine with what you have done-(with the scripts that you paid cash for). You put the 3rd script through your insurance? If that's the case, when you go to your PM Dr. on Oct. 9, as long as what you recently put through your insurance is 1) a different medication or 2) same medication, different dosage, then it will be fine to have them both put through your insurance. If they are indeed the same med, same dosage, then I would pay cash for your visit on Oct. 9 - bring to another Pharmacy, also. Good Luck to you~

  11. #11
    Rangers is offline Member
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    Dear Fragile1,

    In your reply, I realize that you said I should pay for the upcoming scrips in cash, but did you also mean I should pay for the office visit in cash also? The reason I ask is I had obviously put the other Drs. visits thru my insurance. Will the insurance co. red flag so many office visits in such a short window? Also, I found it very strange that even though I paid cash at a national pharmacy chain in NY, the next day when I went to another ntl. chain in NJ, the pharmacist said you filled for a different pain med yesterday, be careful not to take them both together! They were different meds. He filled it anyway without hesitation. Look forward to hearing from soon.

  12. #12
    Freedom4me is offline Advanced Member
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    Rangers,
    I wouldn't worry too much about the Dr chopping if you are not going to do it anymore. Best wishes. I know this will all work out ok.

  13. #13
    fragile1 is offline New Member
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    Hi Rangers: Hope all is well w/you. I read your post and in response to it; no Red Flag w/the amount of office visits. It's the insurance through the Pharmacy that one needs to be concerned about. Cash and carry, you're fine. Regarding when you went to two Pharmacies; one in NY, one in NJ, and they made mention to you about you having filled a pain med in the other Pharm? I can't fathom that unless of course, you had indeed put one through your insurance. There is no paper trail w/cash. I'm sure that I will get some kind of backlash w/feeding you this info, but in all actuality, I've been there before and being you don't seem to make a habit of this not to mention, you seem to be shaken up enough and worried about having done so, that I am sure what "knowledge" re: "Dr. Shopping" that you are learning, w/be used only this one time, out of necessity. And...as I know the feeling, the apprehension, etc., in also knowing what I was doing was wrong, I feel that by giving you this advice that someone should look out for you and not badger you for a lesson you seemed to have learned. P.S. Don't expend any more of your energy in worrying anymore about this - learn from it, right? Let it go and things will work out for you. I hope you found this helpful. Best of luck to you~
    Last edited by fragile1; 10-06-2009 at 05:53 PM. Reason: wanted to insert a smiley

  14. #14
    Rangers is offline Member
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    Dear Fragile,

    Yes, I have truley learned from my stupidity. Don't worry about giving me advise. I will never even think about doing this again. I would rather be out of meds altogether. I have lost way too much sleep as it is. I can thank people such as yourself and others who showed compassion along with my higher power!
    P.S. I really did pay cash to the Natl. chain that said he saw that I received a different pain med the day before. maybe it is possible that the big Ntl. chains are tied into one another. Anyway thanks agin....Ranger

  15. #15
    Freedom4me is offline Advanced Member
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    Ranger,
    I hope things turn out well for you. I'm very sure it will. Please be careful with your pain medications. I know from experience. I was up to my prescibed dose of 8 vicodin per day and I tap danced with the idea of going over that dose or upping the type of narcotic I was taking to Norco. I ended up going cold turkey and realized that I could handle the pain w motrin, etc. Real pain is real pain. I understand that but no matter what you take, if you take it long term you will become dependant and develope a tolerance. That is just a fact. I hope Fragiles post was not an implication that I was being insensitive to you. I don't think it was but I just want you to be very careful. I am very sorry you have pain and I know how you feel, I've been there. Best of luck and I think you will be fine with the pharmacy thing.

  16. #16
    iloerose is offline Platinum Member
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    Ranger, Where I agree with much of what fragile is saying about not worrying, and I agree that you should be o.k. as long as you don't do this again, which you're pretty clear that you won't, I just want to make clear for others that may read this thread the following information. I am not trying to "badger" or unnecessarily scare anyone with this info, just making sure that others understand how serious dr. shopping is and how the DEA, states, etc. are monitoring schedule drugs.
    The national chains are linked. For example if you go to walgreen's in NJ and then go to walgreen's in NY, your info will follow you, cash or not. The thing I want to comment on from fragile's post is "if you pay cash there is no paper trail". Through a state PMP(prescription managment system) there is a paper trail. Any scedule drugs you recieve are automatically recorded into PMP, cash or insurance. I want to make that clear to any that would think they can get out of having schedule drugs registered into that system simply by paying cash for a prescription. A doctor can pull a PMP and see all scheduled drugs, cash or not. Red flags might not be raised and doctors may not pull those reports, but the info is there.

