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Subutex versus Suboxone
  1. #31
    TripChaos is offline New Member
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    Thumbs down Swim used to do it all the time

    Quote Originally Posted by Robert_325 View Post
    No one said that at all. But take a bunch of naloxone (that's in suboxone) then shoot some >>>>>> and see how much you enjoy it. You'll get sick as hell. Tell me that is fun. Abusing subs is goofy.
    Haha um yea SWIM used to take his suboxone (as a last resort if he couldn't find any dope) and find some dope then shoot it up an hour or so later and just get higher. It's the other way around don't do dope THEN take Suboxone until you've already started to withdrawal.

  2. #32
    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    Quote Originally Posted by TripChaos View Post
    Haha um yea SWIM used to take his suboxone (as a last resort if he couldn't find any dope) and find some dope then shoot it up an hour or so later and just get higher. It's the other way around don't do dope THEN take Suboxone until you've already started to withdrawal.



    Thank goodness we have SWIM (whoever would name their kid a stupid name like that) around to straighten everything out for everyone else.

    No one cares here how SWIM shoots his dope or his suboxone. Go to one of the drug abusing sites, they're everywhere on the net. This isn't one of them.
    Lauren Caruso likes this.
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

  3. #33
    Mystasia79 is offline New Member
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    I hope Im posting correctly, this is my 1st time on here. Anyway, Im a 30 yr old single mom of two girls and Ive been an opiate add for almost 14 yrs. Started off with tabs and norcos, then went to oxys and then to the methadone clinic for 6 yrs on a very high dose, then >>>>>> for 2 yrs and now the past 2 yrs have been on suboxone. My current dose is 2 8mg tabs daily. I have been feeling super depressed the past few months and dont know what the hecks goin on. Now my dr is giving all his patients the option to start taking subutex starting next mth due to alot of ppl not hvng insurance, and subutex is much cheaper. Where i live, 42 8 mg suboxones are approx $300.00 give or take 10 bucks depending on where u go. My main ? was if I switch to the subutex will I have any discomfort at all, will these headaches and depression go away, or will everything be completley the same? Soory so long and thank u!

  4. #34
    drtnmyiz is offline New Member
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    Default children... enough arguing. I have a serious question.

    I have been on Methadone for several years. At one point I was taking 240mgs per day. I am down to 40mgs, and believe I am ready for the next step of my recovery. I am trying to make the right decision as far as my next step. Any input(positive or negative) on either drug would be appreciated.
    I am taking all things into consideration; cost, effectiveness, and pros and cons.
    Thank you for your input.

  5. #35
    HappyDad! is offline New Member
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    Exclamation Back to the subject at hand please??

    3 Years, 1 month, 26 days clean!!

    Drug of choice - Hydro


    I just returned from a visit to my doc. I have recently cut down from 8mg to 2mg of Suboxone and have started to experience minor depression and anxiety. My doc (whom is my second treatment provider and has been WONDERFUL for many reasons!) explained that some folks, especially in my age range, at lower doses of Suboxone start to experience these symptoms. The theory, athough some believe that the naloxone is NOT absorbed at all, is that the naloxone (especially after a couple of years of treatment) has inhibited a naturally occuring chemical that is very similar to an endorphine. He suggested that we switch to 2mg of Subutex. Of course Subutex can be abused! If you are serious about your recovery, whether or not you plan on substituing Sub*** for being on the street looking for a high, you will not be ineterrested in getting high from the Subutex!

    I stayed on Suboxone becuase it seemed to cure me of a lifelong case of serious depression. Now at a low dose it is not effective. My doc will let me stay on 2-4mg of either med that is working best for me BUT agrees with me that my goal should continue to get off of all of these meds in the long run. He will never deny me my scripts as long as my tests are clean and is very supportive....

    I will let you all know how his theory works out for me. I think the N does play a larger role in SOME cases that most of the folks on this board are giving it credit for -- Peace and best wishes to all!

