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Kadain vs Fentanyl-Please Help
  1. #1
    martyd is offline New Member
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    Default Kadain vs Fentanyl-Please Help

    I am taking 500mg. of Kadain a day. I been on them for one year and it's not taking my back pain away. When I was on ox's 80mg 3x a day I was able to stand for an hour before my back pain started. I donot want to go back on ox's because the high's and low's were to much for me. When I see my Dr. next week I am going to talk to her about the Fentanyl patch. Can anybody tell me about the patch. Is there highs and low's? I donot want to crash again because when I was on ox's and the Dr. put me on Kadain I crash for a month untill she uped the dose.
    What dose do you think the Dr. is going to put me on with the Fentanyl patch?
    Dave-I would like to hear your input.
    Thanks Marty

  2. #2
    mpvt is offline Platinum Member
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    Marty-I e-mailed you...Good luck.....Dave

  3. #3
    martyd is offline New Member
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    Thanks Dave. I went on line [Fentanyl Patch] there is a site for dosing. It tells you what mg. you should be taking./ I was on 500mg.
    Kadain it told me I should be taking 124.11 Fentanyl Patch. Then I put in 240mg. of Oxy's and it came up with 124.11 Fentanyl. That is on the money....So---When I was taking 3 oxy's a day at 80mg. each. My Dr. put me on 50mg. of Kadain 2x a day. What was she thinking, now I know why I crashed. Don't these Dr's know?????? So now when I go see her this week I should be on 124mg Fentanyl. The only thing I donot know is how long is the patch good for? Do I change the patch once a day? On the second day is it still 124mg?

  4. #4
    mpvt is offline Platinum Member
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    The patches are supposed to last 72 hrs.My friend leaves his on for 4 days while he puts a new one on every 3 days.Most people after they have been on them awhile will get the doctor to order them every 2 days instaead of every 3 days but that's after you get a bit of a tolerance.....Dave

  5. #5
    stickyfingers is offline Junior Member
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    It will take a good 12-24 hrs. after putting the patch on before you notice any effects. You shouldn't feel the big ups and downs as with the Oxycontin. The way it's released from the patch gives you a more sustained relief of pain and possibly some opioid euphoria. Fentanyl is a powerful, effective drug and should do you well. I'm not sure if you'll be taking it for long-term or short, but as you probably know, it's highly addictive and a nightmare to kick cold turkey. Hope it works out.

    JP

  6. #6
    razmataz53105 is offline New Member
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    I have been going trough over 7 years of being on pain meds for my back. I started on Oxy 40mg 2 times a day and went up to 3 times a day. Oxy is Very addictive. I was on them for 2 years still in pain when I went through surgery to try and help the problem, and then again surgery for stimulator that didn't work and then a Morphine Pump that worked, but caused some reaction and made my blood pressure rise and a auto immune response to the tubing that is very very rare. The tube goes from the pump into the spine and into the spinal fluid, so you take less morphine. Even tho the morphine helped allot the problem with a reaction went on and got worse. I should have had a doctor due something right away because my face swelled up like a softball at home and had a staff infection, but I just didn't want to get out of bed I felt so bad. I had low white blood cell count, low Iron, missing protein and new pain in my face hands and feet, and vasculitis on the out side of my skin.
    Anyways I had to have the stuff taken out of my back and went on the Fentanyl Patch that did help some 100 mg every 3rd day, but in the summer the heat will cause it to release faster making me having lows on the third day. After getting off the patch and still having my problems continue to get worse I tried all sorts of pills that I couldn't get out of bed and ended up in the hospital.
    Finally I was put on Kadin 2 times a day and it took a couple days but it does not mess with my head like the patch and the oxycotine. I have been on all sorts of pills for never pain in my back and now in my face hands and feet, lose of vision in my one eye, lost my sense of smell and many tests for MS. I don't know if I have MS but I do know that I had a reaction to the surgeries and have been still getting worse since even tho they removed all the stuff from surgery.
    Since I have been on the Kadin for over 18 months I have been much more clear headed. The time released is prefer as it is not able to be misused. I never had a problem with that, but didn't like the forgetfulness and all the other side affects. Kadin has worked great for me and on a lower dose. For some reason it just works better. Even tho I can't due much I'm not over tired and all that like I was on the other meds and no ups and downs. I may have to increase in the future, but I don't like being on pain meds. And now I don't like surgery.
    I hope things work out for you. After 6 years of pain meds and surgery’s Kadin was the best thing I have been on and I recommend it. just like any drug you may become tolerant, and might have to increase or temporally go on something else for a month or 2 and then go back on it for the morphine based drugs to work better again like with the morphine pump they told me off for 3 weeks and then put it back on. Also the Fentanyl Patch was coming off all the time. So I would recommend kadin for Nerve and back pain.