    Peace,

    IloeRose

  17. #17
    Rangers is offline Member
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    Dear lloeRose,

    On the web I read that in regards to the PMP program, a report called: Threshold report is sent out to Drs. on a quarterly basis, showing if a patient has multiple narcotic scrips. Supposedly, the report is sent to all Drs. who wrote them. It does not matter if it went thri insurance or paid by cash. I do not know what the basis or how many times you are flagged before it is sent to a physician. Are you familiar with this? This is why I am so nervous. If anyone is familiar with this I would appreciate hearing from you. By the way, the two Natl.chains in NJ/NY were different ones. I still believe even though they are different, because they are Ntl. they are still tied into each other. My guess is the mom and pops are not.

    Ranger

  18. #18
    iloerose is offline Platinum Member
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    Rangers,
    I'm in michigan. We have MAPS which has been in place for a few years. MAPS allows any doctor, pharmacy, law enforcement etc. to pull a report on a patient. Some dr. pull these periodically to monitor their pain patients. Not all, some, that's how I was "caught", but luckily my dr. offered to help me. He was extremely kind about the whole thing. I was extrodinarily lucky. Any dr. can pull one just by going to a web site and entering >> and their password. As far as I know here in Mi. reports are not sent from the state to dr. automatically. Supposedly, these PMPs are being monitored, but not automatically sent to dr. probably unless there is a red flag or something, and I think it would have to be something drastic, like big quantities and many dr. involved and/or over a period of time; something would have to trigger that. At least as far as I know in MI. That would be a huge expense to the state, sending out quarterly reports on all schedule drug patients. I don't know about NJ. But think about it. Reports on all people who are taking scheduled pain meds? That's a huge expense in administration. I wish you all the best. Be careful with the pharmacy, as fragile said.
    I will tell you, I never want to go through anything like that again, although I'm glad it happened because I was not able to say "no more" and to figure out how to get off the pills myself. I wanted to quit, but could not bear the shame of admitting it to my dr. All the lying and worrying for a stupid pill. This is not a mess anyone wants to get caught up in.

