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06-25-2012, 05:04 PM #2101
It's now day 5 with no suboxone. For the first time in 5 days I woke up feeling like a person. I fell asleep right away last night also for the first time in 5 days. I credit the good sleep for feeling good today. Hopefully my sleep will continue to get better each day.
06-25-2012, 05:27 PM #2102
I am trying to get off subs. Can someone advise
06-27-2012, 09:10 PM #2103
Make sure u taper down properly. Read thru some of the previ ous postings forsome good advice. Good luck
Originally Posted by ibfootin
06-28-2012, 04:43 PM #2104
It's now 8 days without suboxone. I feel pretty good for the first few hours that I'm awake but after awhile the fatigue comes back. My sleeping is much better. L-tyrosine is helping a little. Right now any help is greatly appreciated. Each day is a little bit better than the previous. I guess I should be thankful for that.
07-01-2012, 05:33 PM #2105
Tomorrow will be day 12 without suboxone. My energy level is a little better each day. It just seems like such a slow process. I can't wait for the day that I wake up and feel like doing all the things I used to enjoy.
07-01-2012, 06:24 PM #2106
Originally Posted by bassguy-23
Hang in there buddy! You'll get there! God bless.
I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.
07-01-2012, 08:29 PM #2107
That day is coming, just takes a while it will get better Dog
07-01-2012, 08:48 PM #2108
I see you are always willing to help people taper off suboxone. I will do anything you tell me. How can we get the ball rolling?
07-09-2012, 12:18 PM #2109
First post, and I've read a ton here, as well as many other places, since this hell began... And I want to thank Robert for helping folks so much. Not sure what hope there is for me, my case seems impossible... I can't believe I'm taking so little of this stuff and still having trouble.
I have medical training, and years of abuse, and I do understand half-life. But I wish I could draw a picture of what I am now down to. It is a trick just to get this tiny edge of a strip on my finger. Can't even be sure if it managed to get under my toungue, as I can taste almost nothing, if anything.
I can tell you this for certain... it is not .25 mgs. I cut those miniscule pieces carefully with a sharp knife, compared it to what I know to be 1 mg, and I can tell you, if it is .18 mg, that is stretching it.
I might take it 3 days in a row, so that builds up a bit, I understand. But then I skip a day, or 2.
Yet it won't let go. 5 weeks ago, I was taking maybe .75 to .85 one day, then maybe a half the next day. Now, for 5 weeks, it has been this ridiculous spec of orange. Did I say maybe .18? That is stretching it I think. Of course, this small, it could be .14 one day and .19 another, but the point is, how can this be doing anything at all? this stuff is just unbelievable.
Has to be a psych thing, I told myself. Nope. Stop for 2 days and feel like ????, no energy, depression, insomnia. No chills really, very little rls like I had when I tried to jump from about 1.5 a year ago, but still so bad I feel like a 85 yr old man, and am having trouble just getting to work, much less doing well at work.
No chance of me tapering any slower, even if there were such a thing. I have 2 mg left, and a couple of those ridiculous miniscule spots left, and can't get any more, so I'm gonna be done wether I like it or not, even if I drag it out another 17-20 days.
You might say such it up and jump, man. I agree. I'm all about paying what I owe and being done forever. I have even laughed a few times in the past couple of weeks, which is so unusual my daughter looked at me like something was wrong. I holding on to this as progress.
gotta go for now. Thanks, just wanted to share. and will again.
Last edited by ddcmod; 07-09-2012 at 03:15 PM.
07-09-2012, 01:24 PM #2110
You can do it.. It will get better. Just stick it out. DONT GIVE IN!!! It will be worth it in the end. You cant say that you were 100% clean and sober. But now you can say you are completely clean, and make yourself a true success story. We are all here to support you. Kepp your head up!
Originally Posted by sfumato
07-13-2012, 08:12 AM #2111
Today is Day 23 without subs. Yesterday was a turning point in this whole process. It was the first day I felt 99% back to normal. I spent most of the day outside with my family and never had to take a break because of fatigue. I even had a few drinks and it didn't knock me on my butt. So far so good today. I don't have that foggy head feeling like I had for 3 weeks. I really didn't think it would ever end but just like that it did. Everyone kept saying my day would come and at the time I didn't believe them. But I was wrong. Everyone who is struggling right now you need to stick with it because it will end. Take it from me. Good luck to everyone.