  6. #36
    LucyGoose is offline Member
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    Hello HappyDad, just catching up here reading posts. I am addicted to Oxy'.I am to start on in a treatment center asap. depending on their wait list. (I live in Canada)
    So I very interested in diff of Suboxone vs Subutex. Even prior to my addiction I battled with depression most of my life, the Oxy's have only made it worse. I sometimes feel like the walking dead.
    You and others here suggest that the Naloxone in Suboxone is also an endorphine blocker, so a poor choice for me (?) I don't and never would abuse , so the Dr. should not rx me Suboxone for that fear.I do not know what their drug of choice is.nor their tapering method. I will be using 'Robert's Tapering Method' which we all know if done correctly is successful (sure wish he was still here) Can you tell me if there is a large cost difference. I have a drug plan, but not sure if the cover either. Naturally they cover the dam Oxy! If you too suffer still with depression why won't your Dr. switch you ? Do you know if there any problems for someone to start on one and then switch to the other ?? Tks

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by LucyGoose View Post
    Hello HappyDad, just catching up here reading posts. I am addicted to Oxy'.I am to start on in a treatment center asap. depending on their wait list. (I live in Canada)
    So I very interested in diff of Suboxone vs Subutex. Even prior to my addiction I battled with depression most of my life, the Oxy's have only made it worse. I sometimes feel like the walking dead.
    You and others here suggest that the Naloxone in Suboxone is also an endorphine blocker, so a poor choice for me (?) I don't and never would abuse , so the Dr. should not rx me Suboxone for that fear.I do not know what their drug of choice is.nor their tapering method. I will be using 'Robert's Tapering Method' which we all know if done correctly is successful (sure wish he was still here) Can you tell me if there is a large cost difference. I have a drug plan, but not sure if the cover either. Naturally they cover the dam Oxy! If you too suffer still with depression why won't your Dr. switch you ? Do you know if there any problems for someone to start on one and then switch to the other ?? Tks


    so the Dr. should not rx me Suboxone for that fear.I do not know what their drug of choice is.nor their tapering method. I will be using 'Robert's Tapering Method' which we all know if done correctly is successful (sure wish he was still here)

    hold on Lucy well make sure you get the help you need...
    melinda

  8. #38
    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    Quote Originally Posted by LucyGoose View Post
    Hello HappyDad, just catching up here reading posts. I am addicted to Oxy'.I am to start on in a treatment center asap. depending on their wait list. (I live in Canada)
    So I very interested in diff of Suboxone vs Subutex. Even prior to my addiction I battled with depression most of my life, the Oxy's have only made it worse. I sometimes feel like the walking dead.
    You and others here suggest that the Naloxone in Suboxone is also an endorphine blocker, so a poor choice for me (?) I don't and never would abuse , so the Dr. should not rx me Suboxone for that fear.I do not know what their drug of choice is.nor their tapering method. I will be using 'Robert's Tapering Method' which we all know if done correctly is successful (sure wish he was still here) Can you tell me if there is a large cost difference. I have a drug plan, but not sure if the cover either. Naturally they cover the dam Oxy! If you too suffer still with depression why won't your Dr. switch you ? Do you know if there any problems for someone to start on one and then switch to the other ?? Tks



    Hi Lucy,
    We still may be around. Depends on some things but I will help you don't worry. I prefer subutex to suboxone and just talked to someone who has used both subutex and the new generic that's available. It's just buprenorphine, same as subutex. Said there was no difference when you break the pills up into smaller doses and they only cost about $2 a pill vs $8.50 on the subutex. I would get the generic subutex as they don't have a generic suboxone with the naloxone and it will still cost you $6-$8 or thereabouts. I won't disappear on you don't worry.
    Last edited by Robert_325; 01-14-2010 at 02:37 PM.
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

  9. #39
    GenRx is offline Junior Member
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    Anyone who thinks that the Naloxone in Suboxone is put there to send a person into precipitated withdrawals is wrong. It isn't the Naloxone that will send a person into precipitated withdrawals if Suboxone is taken to early (ie. when you're not sick), it is the Buperinorphine in it. The Bupe has such a high affinity for the opiate receptors in your brain that it effectively "rips" all the other opiates out. This temporary switching over point, from when the Bupe takes out the other drug and inserts itself (temporarily leaving the receptors bare), is the precipitated withdrawal stage.

    The Naloxone was simply put into the medicine as a deterrent, mind you not a literal deterrent, but a psychological deterrent. If you crush, snort, or inject Suboxone, and you've been inducted and stabilized on it then the same thing will happen as if you took your dose under you tongue. This isn't widely mentioned however, because in order for the pharmaceutical company to keep its FDA approval for Suboxone as a treatment for opiate addicts, they needed a way to deter the transfer, and abuse of it. So therefore, they came up with Naloxone, which allows Suboxone to be dispensed by a doctor rather than, say, a methadone clinic.

    GenRx

    *Please note I'm not a doctor. I speak from personal experience and do not encourage anything written in any of my posts.