    Peace,

    IloeRose

  19. #19
    HenryNCBA Guest

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    Rangers,
    I hope the best for you. Just some information on what I found out myself. I was written scrips from different doctors for different things. Perc's from my primary for shoulder and knee pain. Perc's from my urologist for kidney stones. Vic's from the emergency doctor for kidney stones. Hydromet syrup from my primary for coughing which hung on for months (this is what I actually believe got me hooked), Vic's ES from my dentist for root canal and dental work. All in all it might look like I am doctor shopping but I am not. I only took what was prescribed and even have much of the most recent refills left. I was concerned so I asked my pharmacist and also my doctors and here is what they told me. Before I begin I am in California so laws may differ from State to State but still all fall under Federal Laws. Each State may have their own State laws that govern things Federal law may not. DEA monitors controlled substances. Many times when a doctors office tells you they won't release information to anyone unless there is a court order or "Unless required by law" that is the catch. To find out what the "Unless required by law" is. That can mean that in order to conduct business in any given state that it might be written in law that for any or certain controlled substance issued and distributed out there is a record of that distribution. This information is general in a sense in that no record or law enforcement agency is specifically looking for or targeting you specifically but if there is a mandate by law your information will pop up on a database. Everything is computerized so if your information pops up basically you are now on radar. Once on radar whichever agency is assigned in your local to monitor such activates will assign a investigator and they are trained to look for folks doctor shopping as well as watching for patterns of controlled substance abuse. This is a huge industry and they won't just go after you but also the doctors that prescribed the medications if they feel a law was broken. The last thing a doctor wants is to be under investigation or even questioned so that is why many doctors will send you in writing that they will no longer have you as a patient. This is a very good indication that you are on a watch list. The bad thing about it is now you are definitely "known" and will be watched closely. Depending on how busy the local and monitoring agency is they may choose to pursue it or put it off for another time more convenient as they may have more pressing issues to go after. The reasons for all this monitoring systems and databases is to catch and hopefully stop those that doctor shop along with abuse controlled substances and also to stop it at it's source which is the prescriber. My doctor told me that there is a listing out there that they can log onto to see if a certain patient is flagged for concern. He would not get into details and looked at me suspiciously and I have been going to him for over 15 years but that tells me that he is out to watch number one and that is himself before me when it concerns something possibly or is illegal. Moving on you have to remember that when a prescription is written whether you pay cash, put it on insurance, pay by check, or even charge it that matter is not the method of payment but rather the scrip has your information on it regardless so method of payment is a moot point. I can't say what it is like in other states but in California that is how it is as I have had scrips filled at different pharmacies and they all want my identification, address, phone number etc... Otherwise they will not process the scrip. I have since stopped going to different pharmacies and only go to one chain now (Walgreens) and they have all the scrips written by all my doctors. Moving forward now talking with the pharmacist ( I also have two cousins that are pharmacists and one was very informative) and they all said pretty much the same thing and that is if you have multiple scrips from multiple doctors and you get them filled in multiple pharmacies that if you were investigating possible doctor shopping and possible controlled substance abuse wouldn't you flag immediately for criminal like activities because of your "shopping" patterns? I thought about it and I agreed as it made logical sense. They look for patterns and if your activities fit the profile then you are being watched most likely. Again as others stated most likely nothing will come out of it and as Robert stated you will most likely find out within 30 days. Just don't do it again as it is highly illegal and these things are becoming a hot issue nationwide so they are watching and enforcing and if they do pursue they will hit you like a ton of bricks with everything they legally can. There are others out there much worse than you so again most likely nothing will come out of this but you have to use your head on these things. My recommendations are to consolidate to one pharmacy. Doesn't matter method of payment as unless they don't ask for identification and you just walk in and hand them a scrip with no personal information on it that identifies it for you and you pay cash and then walk out then maybe you got away with it but I highly doubt any legitimate pharmacy is going to do anything dumb like that. They would basically be putting a noose around their neck and just waiting for someone to slap the horse to hang themselves. Getting back to the one pharmacy, this shows that you are putting all your information in one location. Sure you will be easier to monitor but then again if you were looking for a criminal wouldn't you start by looking for something that flags you? That flag is the type of activities that criminals do. Think about it but again don't do it again.
    I don't mean to sound harsh but I am telling it like it is and from what I have learned as I have lost sleep wondering about my own so called activities. On a closing note if your scrips were for legitimate conditions you probably have nothing to worry about. If you went to multiple doctors just for the purpose of trying to acquire what ever it was you were trying to get then yes that is a no-no. One last point and that is they won't just come and bust you just like that. They are not stupid for if there really is a bonafide reason then they will have egg on their face. They will investigate and that means pulling your records with a court order from not just the pharmacy but also from the various doctors that wrote the scrips. They have to build a case up and won't just arbitrarily arrest you and let the chips fall where they fall all the while hoping that they fall in favor for them because without slots for the chips to fall in they have no case.
    Sorry this is so long.
    Good luck and hope you get better.

    Henry

  20. #20
    Rangers is offline Member
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    Dear Henrey,

    Thanks for you words. I am scared to death, and am losing much sleep over the insanity and stupidity that I have created for myself. I will never do this again, for I am not meant for jail or a felony. I have an appointment with my regular pain doc on Oct. 12th. I will use my meds the way they are supposed to be used. I will go to the pharmacy that has been filling the scrips from this Dr. The scrips from the other physicians were written at the very end of September and filled at other pharmacies. The pharmacy I use for the ligitimate pain Dr. is a mom and pop store. They filled my last ligitimate scrip on Oct. 1st. My scrips are for 2 weeks worth that can't be filled untill Oct. 15th. Now that I gave you pretty much the background, do you think I still will get caught or am I pretty much OK??
    I would appreciate your answer.

    Ranger

  21. #21
    Freedom4me is offline Advanced Member
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    Ranger,
    I have a few friends who are police officers and happened to see them as we had a death of a mutual friend and they both told me as long as you don't do it again and have not heard anything by now that you are ok. I hope that puts your mind at ease. I am also in California.