07-13-2012, 09:58 AM #2112
BG, alcohol and opiates,of which subs are, are in the same class of drugs both are CNS depressants,sedative hypnotics. There is a thing called cross tolerance with drugs in the same class. IMO you are playing with fire with the alcohol DOG
07-16-2012, 10:15 AM #2113
been taking one half of a quarter (.12 roughly), so small it's almost unmanageable, for nearly a week, and skipping days at that. Still so tired I can't do much over thirty minutes without rest... and without nearly passing out.
But the worst is heart palpitations, which precipitate these spells, usually upon exertion but often at rest as well, enough to nearly make me black out. This has happened at least 2 dozen times in a couple of weeks. My blood pressure, when I finally started checking it, spiked up at times, 130/90, but now is very low for me, 99/56. Before, it was a steady 120/70 all the time, for all my life.
I wonder how common this is. I was at 1 mg 6 weeks ago, then .75 or so, tapered to half a few days, a quarter, then this dose that I can't see really doing anything at all if not psychological.
My job is in jeopardy. Have no drive or ambition for anything. Not sure this is normal, even after extensive reading. Taking vitamins, eating good and often, drinking sports drinks, no help. L-tyrosine does me more harm than good, so that's out. Cut caffeine down to a third of what it was, and it was only 2 cups of coffee in the am. Don't know what's going on but low on hope. Any comments would be welcome. Thanks.
07-23-2012, 03:03 PM #2114
If you're having major health issues like that I would go back to your doctor. Maybe now is not the right time for you to quit. The lack of energy will go away in a few weeks but the other stuff sounds serious.
07-23-2012, 09:54 PM #2115
I'm on a small dose like that right now too. I know from past experience that everything you're going through is pretty normal. You're down to a small enough dose that you (imo) should deal with a few sleepless nights and the aches/mental torture/depression. Even if you do that it will probably take 30 days to get your energy/mojo back.
07-24-2012, 08:12 AM #2116
I agree with Patrick. Don't prolong the inevitable. Your going to pay the piper now or later. Get it done my friend. It's nothing you can't handle. If not now, when? We make a lot of excuses why we can't do something. I did the same. I'm not lecturing you, I'm sharing some advice from addict to addict. Take a day or two off from work and kick. It does get better every day, I can promise you that. I am now approaching the hump of 96 hours SUB FREE after a long, drawn out taper.
COMPLETELY CLEAN (Sub FREE) as of 7/20/12
"I don't like the drugs, but the drugs LIKE ME" Marilyn Manson
07-27-2012, 10:28 AM #2117
Thanks for the comments. I took all the advice except going back up in dose, I would rather die than go back up on this wicked drug.
I went to the doctor and got a beta-blocker for my cardiac symptoms. It helped.
Sunday I took my last sliver of the sub... I had been clipping my little .12 slivers in half for at least a week. I would like to say it was psychological, but even this much was doing something. I have had none for 5 days now.
The depression and hopeless feeling is pretty bad. Some insomnia. Restless legs. But not much physical torture.
I can only hope I will get some joy back eventually. I'd like to laugh again, make plans again, have goals. Right now none of that exists in me. Typical addict coming off dope, but no dope I've ever taken has been so cruel and hard as sub.
My advice to anyone is, avoid the stuff if you have any choice. Maybe it's a good drug for short-term, rapid detox from heavy dope use. But I'd say, if any doc starts you on more than 16 mg, or keeps you on the stuff more than 90 days, you may be in for a nightmare. No drug, booze, benzos, or opiates, has even come close to the difficulty and torture that suboxone has caused me.
Educate yourself... Not by what doctors say or write, but by real users with experience. Some day soon someone is going to blow the lid off this scam and let folks know what it's doing to people. Until then, use extreme caution.
07-27-2012, 11:06 AM #2118
take a deep breath or two. your in the right place. sub is not a scam or a bad drug, it is misdispensed and prescribed by sometimes intentional and sometimes unintentional doctors. unfortunately, you found that out the hard way, just like many of us. sub is not evil, but it is a drug and you can become dependant on it. right now your expecting too much of yourself. you have to pick and choose your battles. you should focus on only kicking the habit, treating your symptoms and taking one day at a time. as you can see in my previous posts, i took it by HOURS at a time. you will get through this, you will laugh again, you will feel good, but it's a PROCESS. and you will feel bad and sad and depressed and lousy FIRST before the rewards. the best thing to do is get out of your head, stay mentally positive, know its temporary, don't read the horror stories and use whatever non drug remedy (legal ones! lol) to stay out of your own misery. .12 is not a high dose, it's lower than 90% of people who jump off at the 1 - .25 doses. YOU CAN DO IT!
