[kathleen5hockey]

Thanks Jean! You really made me smile. Yesterday was the first Mothers Day that she actually bought me something with the money her father gave her! First time in 3 years. She also made me a beautiful card. Guess that is why I just can't give up. She is such a sweet person when not high. We had a huge blowout at the clinic on Friday so we both are going for counceling today. Her boyfriend was at the clinic also, told him what I thought about everything, didn't yell but made it perfectly clear. Still don't know if she is playing me. Sat. night or should I say Sund morn she got home at 3 am. Her father has been sick so she brought him tissues saying that he was keeping her awake. Yesterday he told her, I know you just got home at 3, where were you? Oh, just out. Now I used to be out late when we used to go clubing, you know dancing, drinking then the diner but I was on my own. Where could she be going at age 17? Anyway, today is another day. She did not go to school again, says she is sick.

Here is a question for anyone who has used heroin: Why is the high so good that you are willing to give everything up? What does it feel like?

Just trying to understand. God and I are still talking which is good. Couldn't bring myself to go to church on Sunday, haven't missed a day in a long time. Just didn't want to cry on Mothers day. Figured I deserved a good day. I made myself happy playing in the garden, now that is a high!

Jean, what is Skype?

[fleese1981]

Unfortunatly this drug is powerful, and it becomes the number one thing in your life as when ur without it, ur life consists of being balled up on the couch and not able to do anything but thinkn and hurt... She needs help and you cant understand it fully til you have been down the road. But never do that please i dont wish these feeling on anyone... i myself am going through the same thing and trying to get off starting today, cause i just dont like who i am while i am on it.... Maybe you want to talk to her, or try to intervien in her ways, put her in the car and take her home and watch and help her stop... Some just dont want to hear it, i have heard people getting thier loved one arrestted with the only wish of them having to get clean then. But i feel bad for her that way as it cause her life to be really hard afterthat to continue with life as a normal person cause of the record, but if she is to the point were she could kill herself using, i would do it to my own mother to see her live a good and long life.... So just be strong and try ur best to talk to her and help... Best of luck....

[kathleen5hockey]

Thank you for the insight. Next question: How do I find a good Psyk? What questions should I ask, she is very depressed and wants to talk to somebody besides her mother. I think she needs medication for depression. Robert, can she take other meds with Methadone?

[Robert_325]

Yes she can. But honestly kathleen it starts scaring me handing out too much medical advice when a baby is in the picture. I think it would be prudent to involve the OBGYN at this point.

There should be someone who is doing nothing but medication management for her at this point. I know she is best off on the methadone if she's going to have the baby. And I know she can take an antidepressant with the methadone but babies scare me. This is when NOT being a dr makes me want to defer judgement to a professional. I wouldn't be able to live with myself if I told you something wrong with a baby involved.

If her OBGYN doesn't know what to advise with her being an addict I would be afraid of that dr. Lots of girls deliver babies successfully while opiate dependent and on methadone. I would think the OBGYN would know the right psychiatrist to refer an expectant addict mother to or at least they should know one. Your daughter shouldn't be the OBGYN's first opiate dependent mother. Let us know how this goes. You know I want to know how things progress. Stay in touch. God bless.

[kathleen5hockey]

She needs someone to talk to, should I go towards the pyschiatrist or pysologist (sp). Would appreciate anyone who's been an addict which served them better.

We had our counceling session, went ok. She was checking out of the pic most of the time. Told the councelor that I am here to support emotionally but am pretty tapped out financially. Her boyfriend and her have to decide their future. Told them both that I am tired of carying her, she has to learn to stand on her own feet. She has to go to school. She must turn the corner but I cannot make her and do not want to anymore. It's just beating my head against the wall and makes me more angry. Really want to get past the anger.

I never thought it could get worse, but it did.

[kathleen5hockey]

Had to take her for blood work today, another day missed at work, her arms are covered in fresh track marks. There are 4 needles in her purse, hickey's all over her neck. Cannot take anymore. Feel as if I am drowing in sorrow. The husband is no help, he just says take care of everything. Tried to horseback ride today, usually helps me but fell off. Just cannot concentrate on anything. You know, I used to be able to cry - not anymore. I am so beaten down, will I ever get back to my happy self? I want to pack my bags and leave, but where? I have a great part time job with benefits! Where do I go to get that? The husband doesn't like to talk about these problems, thank you for letting me vent. Even if no one reads this it does help. Why do people choose drugs over everything else? I was not raised in a bubble, have tried drugs, coke, smoke just didn't like the feeling. I am definately being punished for something.