  22. #22
    Rangers is offline Member
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    Thanks Freedom. What type of law enforcement are they? You can take it to the bank I have learned my lesson. My stomach has been in nots as I already suffer from crones disease. Too much sleep is being lost. I am a better person, who did something very self-centered and stupid.
    Ranger
    Ranger

  23. #23
    Freedom4me is offline Advanced Member
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    Ranger,
    One of them was a SWAT officer and one was a Sheriff. You will be fine. The police have such bigger fish to fry. I hope Caught Again sees your post. You should read his. He had a much bigger situation and everything turned out fine. He had the cops show up to a pharmacy!!! Then he even continued doctor shopping!! You need to get a good nights sleep friend and just count this as a lesson learned. I hope your pain is managable. I know about chronic pain. I meant it when I said there are other ways to try besides the drugs. It will make you feel so much better. Drugs help the pain but they also take such a tole on our bodies. Think about it. Take care and have a great day!!

  24. #24
    caughtagain is offline Diamond Member
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    Hi Ranger, I have been following your thread and Free asked me to comment, so I will do my best. I will tell you what happened to me and how I handled it. But please understand it was 15 years ago and I think times have changed with repsect to this being a hot topic, where as 15 years ago it was not. I was using and filling perscriptions from as many docs as I could. I would use my education and knowledge of the medical industry to get what I wanted and could care or less how many Doc's it took to get my pills. I lived in Florida and would plan my days around going to the hospitals, Dentists, etc...... I think you get the idea. I was a real scumbag. Well one weekend my Aunt had come down from Illinois and we were going to a local shopping district, no big deal, except I needed to get pills. So I had it all planned out, I would go to a dr, get treated for lower back pain, then go home and get my Aunt and shop at this place.Everything was going as I wanted. Went to the Dr, won an oscar for my performance of person in pain, got my pain pill script, muscle relaxer script..... So I go to get my Aunt and we go to these shoppes. I told her I would need to run into the pharmacy to get something and I would meet her at shop X (she went to look at T-shirts or something), So I go into this little mom and pop pharmacy and put in the script. There was no one in this place, I mean no one. I started to notice it was taking to long and the pharmacist was on the phone, he would get off then no script. Man, was I scared. I had never been in trouble with the law before. NOt even a speeding ticket. So I wait, I even ask him is everything ok, to which he responds, yes. But I knew something was up. I just had a feeling because the Dr';s office was right in the circle of shoppes so it was not like he was unaware of this dr. So, I have my Aunt outside shopping and me trying to be the best little addict I could be by getting my pills and it happened. 3 police officers stormed this place like I commited a murder, two from the front and one from the back. THen things went into slow motion... They explained to me I was being investigated for Dr Shopping. I was like.... WHAT, your kidding. IT was new and boy oh boy it was scarey. I will never forget the cop and what he said when I asked him what I did. His response was, well sir, we would not be investigating you if you did nothing wrong. Man that is when I knew I was in some doo. So, he looked me up and found I had no warrents, so because it was just being investigated, they could not take me in. IT was a holiday weekend so I had to wait until Monday before I could even talk to the detective. (sidebar: THey gave me my script saying by law they had too...) Anyway, That next monday I went to the police station and met up with the Detective and came clean ( I AM NOT SAYING YOU DO THIS, this is juist what i did) He did read me my rights and interviewed me for my investigation. What had happened was I would go to these resort clinics and say I was a doc in on vacation and they would perscribe. One Dentist became fishy, checked up on validating who I was and found out I was not telling the truth and thus the investigation. I kept in touch with him, told him all the things I thought I needed too and one day I called him and asked him where things stood and he told me not to call him anymore and to get on with my life and consider this a lesson learned... THe point is, I did something very wrong, I was a liar, an Addict, but in the scheme of things I was small fry. I was hurting me, so I think that is what he found and decided to look elsewhere for his bigger fish. However, I can say this. I was never so scared for that period of time. The bad news is, it slowed me, but unfortunately it would not be my bottom, I would go on to lose much more before I realized I needed to shape up. So.... in my opinion, don't do it again and hope for the best. Will you get caught? No idea. But learn from it and make a promise to yourself that you won't do it again. Trust me, it WILL end badly. I never got as much as a ticket in my life, but just because you do not get in legal trouble, does NOT mean you cannot feel loss. I have given up so much to addiction, it just simply is not worth it. I hope my story can help guide you a bit. Good Luck to you and know that we are here for you to help support you in your journey, one that we all fight every second of every day...... CA