  10. #40
    Anonymous Guest

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    yep been there done that with precipitated withdrawls.

    i know it was the bupe that knocked all the methadone off my receptors and left me sick as.

    naloxone, just to stop us hitting it. im iv. well was.

    hi lucy.!!

    cheeky

    hey lucy, i had to pay for my subs here too in nz, but coz the dose is always decreasing, its nowhere near as expensive as a street habit or anything.
    hope it still works out ok for ya mate.
    Last edited by Anonymous; 01-14-2010 at 04:56 PM.

  11. #41
    godwetrust is offline New Member
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    Default Naloxone can be very bad for some folk

    There was one post here that called Naloxone 'evil'. I won't go into the reason why I am good resourse for this type of information, but I have educated myself to the point - where I have found minor deficits of knowledge even in some of the best suboxone doctors. Unfortunately, I had to make myself an expert to better my life. Getting back to the Naloxone evilness - it really can be a very very bad additive for some patients. The whole deal with sweating, oddness, and increased anxiety/depression can indeed arise from use of this drug. Much of this is even in the side effects documentation. But I know for certain that I am one of those folks who may be hypersensitive to it. Even though suboxone was a major improvement to the alternative, each time I took it I knew there was some degree of real poisoning going on. This was a gut feeling that was absolutely confirmed once my doctor trusted me to try subutex. He won't script subutex unless 1. you are down to 4mg of suboxone 2. He knows you are not a shooter and 3. obvious issues arise with naloxone.
    My issues were not obvious but subtle and given that the net positive was still in effect we never went to subutex until I complained of sweating (miserable in winter), and myoclonic twitches.

    Well, all I can say is, the oddness is gone, the mental issues have subsided and I'm back to normal. As normal as a patient needing this kind of drug can be. So .... major kudos to that earlier poster. And Yes, Naloxone can be hazardous to your system, at least for some people. I am absolutely convinced. If you are just 'not right' with the sub., and meet the other criteria as mentioned above. Tell your doctor. Show him these posts. They miss a lot of the real info cuz their lives are just as busy and absorbed. But the good doctors will take notice and get things going in the right direction.

  12. #42
    nancy52 is offline Junior Member
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    You bring up a very good point about nalaxone being bad for some people but unfortunately some doctors will not give you subutex under any circumstances whatsoever. You can abuse the sub more easily with subutex and the doctors just aren't up to taking the risk that people might shoot or snort the drug. Subutex should be the standard for non IV users but alot of doctors just refuse to do it.

  13. #43
    LittleRicky is offline New Member
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    its great hearing from all of you! knowing there are many out there who understand.. Remember Each Day is a battle. subs are your weapon. if you lose one day, get up and fight harder the next.

    never touching drugs in my life, and being a pro athlete..in 2006 i had back surgery to fix a terrible injury.. i took pills after that.. but stopped in month with no problems.. at the time i didnt even know what withdrawals were and felt fine.. year later sum1 showed me a drug called "nubain" which blocked my entire back pain and allowed me to exercise hard and get back to my profession. after almost one year gettin high each day.. i went to a DR and started Suboxone, he began me @ 3 8mg tabs a day. (mistake).. one year and two months later Still takin SUBS 1 1/2 8mg tabs a day.. today he switched me to Subutex cause i asked BUT to me it taste much worse! normally i hear opposite BUT i am tryin to get used to subutex.. maybe cause suboxone had flavor, i liked it better.... ALSO - i kinda do feel a lil more normal using this Subutex than i did for past year on Suboxone... maybe i'm just thinking it.. any advice?? i know i need to begin to lower my daily dose.. i prefer to wait till warmer weather to come off completely..i tried before and 4 days i couldnt take it.... SO should i ask my DR to write me SUBOXONE again and give him back these SUBUTEX or should i keep tryin.. cause seriously i think SUBOXONE taste Better!!!
    ?? God Bless all of you! keep fightin!

  14. #44
    newyorkgal is offline Platinum Member
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    Who cares about the taste??? LOL. They both taste like c rap. I think subutex is better for one reason. Why put an extra drug into your body that is absolutely unnecessary, even if you don't have side effects from the narcan? Also, how long have you been on subs because you are taking a very high dose. Most people are able to start at 8 and under and gradually drop from there. Most people don't have any problems coming down at all until they hit the low doses like 2 mg. Everyone is different, I realize that, but maybe you should consider decreasing again.