[anotheraddict]

Kathleen,

Sorry, I should have explained that one. Skype is video phone over the internet. It's used a lot by people associated with the Military as it allows communication easily during deployment. Glad that I could make you smile. Knowing that makes my day, really. Just because it made your day a little better.

I was so glad to read about Mother's Day. It's like we get some good news about your daughter and then another bomb gets dropped. The change to the methadone may have been for the good of the baby, but her shooting again is definitely not going to help. It almost seems as if she is trying to forget that she is pregnant. Like she can continue on as if she isn't. The longer she continues shooting, the lower the chance this baby has of being normal or even surviving is. If she somehow carries it to term, the child will have to withdraw immediately. You thought it was tough watching your daughter detox, imagine watching your grandchild detox....

I am not trying to make you feel bad, really. I am trying to let you know what to expect if she decides she wants to keep this child. She doesn't seem to have any real desire to stop the drugs at this point in time even knowing that she's pregnant. And the first trimester is often the most critical for the fetus being impacted.

Ok, enough of the horribly depressing subjects. You will be happy again. I promise. I cannot say when or how, but it will happen again someday. Even if I have to come to CT and kick your daughter's butt myself. With my gimpy RSD affected foot, lol. Sorry, had to throw that last part in. But seriously, I will talk to your daughter if we can find some way to arrange such things. She needs to know what she's doing. Not just to herself, but to you, your husband, her brother....She needs a wake-up call. Does she get online? Does she use AIM? Or Yahoo Messenger? E-Mail? Is there any way that I can try to get through to this girl? Because I will. Someone needs to. And she's not going to listen to just anyone. I am not saying that I am some amazing person, or that I have all of the answers. I am just saying that I am definitely willing to give it a shot. What do you have to lose at this point really? She's drawing further away by the day it seems.

I know you feel like you are at the end of your rope, but just hang on. There is no other option! I am not going to allow you to let go no matter what. My hands are wrapped tightly around yours on that rope, okay? We can do this. I'm sorry I don't have the answers about the heroin high or the psychiastrist. I never did H, and only went to a counselor when I was 13. Long before substance abuse entered the picture. Hopefully someone else will come along with those answers before too long, though.

I was going to bed, and then I read your post. I couldn't go to bed without responding to you Thinking about you always.

Jean

[stangangel22]

i just wanted to say PLEASE DONT GIVE UP ON YOUR DAUGHTER..i am a "daughter" that chose the drugs over her family..and my parents wrote me a letter while i was in jail, telling me i was "dead" to them.. please dont give up your daughter..the girl you loved and raised is still inside of her..it IS the drugs making her withdraw from you, but believe me, SHE is on the inside SCREAMING for you to wrap her in your arms and hold her tight, and protect her..its been 10 years since my parents wrote that letter, now i AM at the point that i WANT someone to help me, to save me, ..but they arent there..

[MaisieC]

Hi Kathleen,

I'm sorry you and your family are having such struggles. I just wanted to chime in about the psychologist/psychiatrist question. In my experience, it doesn't matter that much which one you choose. A psychiatrist is qualified to prescribe medication, while a psychologist is not. So if meds are under consideration, she will need to see a psychiatrist anyhow. I think the most important thing would be to find someone who has a specialty, or at least experience, with addiction. I am in NY, and if you like I can ask my shrink if she knows anyone in your area. She is an addiction specialist. You should be able to click on my username and send me an e-mail through the site.

I remember my psychiatrist telling me years ago that he had had patients go through pregnancies successfully while taking Prozac. Of course, it's the other drugs she's using that are the real threat to her and to the baby. Also, in terms of treating depression, the heroin is making her depressed, so I don't know if an antidepressant would do any good at all. I went through this with my best friend, who was a heroin addict. She kept trying different SSRIs and complaining that none of them worked. But the dope was making her depressed, and she wouldn't stop that.

I also wanted to respond to your questions about addiction, and are the drugs really so good that a person would throw everything away for them? The answer is "no," but addicts don't think rationally. Especially at your daughter's age, I would think. For most heroin users, the first time was the absolute best. Then you keep using, chasing that incredible high, which you will never get again. That also applies to pill users, which is what I was. Honestly, most of the time the high wasn't that great. But it becomes a compulsion. Chasing the high, then doing it out of habit, then it just kind of takes over your mind. Your daughter is not making a rational decision when she uses, so there's no use trying to understand it rationally. It's irrational behavior. I guess the best way to understand it is as a compulsion.