  25. #25
    mottam is offline Advanced Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by caughtagain View Post
    Hi Ranger, I have been following your thread and Free asked me to comment, so I will do my best. I will tell you what happened to me and how I handled it. But please understand it was 15 years ago and I think times have changed with repsect to this being a hot topic, where as 15 years ago it was not. I was using and filling perscriptions from as many docs as I could. I would use my education and knowledge of the medical industry to get what I wanted and could care or less how many Doc's it took to get my pills. I lived in Florida and would plan my days around going to the hospitals, Dentists, etc...... I think you get the idea. I was a real scumbag. Well one weekend my Aunt had come down from Illinois and we were going to a local shopping district, no big deal, except I needed to get pills. So I had it all planned out, I would go to a dr, get treated for lower back pain, then go home and get my Aunt and shop at this place.Everything was going as I wanted. Went to the Dr, won an oscar for my performance of person in pain, got my pain pill script, muscle relaxer script..... So I go to get my Aunt and we go to these shoppes. I told her I would need to run into the pharmacy to get something and I would meet her at shop X (she went to look at T-shirts or something), So I go into this little mom and pop pharmacy and put in the script. There was no one in this place, I mean no one. I started to notice it was taking to long and the pharmacist was on the phone, he would get off then no script. Man, was I scared. I had never been in trouble with the law before. NOt even a speeding ticket. So I wait, I even ask him is everything ok, to which he responds, yes. But I knew something was up. I just had a feeling because the Dr';s office was right in the circle of shoppes so it was not like he was unaware of this dr. So, I have my Aunt outside shopping and me trying to be the best little addict I could be by getting my pills and it happened. 3 police officers stormed this place like I commited a murder, two from the front and one from the back. THen things went into slow motion... They explained to me I was being investigated for Dr Shopping. I was like.... WHAT, your kidding. IT was new and boy oh boy it was scarey. I will never forget the cop and what he said when I asked him what I did. His response was, well sir, we would not be investigating you if you did nothing wrong. Man that is when I knew I was in some doo. So, he looked me up and found I had no warrents, so because it was just being investigated, they could not take me in. IT was a holiday weekend so I had to wait until Monday before I could even talk to the detective. (sidebar: THey gave me my script saying by law they had too...) Anyway, That next monday I went to the police station and met up with the Detective and came clean ( I AM NOT SAYING YOU DO THIS, this is juist what i did) He did read me my rights and interviewed me for my investigation. What had happened was I would go to these resort clinics and say I was a doc in on vacation and they would perscribe. One Dentist became fishy, checked up on validating who I was and found out I was not telling the truth and thus the investigation. I kept in touch with him, told him all the things I thought I needed too and one day I called him and asked him where things stood and he told me not to call him anymore and to get on with my life and consider this a lesson learned... THe point is, I did something very wrong, I was a liar, an Addict, but in the scheme of things I was small fry. I was hurting me, so I think that is what he found and decided to look elsewhere for his bigger fish. However, I can say this. I was never so scared for that period of time. The bad news is, it slowed me, but unfortunately it would not be my bottom, I would go on to lose much more before I realized I needed to shape up. So.... in my opinion, don't do it again and hope for the best. Will you get caught? No idea. But learn from it and make a promise to yourself that you won't do it again. Trust me, it WILL end badly. I never got as much as a ticket in my life, but just because you do not get in legal trouble, does NOT mean you cannot feel loss. I have given up so much to addiction, it just simply is not worth it. I hope my story can help guide you a bit. Good Luck to you and know that we are here for you to help support you in your journey, one that we all fight every second of every day...... CA

    Thanks for sharing, ca!