  15. #45
    LittleRicky is offline New Member
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    well i have given it more time, and two things: i am stickin with subutex, it doesnt taste worse!! i was just over-reacting, i gave it some more time.. and its easier to stomachPLUS having been on subs for 1 yr and 2 mths there is a difference now using Subutex..i just feel more stable, less sad, more normal!! also, i was last using 2 8mg suboxone a day (16mg).. now just started The SubTEx i got by yesterday on just 1 8mg Subutex.. taking quarter pieces 4 times day... i will not let myself take more.
    ROBERT.(the helpful insightful positive gentleman on here!) i really wanna come off this stuff completely 4 good! i do not fear a relapse, currently taking 8 mg subutex per day.. a quarter of 8mgtab 4 times a day... PLease let me know what u think is best plan to get OFF and just have a normal DRUG FREE day!.. n e one's advice will be appreciated.
    Anyone else have an addiction to nubain? (nalbuphine)

  16. #46
    LittleRicky is offline New Member
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    ALSO, what you have to understand is NOT EVERYONE is seeing a perfect caring doctor is tryin hard to get u better and get you off subs quickly..

    until i found this board and read all of the posts.. i was NOT even aware that people used subs quickly and got better. like i said i have been on subs for 1 yr and 2 months Began @ 3 8mg a day.. then 2 8mg

    now i am on Subutex 1 8mg a day. i'm tryin

    PLUS one good reason to stay on subs longer is You may come off them and be good but 3months later sum1 could just go get high again..

    i think this has been good 4 me cause having been using subs for 1 yr & 2 mths NOW i feel ready to be of everything i feel confident that i will not let myself lose this battle. please dont bother postin negative banter.. i am uber- excited about having switched to subutex and down to 1 8mg a day.. i have no one to talk with about this besides ALL of YOU.. so what Ya'll think???

    thanks!

  17. #47
    megfromli is offline New Member
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    Default going crazy

    hello,
    I currently take 8 mg of suboxone everyday, down from 32 mg when I started treatment 3 years ago. The suboxone surely saved my life when i began treatment. Now things have come full circle and I feel like suboxone has stolen my life and my happiness. My days are made up of rapid mood swings, highs, lows, tears, and anger. At the same time I feel like Ill never be able to stop suboxone.

    2 years ago I watched my father die young from a lifetime of drug abuse, he tried everything from subutex to methadone but was never able fully separate himself from being dependent on something. Last month my fathers sister died the same way. I'm so scared that if i don't get free of this soon I will lose my life the same way my father and aunt have.

    I go to NA meetings, I see a specialist and I take suboxone. I don't know what else to do. I'm currently considering switching to subutex. Anybody have advice?
    Thank you

  18. #48
    LittleRicky is offline New Member
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    wow my brother that is intense. sorry for your loss.. i understand your feelings about suboxone..and i can admit i get those Same feelings often. BUT you must stand up strong and tell yourself using suboxone is NOT the same thing as your previous recreational drug use. it legal, it is prescribed by your doctor, it is monitored and not going to kill you. if you get pulled over with it you wont be going to jail.....
    GET IT. i hear ya and i know what it is like... the most we can do is try to come off suboxone...BUT we both have begun to use smaller doses over time so we are in the right direction.. YES you should switch to subutex. i just did and i am using only 1 8mg subutex per day.. just from 2 8mg suboxone .....
    everyone else will say to you: GOOD LUCK... BUT you dont need luck, you to need to realize suboxone is not the same as ur previous addiction, you are an addict and you are now in treatment.
    stay busy, stay healthy.

    stay away from the people that are in the different direction as you.
    exercise, eat healthy, take vitamins, begin new things (karate, classes, something positive)

    just do it

  19. #49
    jonaz5000 is offline New Member
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    Hey mystasia. I was switched from suboxone to subutex and I am much happier with this decision. it saves you alot of money if you lack insurance like I do (and many others). Suboxone costs me about 300 dollars a script but the subutex literally saves about 100 dolloars! Maybe its just in my head but I think I feel much better and "lighter?" taking the buprenorphine without the naxalone................Good luck, just an opinion brought about by a bit of experience

  20. #50
    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    Quote Originally Posted by jonaz5000 View Post
    Hey mystasia. I was switched from suboxone to subutex and I am much happier with this decision. it saves you alot of money if you lack insurance like I do (and many others). Suboxone costs me about 300 dollars a script but the subutex literally saves about 100 dolloars! Maybe its just in my head but I think I feel much better and "lighter?" taking the buprenorphine without the naxalone................Good luck, just an opinion brought about by a bit of experience



    Now you can even get a generic subutex which is just buprenorphine. It's even less expensive. Check out the generic.