COMPLETELY CLEAN (Sub FREE) as of 7/20/12
"I don't like the drugs, but the drugs LIKE ME" Marilyn Manson
07-28-2012, 03:11 PM #2119
I am 60 years "young", have a substance abuse history dating back to 1968, and after so many years of Coke, Acid, Pot, etc., I ended up addicted to Opiates and Alcohol.. I have been on Sub's for over 10 years and am currently on 8mg, down from 16mg 2 months ago.. I have been Alcohol free for 7 months..My goal is to find the lowest dose I can take that will "work" for me.. Maybe 4 mg, I do not know.. Anyone/everyone who is in this Opiate Nightmare knows 1st hand the depression, emptiness, loneliness, and desperation that comes with this drugs addiction.. All substances come with unique properties that surface when trying to eliminate them from our systems, and the symptoms Opiate withdrawal cause are EVIL to say the least..
I have tried to eliminate the Sub's from my system and a few years back went 20 day's Sub Free.. What an absolute horrible experience.. Only one who has been there could possibly relate, and I think that would be most people on this site.. This is absolutely an evil drug that was mis-represented from the beginning.. I was one of my Dr.'s 1st 30 patients back in 2002, and after several failed attempts to be truly clean and sober I turned to Suboxone to stay off the Opiates.. Fast forward to today !! Eliminating Bupenorphine from one's system is most likely the most difficult thing one will ever do.. The time frame for healing can be months , and more likely than not, YEARS... I do consider myself clean and sober as long as Sub's are the only narcotic I take.. Others will differ with my opinion.. I really do not care what others think... I have a LIFE.. I sleep at night... I DO NOT crave "other" Opiates.. I do not want to get high........ I have accepted the fact I will probably be on Sub's till the day I meet my Maker.... So What ?? Does this fact make me a bad person ?? Does it make me a Drug Addict ?? Does it mean I am weak ?? No.. No.. No..
I am sure "Others" will have there say to my post and that is exactly why I am taking the time to wright this.. For those people who choose to remain on a maintenance dose, we are no better or worse than someone who chose a different path... I understand why one chooses to stay on the Sub's.. I was told I could take an antidepressant to deal with the depression when Sub free.. But that makes no sense to me.. To trade One for Another ????????? Anyway I wish happiness to all on this site and believe if we could turn back the clock, knowing what we know today, our choices would be way, way, different............. Nathan M.
07-28-2012, 05:11 PM #2120
Nathan, people are different and different things work for different people. It is possible to taper off the subs, however if that is what is working for you I am not going to say you are wrong. There may be those that differ with me and so be it. But I am not going to tell anyone what works for them. If this keeps you drug free, alcohol free, and depression free and gives you quality of life it is not up to me to say you are right or wrong hang tight man Dog
07-28-2012, 06:01 PM #2121
sounds good in theory nathan. and i know subs saved my life. but i got off them.
the only hitch in your plan, is.... what if you needed surgery.??? the subs will block anything they may want to use... thats the only flaw i can see in your plan.
oh and being addicted to something for life. i got off methadone, one of THE most hell drugs to come off. and ive gotten off subs. the trick is to wean down reallllly slowly. i took a year and 3 months.
i have not used as long as you have. but i had a 25plus year history of iv opiates, and methadone, and crystal meth etc etc,
but i am clean today and lovin it... its sooo free....
07-29-2012, 12:21 PM #2122
Thanks for the feedback.. I am not stuck on any one point of view, and my ultimate goal is to be off the medication someday.. But my experience trying to deal with withdrawal, and the ugliness that accompany's it has left me doubting I can do the work it would take to quit.. What I was trying to accomplish by telling a bit of my story was that one is not a bad person or a "looser" if one is having a hard time getting off this stuff.. I respect anyone who has the awareness to "see", we, as people are all different and experience withdrawal differently.. It helps me by sharing my thoughts with others like me.. Unfortunately I belong to this "club" of Opiate addicts that is growing at an unbelievable rate.. How Opiates change our brain chemistry is alarming, and that "Big Pharma" turns out to be the "Opiate Cartel" is scary.. I have done research on Bupenorphine and the approach it was introduced using the optimum business model, along with how the manufactures of Oxycontin set out to make addicts out of the everyday man.. It worked !! I think Vicoden is the single most manufactured and used drug available right now..
As far as surgery goes, I have already had to deal with that and you are correct... IT IS NOT PLEASENT... I believe if one can get their dose lowered to 2ml or less, the properties of Bupenorphine changes, does not bind to the receptors as strongly and would allow a true opiate to work in managing pain.. I personally went through oral surgery, had 5 teeth pulled in 1 day, and had dental implants inserted into my jawbone.. The pain was almost unmanageable.. I was prescribed Dillaud for about 5 days.. It barely made any difference and I actually threw out the remaining 5 pills I had not used..