  26. #26
    Rangers is offline Member
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    Dear CA,

    Thanks for your thoughts. At this point I can only pray and hope for the best. I have alreay taken a vou to never doing this again. It is stupid and self centered. To think what would happen not only to me, but what about my wife and two kids! I cannot believe I did such a dumb thing. Everyone on this board has been very supportive. The concensus seems to be that I will hopefully slide thru. I am still not only upset, but I continue to be very nervous. I guess until 30 or more days pass, I will continue to lose sleep.What really is still bothering me is I read on the web in regards to the PMP program, that every quarter, if you are flagged by the computer, a report called a Threshold report is automatically sent to all phisicians who wrote you scrips. (That is if you received multiple controlled meds). I received one from a podiatrist, one from a primary, one from a dentist. They were all different meds. Then I received a forth from my pain doc, also different strength.Are you familiar with this report that is supposedly automatically generated? If so, please comment.
    Thanks....Ranger

  27. #27
    caughtagain is offline Diamond Member
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    Sorry Ranger, I am not aware of this. Just hang in there. When I was going through my wait period, it was very hard. Time does pass, all beit slow. So, keep active, be proavtive and if something does happen (Which I do not think it will) tackle it head on. We are here for you.... CA

  28. #28
    HenryNCBA Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rangers View Post
    Dear Henrey,

    Thanks for you words. I am scared to death, and am losing much sleep over the insanity and stupidity that I have created for myself. I will never do this again, for I am not meant for jail or a felony. I have an appointment with my regular pain doc on Oct. 12th. I will use my meds the way they are supposed to be used. I will go to the pharmacy that has been filling the scrips from this Dr. The scrips from the other physicians were written at the very end of September and filled at other pharmacies. The pharmacy I use for the ligitimate pain Dr. is a mom and pop store. They filled my last ligitimate scrip on Oct. 1st. My scrips are for 2 weeks worth that can't be filled untill Oct. 15th. Now that I gave you pretty much the background, do you think I still will get caught or am I pretty much OK??
    I would appreciate your answer.