    It doesn't dissolve quite as quickly as the subutex but the buprenorphine is easy to cut with a razor (doesn't turn to powder so easily). God bless.
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

  21. #51
    sean27 is offline New Member
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    Cool Subutex much better for you then suboxone

    Do not believe what the Ben-Kaiser cartel says about suboxone. It is absolute bull********. Suboxone does cause depression. Think about it for a minute. The drug nalaxone has been used in the past only as a way to reverse the effects of opiates in a patient near overdose. That is what is was designed and used for. Your body produces natural endorphines very similar to the effects you get from morphine (opiates) adter a prolonged about of time your natural endorphins start to become depleted by the nalaxone. I experienced this first hand, after takin suboxone for about six months (and experiencing headaches on a daily basis) I started feeling very depressed this lasted until I has my MD to switch me to straight bupe. Even then it took about three weeks for my body to get used to not having the nalaxone I and you become addicted to. Nalaxone is dervied from the thebaine part of the opium plant yes it too is very addictive. Being on subutex now for six months and I no longer need to take antidepressants to feel "normal". Suboxone has indeed been a miracle drug for the ben-kaiser cartel at 8 dollars a pill. These pigs don't care about you and your addiction if they did they would be fair in the way they price these drugs. All of you take my advice GET ON GENERIC SUBUTEX!!! If your MD will not prescribe out of fear of reprisals and threats from the cartel, find another one who will. Believe right now the Ben-kaisers are very upset about this new generic subutex. They lied and told my md that generic sub was only to be administered in a supervised setting whereas subutex was not. This makes no sense because it is the pharmacies who will give you a generic if you ask for it. Quit lining their pockets they do not care about any of us!

  22. #52
    newyorkgal is offline Platinum Member
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    My pharmacy in NYC told me they never heard of the generic. This was a few weeks ago. I insisted so they looked it up. Saw it was real but said that it wasn't out yet. I know this isn't true and wonder why they know nothing about the generic.

  23. #53
    MSt
    MSt is offline New Member
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    Default Cold Turkey???????????//

    Hey, I know your heart is probably in the right place but you most likely shouldn't tell someone that's been snorting oxycodone at an unknown amount at an unknown frequency for 4 straight months/120 solid days in a row (who may already be wired for the physical addiction from any prior run on whatever opiate,) that cold-turkey is best.
    Four months of daily, high-dose oxcodone, even just taken orally will precipitate a wicked withdrawal reaction with abrupt discontinuation. It only takes a few days of snorting oxy all day to get sick when you stop; 4 months will make you want to die and can be dangerous if there are other health complications.
    My advise is to always consult with a QUALIFIED professional with whom you are 100% honest about your use, history of use/abuse, prior detoxes and any+all relevant information with before deciding how to stop using an opiate.
    I speak from 15 years of personal experience with >>>>>>, oxy/many other strong prescription opiatesl, runs of different lenghts, in/outpatient detoxes, cold-turkey and much much more. I found that myself sober for 4 months, then on oxy for 3 months, daily. The withdrawal wasa 30 day hell, no kidding.
    Last edited by ddcmod; 03-11-2010 at 11:19 AM.

  24. #54
    MSt
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    Default Think about this!!!.....................

    Aside from your thoughs on pharm. companies and their interests (which I completely agree with, so there's no point in repeating,) what I do want people to think about when deciding whether to go with methadone, Buprenoriphine or Suboxone (Buprenoriphine mixed with Nalaxone,) is that while on Suboxone, you are ingesting Nalaxone, a drug which specificically blocks opiates from having an effect. The question is, does it block both endorphins and enkaphalins (AKA beta-endogonous morphine) which we all have and need in our systems naturally to be healthy and happy, and external opiates that we ingest for pain control or to get high.

    I'd like to see a study done on runners, or more specifically, on the "runner's high," as I used to run daily and know that the runner's high is for real and is a natural release of endorphins in the brain (I used to flip out if I couldn't do my daily run when I was a runner, and other runners will tell you that they get crabby and upset when they are forced to miss their runs too. Committed runners, competitive or not will run in the freezing cold, the searing heat, the snow, ice and rain and any other dangerous environmental condition. Will the naloxone block it??? Will the Nalaxone in Suboxone block the natural runner's reward??? What about the following:
    A bad car wreck or other situation where you are unable to tell the doctors that you take Suboxone. The Fentanyl (this one is especially popular mixed with midazolam/Versed for surgical anestesia/adequate sedation and pain blocking along with the major general anestethic,) or Morphine, Dilaudid, Demerol they give you probably won't work pre/post surgery until the Nalaxone clears your system and disengages your opiod receptors.