Anyhow, please e-mail me if you'd like me to try to find a referral.

Take good care.

Maisie

[kathleen5hockey]

Originally Posted by stangangel22

i just wanted to say PLEASE DONT GIVE UP ON YOUR DAUGHTER..i am a "daughter" that chose the drugs over her family..and my parents wrote me a letter while i was in jail, telling me i was "dead" to them.. please dont give up your daughter..the girl you loved and raised is still inside of her..it IS the drugs making her withdraw from you, but believe me, SHE is on the inside SCREAMING for you to wrap her in your arms and hold her tight, and protect her..its been 10 years since my parents wrote that letter, now i AM at the point that i WANT someone to help me, to save me, ..but they arent there..

This forum is the place you should be. We will all help you. Imagine all of us hugging you. I will be here for my daughter WHEN she wants the help. When she is 18 she will be out of my house. IF she wants to change we will be there for her. I cannot kill myself anymore. My husband/her father has been sick for 2 weeks and not getting better. The key to what you said is that you WANT the help.

As a parent our hearts can only be broken so much. The addiction kills our selfworth, our confidence, our reasoning and also takes a toll on our health and our wallets. Do you know I don't even have milk in the house, open my fridge and there is nothing. Why? Because I keep paying for methadone, cigs for her, college for the son and repairs on our cars which are 10 yrs old. My only pleasure is horseback riding but cannot afford that anymore, yesterday was the last time for a while, kinda sore today since the fall anyway.

I am glad you have seen the light. I do understand a little about addiction because of my cig habit, still trying to control that. I will do my best to help you.

Jean, no camera's in my house, they are creepy and talking doesn't work anyway. But thanks.

[anotheraddict]

Stangangel,

They may not be here, but we are. While we may not be blood, we seem to make a pretty darn good family if I do say so myself. Please stick around and allow us to offer a shoulder to lean on and a hand to hold.

Kathleen,

Eh, you don't need milk anyway. All those lactose intolerant people couldn't be wrong, right? Unfortunately, you are sacrificing everything for your daughter, and she doesn't yet appreciate it. I can only promise you that one day she will understand. Sorry to hear about the horseback riding and the fall. Please try to keep your head up. I know it's rough right now to say the least.

Don't worry about the talking not working right now. I just really feel bad that I can't offer more help. Like stang, I am seeing how much pain I have caused my parents during my active addiction. While I am doing my best to make amends to them as well, I feel like I need to do more. I need to help others who are in my situation, or others being affected by an active addict. I hope it didn't bother you that I posted about talking to your daughter, though. I would never come to your house or make contact in any way. Don't worry, I am not some weirdo. I am just a young adult trying to find my way who really feels the need to reach a hand out to you in your time of need.

I really hope things look up for you soon. Any news on the decision with keeping the baby or not? Has your daughter been "behaving" since your last post? I sincerely hope so.

Best wishes.

Jean

[kathleen5hockey]

Hi all, thanks for all of your support. Tomorrow she will have an abortion. I am just a mess today, can't stop crying and the boss will be in soon, got to get my St together. Went to counceling last night, didn't help, will not be going back anymore. You know the thing is even when I throw her out at age 18 if she is still using I will be sad. Guess it's the out of sight, out of mind thing. This forum is a great place to shed your fears and tears. Some will not agree with our decision but it must be. As a parent I can see where there is nothing left to give. I have nothing left as a person, dead inside. Don't smile, laugh or enjoy waking up anymore. A walking dead person, that's what I am, not what I used to be or what I should be. All because of heroin.

[stangangel22]

dearest kathleen,
as i sat here reading this latest entry of yours,i feel tears falling down my cheecks. i wish i could take your pain away,i would. i just wanted to respond to your comment about feeling like a walking dead person,and i mean this with every ounce of my soul..YOU ARE NOT! I am already working on my way to be free from MY addiction, and YOU are definitely a very big part of that..last nite i looked into the narcotics anon. organization, and even found a na meeting close to me. I am going to try to find the courage to go to that meeting this saturday,no, i AM going to go to that meeting..not try. THANK you for your words of support, just knowing you are there is so important! YOU are IMPORTANT TO ME, AND SO MANY OTHERS IM SURE OF IT!