    Ranger

    Ranger,
    I can not say for certain whether you will get caught or not. I can say one thing for sure though is if you do continue behaving in a manner corresponding with the patterns of a doctor shopper you WILL eventually get caught. Be it a Mom and Pop store or a large nationwide chain is not the issue and neither is paying by cash, charge, insurance or what ever. I don't know exactly how much meds you have on hand or have received through your scrips but just from the little I have read even I see a pattern here and I am not in law enforcement. It is obvious you are very stressed about this and as for your conditions of having crohns disease and diabetes 2 I can relate as I have ulcerative colitis and I am also a type 2 diabetic. After 4 surgeries which I am assuming is for either the crohns or from the effects of diabetes I can say that your physicians must have you on many various meds. Again as I can see you are very stressed and keep iterating the point of "getting caught" while others are trying to explain things you obviously are very apprehensive about what you are doing. Having said that let me say this first that in no way am I a expert in law and also I am not out to pin anything on you but just want you to see the facts as it is and what it appears to look like (at least to myself). 1. You are afraid of being caught for what you feel is doctor shopping. 2. We do not know when the scrips were written that you indicated you took to various pharmacies and paid cash for and also used insurance for. 3. You have not mentioned what the scrips were for. 4. All we know is you stated the scrips are only good for 2 weeks worth of meds. 5. You are in a near state of panic mode which clouds your judgment and thinking. 6. Back to the scrips what was the time difference between the issuance of the scrips. 7. Is it Oct 9th or the 12th? There are many others but lets focus on these first. For # 1: You are fixated on being caught. What is going to happen is going to happen. Without knowing exactly how much information is out there and even if there is any on you that put you on the radar that without knowing the parameters of what starts an investigation no one can answer your question of if you will be caught or not. At this point it seems that if anyone told you to continue you would continue your behavior pattern and if anyone told you to stop you still continue your behavior pattern as you keep asking for reassurance it is okay to do such a thing. The long and short answer is both to NOT DO IT ANYMORE. Don't continue to play the odds and dig a deeper hole for yourself period. This has been mentioned many times by others also yet you continue to ask if it is alright. If you were an investigator wouldn't you consider this a pattern for someone doctor shopping or for acquiring controlled substances? Number 2. When were the scrips written and what time frame passed between them? In other words if you had say 2 weeks worth of say percs written lets say September 1st just as an example and you filled this one at say pharmacy A and then two weeks later after the first scrip started to run out you went to Pharmacy B and had that filled then again after a couple weeks you went to Pharmacy C (Mom and Pop) and had another scrip filled legally speaking as long as you are following the instructions from the doctors even though they may be different ones technically I see nothing wrong here as you are following instructions and that refills are within the indicated time frame. If you got them all filled within a few days and from various doctors then yes you are doctor shopping. Why? Answer yourself this. Why would anyone need multiple scrips for pain meds from multiple doctors and take them to multiple pharmacies if they are following instructions from their first doctor? You stated you had these transactions filled at the very end of September so that tells me that you had way more than enough meds to cover you for any 2 week time frame. In other words you were stock piling the meds. Okay even though you lost the original scrip from your strict pain doctor you went to from what I understand three other doctors (including the dentist) and got 3 scrips for pain meds no one needs 3 scrips unless you are abusing the meds. Number 3. You stated that the scrips were for percs and vics which I will just label as pain meds for simplicity. Unless the pain meds are for the control of pain from operations or from certain effects of your conditions they most likely will be taken with other scrip meds such as sulfasalizine for your crohns or some sort of anti-inflammatory med and also something for your nervous system due to your diabetes. Pain meds do not resolve these conditions and are not recommended for treatment for these conditions either but rather for pain associated with it. Number 4: If a scrip is written for only two weeks that means the doctor doesn't feel it necessary for you to be on pain pills for any longer duration of time. Medicine is not an exact science but that is no argument in your favor. If you lost the original script the question would come out why didn't you just make another appointment with the doctor that originally wrote it so he/she could give you another one? I mean you took the time to go to 3 others right? If you went to just one other and got a scrip that was identical to the one you lost then every thing looks fine but 3 is over doing it. I know you admitted that you were wrong and you messed up but I am trying to clear some things up for you as you are fixated on "getting caught". Number 5: I said that you are in a near state of panic and from what I can see you are. You keep asking the same questions over and over regardless of what others have tried to support you with and even though you put it in a very nice way the target is still the same and that is "is it okay to keep doing what you are doing" and "will you get caught". You have a temporary phobia of getting caught and it is clouding your good judgment. I know it is difficult at best but you need to calm down and take a deep breath and really look at where you stand which is why I am writing to you like this. Please don't misunderstand as I am not trying to put you down or belittle you but rather just stating it as it is and what it appears to be like. Number 6: Pretty much same as number 2 but when the scrips were written by the other medical practitioners were the scrips filled right away or did you say see the first other doctor say last August and the second mid September and so on and you just chose to have the scrips filled at the same time? Either way though if you waited to have the scrips all filled and did them all pretty much almost at the same time they look at that as not really needing the meds and you could have gotten by with just one scrip. Number 7: In your original post you stated appointment on October 9th and now on your most recent you stated Oct 12th. Which is it? A couple other things are you also mentioned about drinking. That is not the issue here and if investigated they won't even look or care about that. The way laws are written and enforced it is very specific. If they say "doctor shopping" then it is "doctor shopping" and if they said "controlled substance abuse" then it is just that. The drinking or not drinking will have no effect good or bad on the outcome. Stay with facts only as that is what they do. And lastly as I am getting long winded here and don't want to take up your entire day is after reading everything I have written does it not appear that you are doing something not quite right? You already admitted you did something wrong and stated you will not do it again even and have learned your lesson yet you still ask if it is alright and if you might get caught right? You had 3 scrips for pain meds filled at the very end of September. You had your last legitimate scrip filled October 1st. You have basically 4 scrips worth of meds in your hands in the space of a few days and you are already pushing to get another one. I realize addiction is a tough cookie to break as I am on this site also for chemical dependency and Robert and others are helping me taper off of the meds. Again I am not trying to point the finger at you or trying to make you feel bad. I am just trying to help you see what you are doing from my perspective. Talk with your doctor and be honest. If you have an addiction issue you may not like what he/she tells you. If you do and follow instructions and do the right thing then all is well except for what you have already done. If not then well you know the answer to that one.
    Hang in there and hope you get better. I'll check up on you to see how you are doing. If you are crying for help this is the right place to be. I am so glad I found this site and I am breezing though my way to being clean. Best time to try and be clean is now. Don't delay for if you use "one more time" as an excuse you will forever be caught in that downwards spiral but again you know that.
    Have a great day otherwise!

    Henry

  29. #29
    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    Rangers ..... I retired from the financial planning and insurance business. Not trying to add to your grief but there is also something called the MIB (Medical Information Bureau).