    Surgery, with no effective pain blocking due to unknown nalaxone in the system. THAT IS TERRIFYING TO ME!!!

    I take Methadone (and carry a card in my wallet so doctors will know if I can't tell them,) and have for 3.5 years at 130mg/day. I go to my clinic 1 day each 4 weeks, medicate and receive 27 "take-homes" at 130mg each due to just following the rules for the first 3 years and having legal scripts for any other drug tested for, like Benzodiazepines etc... (the rules have changed, it is now legal on a federal level to provide qualified patients OVER 100mg/day, Methadone for up to 4 weeks home medication, which is just as long as a doctor can write you for Oxycontin, Percocet, Fentanyl, Morphine Buprenorphine and/or Suboxone as you cannot put refills on schedule 2 drugs now; you need a new script every month unfortunately, even if you're a chronic pain management patient for 40 freakin' years........thank you insurance companies).

    Regardless, 10 years ago I was prescribed "Revia"/Naltrexone (same as Nalaxone but for its half-life of 24hrs). No opiate, just Naltrexone (Buprenorphine was just starting to hit the scene but couldn't be prescribed and Naloxone hadn't even been invented).
    After a few months, I decided that I didn't want my opiod receptors blocked, there wasn't and isn't enough research to say what the potential damage could be, whereas we know what Methadone does, and Buprenoriphine has generally been a fantastic detox drug in the past for me, although I've never been on it for maintenence. Now, I would have to drop 100mgs of Meth (down to 30mg/day) before making the switch, but if I do detox from the meth, I may stop and go with the Bupe, NOT the Suboxone, before stepping off completely. That's just me though.

    For me, I'm not comfortable with a pure antagonist in my system 24/7 and I just wanted to point out some interesting questions to ponder for anyone else who wishes. Thanks.
    ~MSt~
    Last edited by ddcmod; 03-11-2010 at 11:20 AM.

  25. #55
    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    just for your info, not to criticize, but buprenorphine, subutex and suboxone are all schedule III meds like a hydrocodone but not a percocet due to the oxycodone in them. Buprenorphine is a schedule III though. The following link will show how different drugs are classified by the DEA. And the naloxone in Suboxone isn't even scheduled period. Hope that helps. God bless.

    http://www.justice.gov/dea/pubs/scheduling.html
    Last edited by Robert_325; 03-11-2010 at 02:42 PM.
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

  26. #56
    newyorkgal is offline Platinum Member
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    Another thing is it is NOT the nalaxone which blocks pain medications from working. It is the bupenorphine itself which binds very tightly to the brain receptors and lets nothing else get in. Also, Nalaxone was invented more than 10 years ago. We knew it as narcan and it was the go to drug in the ER when people OD'd. It would take every bit of everything right out of your system and put you in instant withdrawal. The narcan in suboxone is barely absorbed and will only affect you adversely if you shoot or snort your sub (withdrawal). There are a small mnority of people who do react badly to the narcan in suboxone but most have no effect whatsoever.

  27. #57
    timlister82 is offline New Member
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    Default

    Hello everyone. Well, this is my story: From 2000-01 I was snorting >>>>>>, managed to get myself clean (inpatient rehab & cold turkey) before I got into any legal trouble. Unfortunately in 2002 I got myself addicted to Vicodin/Percocet after I'd gotten some for dental surgery, and the addiction lasted for about 7 years. Finally after fearing that I'd get stuck in a cycle of rehab/methadone, my marriage breaking up, spending hundreds of dollars a week doctor shopping plus paying out of pocket for scripts to keep my insurance in the dark, and feeling close to suicide, I called and admitted my problem to my mother. After discussing the options we knew about and deciding that none of them were very appealing, she some more research and came across Suboxone on the internet and forwarded the info to me. I called a local doctor and was lucky enough to get on his list the very same week. My insurance at the time (I've since been laid off - not due to drug use but the good ol' economy) did not cover the treatment or most of the cost of the meds, but I felt it was worth any amount after my first week on it. For the first time in years I finally felt "normal" and actually paid attention to the dosage on the bottle. It was truly liberating and I'll never be able to properly thank my mother for saving my life yet again.