[bettie boop]

I have been following your thread and I just wanted to lend my support to you. You are a great parent and your family will pull through this. I don't post on this forum much but I do read alot, there's a thread under my user name with more info on me.

Anyways I feel I might be able to help you with your situation but I don't feel comfortable posting publically, even though this is anonymous I have alot to lose and don't want to take chances.

Trust me I can offer you some insights or a listening ear. Email me if you feel comfortable talking in private.


Have a healthy happy day!

[kathleen5hockey]

After work took a nap and feel better. Bible study tonight but cannot find it in my heart to go because of the decision made. Strangangle - you WILL go to the meeting. You WILL gain control of your life and WE ALL WILL HELP YOU! The first time is always frightening. I have been to a few groups, some helped some not. It's good to hear you are not alone. My Wed group I am giving up because their answer for everything is put her in jail. Jail is not the answer. Look on line for groups near you. Many churchs have groups, my church rents out space to a few. Just know that if this one doesn't feel right go to the next. Out of all groups I have found this forum to be the best. Letting your feelings out in words helps me, knowing that people care who don't even know me is comforting and the plus is that the forum is here 24/7. It helps to re-read my posts too, to remember where we have come from to now is reassuring.

The daughter still has needles and did not go for Methadone today. Tried to wake her but no good. Let's just get thru tomorrow. Her father is taking her because I have to work.

Also, BettyB, don't know how to find your e-mail, need directions please.

Robert, I am sorry you are disappointed in our decision but this child is damaged already from the drugs and STD's not to mention the Hep C. You have been very educational and I truely appreciate it.

Thanks to everyone.

[bettie boop]

I don't think we are supposed to post our addies in the forum. Thought maybe if you clicked on my user name you could email me? Maybe Robert or someone could tell us?

I am glad that you found this forum. None of us are alone facing these issues although it sure can feel lonely! Hope to be able to get in contact with you soon as I feel strongly that I can help.

Everyone stay healthy and have happy weekend!

[Robert_325]

You can adjust your profile so anyone can click on your screen name and you'll receive an email at the address you have on file. But it won't come up on the forum. Hope that answers your question. God bless.

[Robert_325]

Kathleen ... I am praying for your family. You certainly don't owe me an explanation for your decision. I am thankful that I didn't have to make it myself.

It's always easier to say what we would do about anything until we are placed in the situation ourselves and actually have to make the decision. I would never judge you for what you've done. That little baby will spend eternity with God, that I'm sure of. God blesses all little babies that don't make it. You know that too. God is great!

[bettie boop]

thanks Robert. I fixed my settings so you can click on my username and email me.

[melinda7.5]

Hi Kathleen
I hope everything went OK today...I have been praying for you...I hope i never have to make the decision you had to make today...God will forgive you if you want him to...now maybe your daughter can get some help or you can do the tough love thing...anyway I just wanted you to know i was thinking about you...
wish you well, Melinda

[stangangel22]

dear kathleen,
just wanted to say you and your family have been in my prayers and thoughts today..
god bless you..
i failed today, so i dont feel i should even be on with ya'll here for now. we come here to get assurance we can be successful in whatever addiction it is we are fighting to overcome..anyways, ill keep coming back to read, but i dont think ill leave anymore msgs..it wouldnt be helpful..

good luck, and god bless you and your family..they're lucky to have you

[brndout]

I dont even know what you did but I think everyone helps everyone on here, people having relapses , difficulties with whatever , as well as people who ,for now are making it. What kind of forum would it be if everyone was doing just "peachy " no problems ,no setbacks -wouldn't even be real . We all need each other at all the different stages and faces addiction takes us through. You're relapse may be another person's salvation and I think we all have something to offer so tell your story . It may help you and someone else. Linda

[kathleen5hockey]

Originally Posted by stangangel22

dear kathleen,
just wanted to say you and your family have been in my prayers and thoughts today..
god bless you..
i failed today, so i dont feel i should even be on with ya'll here for now. we come here to get assurance we can be successful in whatever addiction it is we are fighting to overcome..anyways, ill keep coming back to read, but i dont think ill leave anymore msgs..it wouldnt be helpful..

good luck, and god bless you and your family..they're lucky to have you

First, I am calling you Angel from now on, it's more appropriate. Please don't be hard on yourself for failing. Heck, I cut down on cigs but am still smoking. You MUST leave posts, I look forward to them. You have valuable information for me as the child and I have valuable info for you as the parent. If it was easy to quit any addiction there wouldn't be forums to help us. We are all here for you, use this forum. Here you can speak the truth without having to look anyone in the eye, you can really benefit from all of us. I know that you hurt because of the letter your parents sent you while in jail. Have been thinking about it alot. My suggestion is to send your parents a card, something light, just to say hi. Let them know you are safe and ok, don't ask for anything. As a parent I can honestly say that would make me feel alot better.