  7. #7
    cdhowlett is offline New Member
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    Default patch vs. morphine/kadian

    Quote Originally Posted by martyd View Post
    I am taking 500mg. of Kadain a day. I been on them for one year and it's not taking my back pain away. When I was on ox's 80mg 3x a day I was able to stand for an hour before my back pain started. I donot want to go back on ox's because the high's and low's were to much for me. When I see my Dr. next week I am going to talk to her about the Fentanyl patch. Can anybody tell me about the patch. Is there highs and low's? I donot want to crash again because when I was on ox's and the Dr. put me on Kadain I crash for a month untill she uped the dose.
    What dose do you think the Dr. is going to put me on with the Fentanyl patch?
    Dave-I would like to hear your input.
    Thanks Marty
    I loved the fent. patch once the dose is right, the best part is you get to wake up with no pain........two problems i had were that insurance quit paying, and thier 60 bucks a patch, and the other problem was after about 6mos. I started having night terrors- to the point where I didn't want to go to sleep from fear of the re-accuring terror.... it was bad, once I remember getting shot in the back of the headand dying.so the doc stopped them and I am back on oc, which after six years now have the least side affects for me.
    Geez what really works it suckls cuz it's ileagle. so i wont talk about it here.
    T/C bud.

  8. #8
    janthomas is offline New Member
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    Default Think long and hard

    Quote Originally Posted by cdhowlett View Post
    I loved the fent. patch once the dose is right, the best part is you get to wake up with no pain........two problems i had were that insurance quit paying, and thier 60 bucks a patch, and the other problem was after about 6mos. I started having night terrors- to the point where I didn't want to go to sleep from fear of the re-accuring terror.... it was bad, once I remember getting shot in the back of the headand dying.so the doc stopped them and I am back on oc, which after six years now have the least side affects for me.
    Geez what really works it suckls cuz it's ileagle. so i wont talk about it here.
    T/C bud.
    Listen the Patch works no doubt. The problem is that the addiction is extreme. Getting off of it is just as bad as if not worse then getting of of >>>>>>. Your doses will go up if you are on it for a long period of time. The body gets to where it needs more to give the same pain relief. The higher the dosage the worse the addiction. The more you take the more you sleep and yes for the fist year you feel great. But lets be honest when you have back pain it never ever really goes away no matter how many drugs you take.
    I am unfortunate enough to have two people that I love very much on the Patch. Let me tell you when their drug level is not high enough they are completly unbearable to be around. They have to have it and they will do what they have to to get. Just like any other drug addict. I have to keep his under lock and key. I wear the key around my neck so that he can't get to the Patches. Because they work great he thinks the more he takes the more he can do. But when he has to much in his system it is like being around someone that is totally wasted and it is horrible.

    Do yourself a favor and just think long and hard about weather or not you want this addiction. Read everything that you can find about the patch. The reason insurance companies are not wanting to pay for it is because it is so addictivej plus very expensive the higher the dosage the more it cost. My husbud is at 200mg and to pay for it would cost us $1000 a week the insurance company has tried many times to stop payment on them and so far the doctor has talked to them and changed their minds.

    As a person living with someone on the Patch. I personally HATE this drug. It has ruined our lives and I have thought many times of leaving but hope that he will be able to get off of it soon. Good luck and please really look into all of the effects that this drug has on your body and mind. To me it is not worth it. Because it will never make your back stop hurting. There is nothing that can do that until they figure out a way to fix the back.

    jan

  9. #9
    Meezers7 is offline New Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by martyd View Post
    I am taking 500mg. of Kadain a day. I been on them for one year and it's not taking my back pain away. When I was on ox's 80mg 3x a day I was able to stand for an hour before my back pain started. I donot want to go back on ox's because the high's and low's were to much for me. When I see my Dr. next week I am going to talk to her about the Fentanyl patch. Can anybody tell me about the patch. Is there highs and low's? I donot want to crash again because when I was on ox's and the Dr. put me on Kadain I crash for a month untill she uped the dose.
    What dose do you think the Dr. is going to put me on with the Fentanyl patch?
    Dave-I would like to hear your input.
    Thanks Marty
    Hello, I am not sure if this is where I am suppose to be replying, but, here goes. The Fentanyl patch is good between 48 and 72 hours. However, there is break through pain in between, therefore, the Doctor is suppose to prescribe you something like Oxycodone, Oxycontin, MS Contin, etc.