    For the first week my doctor put me on Subutex (can't remember the dosage - probably 2 or 3x8MG/day) and then after that gave me a script for 3 8MG Suboxone a day. I don't always take 3 total - some days 2 or 2 1/2 is enough - but others I still seem to need the whole dose. I have been planning on cutting down but I was afraid to deal with the withdrawal and the possible resulting depression right now because I'm severely under-employed and the added stress isn't something I honestly think I could effectively deal with at the moment. I've tried anti-depressants in the past (Zoloft, Wellbutrin, Celexa, and a few others) but they never really helped, and at the moment I can't afford to see a specialist. But after getting on this forum and reading your experiences, I think I might have a plan that will work.

    I have been reading about the differences people have been describing between Subutex and Suboxone, and I'd like to add that when I switched over to Suboxone I did start getting nauseous, and lately I have been feeling kind of "blank". Not completely down (but more so than usual) but definitely never really "up". After reading about the newly available generic Subutex & how others have had occasional bad side effects from Suboxone, I was thinking that maybe I could ask my doctor to switch me back and I may also be able to lower my dosage at the same time. The cost of the appointments plus the Suboxone prescriptions are killing me, and I'm so afraid that I won't be able to afford to stay on the treatment. If I relapse again I'm not sure I'd have the strength to stop again, and things are so precarious that I might eventually end up on the streets or in jail.

    What do you guys think? I'm pretty sure my doctor would be open to the suggestion since he originally prescribed me Subutex, and once or twice has gotten them mixed up in conversation until he checked my sheet. I have never shot up anything in my entire life so that's not a temptation, and I feel that after 8 months of treatment I am regimented enough to handle it. To be honest the main motivation is economic, but I would like to reduce my dosage as well as soon as possible. I do think this will be a long process due to the dosage I started at plus my previous long history of opiates. Because of the large amount of money involved in long-term treatment I need to streamline costs where I can without compromising the effectiveness of the treatment. I wish that making this change about money wasn't necessary, but its better than losing the ability to stay on the program at all and is the only thing I can think of to keep myself stable. Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

    I'd also like to say that this treatment has truly saved my life. Towards the end I was really starting to lose my humanity. I quite literally could not care about anything except how to get my next script. I drained all my sick leave rushing around the city to different doctors and drained my savings paying for the urgent care appointments and most of the scripts out of pocket to avoid being caught. All of the relationships I had with others took a severe hit, and some have never recovered. This has finally given me a chance to properly live my life after almost a decade of being a pill-popping zombie. I wish I'd found out about it sooner, but at least I found out about it before I went to jail or got evicted.

    Thanks, and sorry for the long rambling post!

  28. #58
    B.crossifixio is offline New Member
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    Mar 2010
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    Default My Success Story - Best of Luck to All

    To Everyone facing the battle for sobriety,

    Below is a success story that, I believe, is worth sharing. This shows how you can come from the dumps of drug addiction to levels you wouldn't believe.

    After abusing Oxy's for a year I decided to stop the madness and seek the treatment i desperately needed. SMART. At the same time I was also on Lexapro for depression and anxiety. While on the Suboxone (4 mg/day), I felt amazing and stopped the Lexapro. My depression had disappeared and the social anxiety became much milder. I was on Suboxone for one year and I would just like to share some positive changes in my life and hope this information will aid in those currently seeking treatment. But I do have a question about the Naloxene - is this what gave me the headaches and often times I felt numb to emotions? Or, is that just the buprenophine in general?

    Anyways, my success stories despite headaches and "once-in-a-while" numbness to emotions":

    I was never a great student, although i considered myself very smart but i just never tried hard in school. The only thing I ever worked very hard at was chess. As nerdy as it sounds, I placed 1st in the state 3 years in a row and 17th in the nation (out of thousands) several years back. Studies have been conducted that fairly intelligent people sometimes turn to drugs as means to quiet their mind, among other things. The point is, while on drugs and even before, I didn't care much about school and preferred to hang out with friends/party and put obligations and priorities on the back burner. It was my last year in college when I decided to get clean and was placed on Suboxone. While on it, I had the drive and motivation to attend every class and ended up getting a 3.6 and 3.7 GPA at a well respected institution. From there I started my career and secured a fairly well paying job with great benefits. After only two months on the job I was promoted and given much more responsibility as my work ethic and drive was considered very valuable to the company. I was extremely happy, loved life, always excited to go to work, and even placed my job above fun (HOWEVER - I learned you must have a balance!!!!). I developed a great reputation at the firm and survived three rounds of layoffs - amazingly since higher management and lower management were all sacrificed. I was blessed. Even while on Suboxone, I wanted to continue to go after my goals in life so I decided to apply for graduate school at several well known and well respected institutions in NYC, Chicago and California. My companies CEO even offered to pay for my entire education (pursued a duo masters) if I stayed in state and continued my career with the company. I respectfully declined because I wanted to receive eduction from a prestigious institution and it was located out of state. Yes, many will call me crazy, but I have goals and being off Oxy's and on Suboxone is helping me to achieve them and one of my goals was attending this graduate school. My first few quarters at graduate school I secured a 3.8 and 4.0, something i never thought was possible. I am currently looking for a job but have several promising leads and above everything else, my drive and motivation will MAKE me find a job I will be pleased with.