My daughter is ok, didn't know how she would react. Her father was with her in the morning then I went down so he could get a 1/2 day work in. We have talked a little but the boyfriend has been around alot.

Robert, any ideas on vitamins to help curb the nicotine w/d?

Thanks to everyone for being here. Didn't get on the computer this weekend, worked my butt off in the yard. Pruning everything.

[methadonfriendly826]

Addiction is a difficult thing to understand. And when its your son or daughter its even harder. I myself am a recovered addict (heroin). I am 22 years old. I am a methadone advocate and really do believe it has saved my life. I have been clean since starting methadone treatment about 6 months ago so thank god. I do not blame anybody but myself because it is nobodys fault but my own. It is terrible to hear what your going through. I hope everything works out for you kathleen. The first thing your daughter needs to do is hit a bottom. That means she hits a point where she can no longer take it and she herself decides she has had enough. No one can make her quit but herself. That is what happened to me. Hopefully she realizes what she is throwing away and her bottom isnt too far down the road. Good luck kathleen i wish you and your daughter the best.

[kathleen5hockey]

I am a recovered addict (heroin). I am 22 years old. I am a methadone advocate and really do believe it has saved my life. I have been clean since starting methadone treatment about 6 months ago so thank god.
Thank you for sharing, I have to hear how people have recovered from heroin. You are young enough to have a new life! She is on methadone but wants to go back to suboxone. Keep posting on your progress!

[Freedom4me]

Kathleen,
I'm still watching your thread. You should feel so good to have so much support here. Life is about looking forward and not backward right? What's done is done. Keep moving forward. you are a wonderful mom

Stanangel,
Please don't stop posting. Get back on the horse. I'll saddle it up for you!

[stangangel22]

how could i NOT continue being a part of this forum, ya'll are truly god's angels..thank you so much for your show of true concern and your caring words..
as for me, i regret to say that i did not go to the na meeting that i was wanting to attend.in fact. i havent been anywhere. i have so much shame in myself i cant bring myself to face ANYone for the past several days.ive GOT to get out of here, if just to get some fresh air, lol. i think my problem, is that my desire to no longer be an addict is SO STRONG that i believed id have no problem once i made my decision, and now im doubting that i can do this, and therefore i totally am hating myself right now.the only way it seems i can keep myself on right track is being on comp, lol, or staying in bed under my covers,hiding from the world..which is what ive been doing..and hating it

[stangangel22]

thank you for your words of encouragement, i liked the way you said it..made me laugh..everyone is really great on here, im glad i found ya'll.

[Freedom4me]

Stangangel,
This is not a perfect process. You just have to keep working at it. There are no guarantees. I like your idea about getting out, taking a walk. it will be good for you. Your drug of choice is heroin right? I undertand that can be really tough to get off. But people do get off of it. Mine was vicodin. Did the cold turkey thing. Boy did that suck. When I was young I tried the pot and coke thing a few times and drank a little but I didn't get myself into any trouble until I hurt my back and was given vicodin. I told myself it wasn't bad since my doc gave it to me. Wrong! It's been 3 months and although I never will, I can still remember that feeling it gives you when you take one. I miss it. Just won't allow myself to have it again. Take baby steps. Set small goals that you can achieve. You will start feeling better about yourself. Self esteem is important and sounds like yours has been beat up a little bit. I'm proud of you for just being here. You should be too. That means you have the sense to know you need to change. You will change. Let yourself go slow. You have your whole life ahead!

[anotheraddict]

Kathleen,

You were on my mind all weekend. Are you doing okay? I am concerned about your daughter of course, but I worry about the toll this is taking on the rest of your family. I know that you are struggling with the decisions made. Just know that you are in my thoughts and prayers. I am supposed to be sleeping as I start a new job 3rd shift tonight, but I was thinking of you, so I decided to get on here and read some posts.

Angel,

I agree with Kathleen. Don't think about going anywhere. Whether you are clean or not at the current moment, we can help you. You want to be clean, that's what's important. Stick with us. You can help others out as well, and that's just as important. You are a valuable resource as you have already seen.

Jean