    Fentanyl Patches vary. They go from 25MG(mcg), 50MG(mcg), 75MG(mcg) and 100MG(mcg). I think the mcg stands for micro milligrams. Anyway, should you already have a high tolerance for the opiates, the will more that likely put you on the 100. Be very careful with these. There are people known to eat the jelly out of the Fentanyl patch and have died. Then there are people that have done this in small amounts and were okay. By eating Fentanyl is like doing >>>>>>. Please be very careful with all of these medications. They are all extremely dangerous if not taken properly. Good luck with your pain.

  10. #10
    lawslittlegirl is offline New Member
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    Thumbs up Re: Duragesic or Fentanyl Transdermal Patch

    I am a cancer patient and I have been on the Duragesic patch for 2 years + this round, and they did come out with a generic finally after many years. I am unable to work and I have been fighting SSA for my DIB since 2002 and I do not have health insurance so I called Jannsen the company that makes the Duragesic Patch and told them of my situation medically:
    I have battled bilateral breast cancer, I had double mastectomies, then hysterectomy, then nose and face cancer and now I have 2 brain tumors and they do not want me on any medication with aspirin, and we all know that aspirin is the best thing for a headache, but it thins the blood and if I have to have emergency surgery I will bleed out so the company totally understood my need for the medication and then I have no insurance of any kind and no friends or family, so they give me my medication monthly.
    God bless them!
    You will see and feel the benefits within 24 hours, most likely sooner.
    I can tell you I have other medical issues also like MS and back and leg pain, and I do have bad frequent headaches due to the brain tumors, so there will be times you will need to still take oral meds, I take oral meds maybe twice a day and not everyday. This is a better alternative than wearing the pump constantly, due to all the cancer, I have very few veins and the morphine destroys the veins after continual use, so I am really happy with this medication. Most opiates cause headaches and this does not!
    You must be opiate tolerant which I read that you are and you do need to be very careful and keep these locked up, they are a Schedule II drug and are killing people because they are eating it, I do not understand why anyone would want to do something like that but it does happen and there is always something going on with overdoses and fentanyl. This is much stronger than MS and you should have someone with you when you start using the transdermal system, as always there are side effects and if you have never had fentanyl you do not know how your body will react to it, so please make sure you have someone with you for at least the first 24-48 hours.
    There is a schedule inside of each box of 5 patches and use it so you do not change it too soon or you will become quite ill. They are to be changed every 72 hours and I started on 75 micrograms, I am now on 100 micrograms that is released for a continuous 72 hours, it is releasing the dosage your doctor prescribes on a regular basis throughout the 72 hour period, it's released through the skin and you must be very cautious when you do certain things and I will give you some examples that no one nor does the prescribing info tells:
    Do NOT sleep with a electric blanket
    Do NOT sleep on a waterbed
    Do NOT get out in the sun or heat
    If you must drive keep the patch covered and A/C on
    Do NOT rush around the house in a hurry the more your body heat increases, the more fentanyl is released into your bloodstream, and you will get violently ill and have dry heaves for days or worse it can result in death.
    Also keep in mind when you remove a patch, it still will release the medication into your body because it is in the pores, so if you feel ill or have problems breathing take it off as quickly as possible.
    The patch does irritate your skin a little, it itches after a day or so. but not a big deal.
    The only bad thing that I experience with these are:
    Dry Mouth - definately keep water, mints, etc. wherever you go
    Bad Taste - After a week or so all food will taste different, so you will not want or desire to eat as much as you would have liked to, basically I would get upset because nothing tastes right, but I have lost weight which is ok.
    Eventually you may get to the point that you don't care if you eat or not, but you have to eat, I drink plenty of fluids and I try to remove my patch at 72 hours leave it off for a few hours, and then eat, put a new patch on and I'm good to go.
    I have been on everything and this is a good medication, you can function better than you would imagine, it has been excellent for me and the company is wonderful to work with.

    I wish you good luck with them and I hope they will be a blessing for you as well.

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