    Anytime you sign a medical release a pharmacy and medical reports are entered. Companies have access to your information by being a paid member when you sign a release. And everyone makes you sign medical releases so they can protect themselves. Everyone belongs to it trust me. I was a member as the owner of my own company. Companies use it for underwriting health risks and for tracking "red flag" prescriptions.

    Just don't mess up again. It's hard to get away with scamming drs anymore. God bless.
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

  30. #30
    HenryNCBA Guest

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rangers View Post
    Dear CA,

    Thanks for your thoughts. At this point I can only pray and hope for the best. I have alreay taken a vou to never doing this again. It is stupid and self centered. To think what would happen not only to me, but what about my wife and two kids! I cannot believe I did such a dumb thing. Everyone on this board has been very supportive. The concensus seems to be that I will hopefully slide thru. I am still not only upset, but I continue to be very nervous. I guess until 30 or more days pass, I will continue to lose sleep.What really is still bothering me is I read on the web in regards to the PMP program, that every quarter, if you are flagged by the computer, a report called a Threshold report is automatically sent to all phisicians who wrote you scrips. (That is if you received multiple controlled meds). I received one from a podiatrist, one from a primary, one from a dentist. They were all different meds. Then I received a forth from my pain doc, also different strength.Are you familiar with this report that is supposedly automatically generated? If so, please comment.
    Thanks....Ranger
    Rangers,
    Me again. Hey friend you REALLY need to lighten up. I know you are going through some high anxiety right now. Trust me I get the same way about some health issues and stuff like that. I even went through this fear of being a doctor shopper myself just the other week so I know what you are feeling. In my post of # 19 I mentioned that there are variious laws and ways to monitor possible substance abuse and doctor shopping. I was hooked on opiates and I am still going through the taper process to get clean right now as I speak. I too feared doctor shopping and what would it look like to law enforcment of my record of fillng scrips. Then it dawned on me and through information from the doctors office and the pharmacies that there should be no reason for them to investigate me because although I had many many scrips for opiates withing the past year and before they were all refilled within the alloted time frame and if a different pain med was scripted it was from the same doctor and at the same pharmacy as I was switching meds because the previous one either didn't work or I had a reaction to it. So in the eyes of an investigator they would see this as 1. I am only refilling when my scrip ran out so the doctor authorized a refill. 2. Although different doctors might have filled scrips for same and different pain meds I have a medical history in the doctors office which shows I have a condtion that the scrip was called for. 3. I filled all scrips at the same pharmacy. Now I know your situation is different but what is done is done and there is nothing anyone can do to change that. Also 30 days is just a parameter that was set out and things may or may not happen within or beyond that time frame. Best thing you could do right now is to try not to stress and I know that is near impossible but you have to rationalize that there is nothing that can be done to change what has already happened. Going forward to go to you doctors appointment and be open and honest with him/her and it is obvious to me you are "hooked" so let them know you want off this boat now. If they ask why then tell them you feel you are hooked and they can treat you for addiction if they are licensed for it or refer you to another doctor that is like my own primary did for me. From there just fill only the scips given to you from the recommended doctor only. If you lose a scrip call and make another appointment if that is what your strict pain doctor needs and tell him/her that you lost the scrip to their face. Even I would be hesitant if someone called me and said "I lost a scrip for a controlled substance. Can I have another one?" I would want to see them so I can assess and see if there is really a need for it. Remember that pain meds is scripted for pain only. It is not scripted for crohns or diabetes. You don't take asprin for getting some dust in your eye right? Same thing. Dust might cause inflamation and pain but there are other meds used to treat that. As for your family and such that unfortunately is the price you may have to pay if something should happen. I pray that it will not. You did something wrong yes. Again just don't do it again and follow that same path. Do the right thing from here on and just focus on that. You can not change the past my friend. You can only plan for the future and attempt to change the present.
    Take it easy okay? I know it's hard but try to do something to take your mind off of this and also to stop fixating on acquiring more meds. Let your doctor worry about that as that is what you pay them for. If you feel you are not statisfied with your doctor then get a second opinion but not just for getting more meds. Cure or maintaining quality of life is your goal. Not more controlled substances. That is not the answer but rather will be your downfall if you do the wrong thing.
    Hang in there. I'll keep tabs on you.

    Henry

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