    Point of the story is that YOU can succeed while on Suboxone. Yes, everyone is different but I am living proof that YOU can defeat drug abuse and Suboxone can be a miracle drug. Again, everyone is different, but the most important thing to getting clean and achieving your goals is your mindset. YOU have to TRULY WANT to get clean and WANT to get your life back on track in order for ultimate success. None of this BS about using subs or subutex and then doing opiates and then going back to subs. WHY do that people? You are much better than that. I know it is difficult, but get in the mindset.

    Oh, and as far as tapering off. I, for one, found it to be fairly easy - of course compared to opiates. I have read a few peoples posts about stopping at 6 MG's and that makes me sick for you. You should be tapering off down to .5 MG and even .25 MG over several weeks or even months depending on your dose. I found it to be all mental and very little having anything to do with physically. The last does I took was .25 MG for one week and then O. YES BABY, that was the way to go and I highly recommend it. You will actually be very excited to be finally at 0. My only problem was sleeping, but not for long. Just drink sleepy time tea, take a nonaddictive sleeping pill for a few days only, or just do what i did and take your mind somewhere else when trying to sleep. Its all mental when you can't sleep. You may fidget a lot, but get out of bed and do 10 minutes of stretching and then get back in bed. Or, go run on a treadmill for 10 minutes to get the endorphins going and then sleep. It is a very mild problem and you will overcome it failry quickly.

    I am a very religious man and prayer to YOUR higher power really helps. I promise. If you are not religious, do something where you are constantly talking to someone else (imaginary or real) and saying "Please help me get through this, I know I have the power and will to do so, and please continue to help me keep my mind on the ultimate goal - Sobriety." It really helps because it trains your mind to accomplish this objective. It brings a sense of peace.

    I have gone on too long and I apologize. I just know people may come across this forum and wish to find positive stories about getting clean. GOD BLESS YOU and I am excited for you to get your life back on track.

    Go Bless,
    Crossifixio

  29. #59
    AshleyStartsAnewDay is offline New Member
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    Jun 2010
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    Question Ahhhh!

    I have been using any kind of opioid consistantly for 3 years...Withdrawls for 2 years. I was prescribed Subutex (I got generic =5.00per pill) I used it for 3 weeks moved from FL to AL and here i cannot get Beuprenorphine(Subutex) so I am now on Suboxen(8.50per pill. oh joy...u get a discount,a few cents if you get a large amount.) I am now, extremely depressed and a psycho woman with allllll these mood swings. I know its the narcain (naloxone) My side effects are considered major on the list of effects...my dr does not care. so after spending $700 getting all the pills and apointment, I am optionless. Does anyone know any home remedies to tackle these horrible side effects? Or even Dr.that help with these situations I cant take it. I wanted to stay on beups for atleast 6 months(its suggested 3months per year on pills.. I cannot afford that) to repair my brain. But there is no way I can go a whole month or two like this. On the Subutex, I could get out of bed, I actually went out and looked for a job. I felt good (not high) Normal Good like you can do it you can get through this. I havent been able to make myself do anything since i got so bad on pills. Someone please there has got to be an option. Thank you...I feel so alone right now

  30. #60
    openeyefilms is offline New Member
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    Mar 2009
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    Question Effects of Subutex -No High

    Hello - not that i'm LOOKING For a high but I was on suboxone for three months, and felt a slight buzz from taking them. I also felt very normal, etc. Then, the doctor said "hey, lets switch you to the generics" so I could save money. The generic, which apparently according to my pharmacy, is generic subutex. I just started them today.
    I feel nothing.
    In fact, I feel almost as if I am starting to feel withdrawals. I'm sweating, nervous, edgy, all the same emotions I felt when I was withdrawling before I got on suboxone.
    I think its because I stopped suboxone and am taking something completely different now...? I read the articles here that its the same, but I don't think so!!!!!!!!!

    Anyone else experience this? I might call the pharmacy and ask to get me back on suboxone.

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