All I want to say is THANK YOU to those who took the time to reply to my post.. I appreciate others points of view and hope to find the strength to one day quit it all.. For now my goal is to go down from 8ml to 6ml in the next 30 days and go from there......................... namaste
07-29-2012, 01:38 PM #2123
Nathan you can do it, others on here have Cheeky knows hw to to get you off the subs if that is what you want.The Kiwi is sharp. You already are setting your goal to reduce dosage and wish you the best of luck if you want off altogether Cheeky can be a tremendous help to you I can cheer you on but do not know that much on the subs Hang tight man Dog
07-29-2012, 01:59 PM #2124
Nobody would ever discourage someone from doing what is truly working for them. Nobody who is WORTH listening to anyways. But if your looking to lower your dose, sounds like your ready to give it a start. Take it slow.
COMPLETELY CLEAN (Sub FREE) as of 7/20/12
"I don't like the drugs, but the drugs LIKE ME" Marilyn Manson
07-30-2012, 11:42 AM #2125
Again... Thanks to all for the encouraging words... I have found nothing but positive attitudes, concerned and caring people on this site.. I am somewhat of a dinosaur when it comes to computers and am so happy I figured out how to use this site.. I really dream of one day being totally drug free, and the encouragement I am receiveing is changing my attitude and giving me hope I will one day leave the Bupe's in the past..
08-01-2012, 02:07 PM #2126
Pop I have taken some time to read all the responses to your post. First let my say I empathize with you and have experienced what you are going through. I have been off and on suboxone several times since 2008. I write to you as a health care professionbal because I am concerned with some of the responses you have received. I first want to say that using another narcotic to ease your symptoms is not a good and safe way to go. The first time I was on suboxone was for one month only. I felt great after words. No withdrawal symptoms until I had the idea of going back to my pain specialist. He gave me vicoprofen and I started taking it. Within one week I began feeling horrible withdrawal symptoms. I recognize now that it was because of the suboxone. I'm back on it because it is safest for me and my chronic pain. My best suggestion is to find a doctor and explain your situation. It may take a bit to find the right one and he/she are out there. As one physician wrote we need to uncover what underlying issues we are holding onto that trip us up. Until that happens I do not beklieve a person recovers and that is why I believe many relapse. That has been my observation over a 10 year period. All my best goblue.
08-01-2012, 02:12 PM #2127
From one dinosaur to another I hope you become medication free. No matter what I or anyone else suggests you are the only person who knows what is best for yourself. Do your research, continue to post, and make sure what ever you do, go through your journey using a physician who understands as a part of your recovery. I am fortunate to find one. I hope you are doing well today. goblue
08-09-2012, 08:50 PM #2128
I know all of our bodies are not the same but I was on 8mg 2 times a day and sometimes only 1 a day and when i decided to take myself off after leaning myself off for almost weeks ..I became Ill..In full withdrawl effect with 48hrs..its the worse feeling in the world..you have to jog,walk,sweat it out..its gonna suck the life outa you but push yourself..I couldnt sleep,eat,i was in so much pain,my legs hurt so bad...I have been off for almost 2months and im still not back to normal...I hope you can do it ..Its hard but you have to want it..
08-15-2012, 08:13 PM #2129
So,was taking 8mg, once a day for about 10 months & didn't get around to getting another script so I ran out. I figured I'd just not bother, not realizing that the withdrawal was bad. I'm about a week in and it's pretty bad. Tolerable but bad. First few days there was no difference really then I became very fatigued/just feeling ??????. By Monday, I could barely stay awake at work/driving home & was waking up in sweats. I finally realized that stopping the pills was what was causing this. I put a call in to my Dr but wanted to get other perspectives of people who took this. Should I get back on and ween down or just suffer through- and for how long?!?
08-16-2012, 12:31 PM #2130
You may not yet have felt the full effect of the withdrawal.. But if you can tough it out you will never be sorry you did.. The longer one stays on this drug, the longer it takes to get off.. I am 10 years into this and have successfully reduced from 16 mg 2x daily to 8mg 1x daily.. Addict behavior tells me I need more when in fact I need less.. If you can not tolerate the withdrawals then start back at 2mg, get well, then start slowly reducing from there.. At 2mg I believe you get the full effect of Subs.. More, the drug qualities change.. Good Luck and I am sure everyone here wants everyone here to put this "stuff" behind them.. it's usefulness ends after about the 1st 2 weeks of your 1st dose.. After that ??????????