[cary32]

Hi, this is my first time on this board, sorry if this is long. I was addicted to oxycontin for 7 years. I had treatment 4 years ago, and used right after, hid my use until May, since may I have been to 4 treatments. I just can not get past w/drawals. I was detoxed w/suboxone, and was fine until 2nd day after none and it was hell. Anyway, I then went to an extended treatment because of that reason and while there I was given ultram from ER. Treatment ctr and ER doc said it was totally ok, until 2 days later Treatment center said no more. Well, as soon as I had took it, my w/drawals were gone, as was my Restless leg synd. So, I continued taking it. Before treatment when I could not get OC, I would use ultram to keep w/drawals bearable, it took 60 pills a day to do that. I am up to 25-30 already now. I am 90 days clean from narcotics, but SO SO SO mad at myself for this ultram thing. If my family found out, I would lose them for good and everyone and everything else, and they are all I have left. I have a case manager through my health insur. and I asked if she would help me find a doc to prescribe suboxone. I had tried and all were full. There are only 20 or so in this state/ She has a contact and said she will try and see if she can get me in for a maintenance of suboxone. That I know would save me compltetely. However, my worry is the doc will say I dont qualify because ultram is not a narcotic.... Does anyone know if I will have a problem with that? I would hate to relapse just so I could get on suboxone, but if I have to I guess I have to. I wouldnt until I found a doctor though. I would appreciate any thoughts/opinions. Thank you very much, and sorry again it is so long...

Caryh

[BSGjunkie]

Caryh,

Ultram is a narcotic - Don't listen to the mixed views, or even what most doctors tell you. Why do you think it keeps back your WDs? Because it latches on to the same receptors the OC's did.

You will not have a hard time getting on Sub. Tell the doc your history, along with your urge to use. Subs not only there to help people get past the WDs, but its also there to help them get through the day without wanting to take a pill.

A good friend of mine now lives a normal, health life due to sub. Prior to that - he was a lying, stealing, abusing mess. He is now the friend I remember from before his using days.

Junkie

[zippysgoddess]

Ultram is NOT a narcotic, though it does work in a similar way to narcotic medications, that is why it helps the WD's, however it does not have the same addictive potential as narcotics!

"GENERIC NAME: tramadol
BRAND NAME: Ultram
DRUG CLASS AND MECHANISM: Tramadol is an effective pain reliever (analgesic). Its mode of action resembles that of narcotics, but it has significantly less potential for abuse and addiction than the narcotics. Tramadol is as effective as narcotics in relieving pain but does not depress respiration, a side effect of most narcotics. Tramadol is not a nonsteroidal antiinflammatory drug (NSAID), and does not have the increased risk of stomach ulceration and internal bleeding that can occur with the use of NSAIDs."

http://www.medicinenet.com/tramadol/article.htm


"Pharmacodynamics Ultram is a centrally acting synthetic analgesic compound that is not derived from natural sources nor is it chemically related to opiates. Although its mode of action is not completely understood from animal tests, at least two complementary mechanisms appear applicable; binding to µ-opioid receptors and inhibition of reuptake of norepinephrine and serotonin. Ultram opioid activity derives from low affinity binding of the parent compound to µ-opioid receptors and higher affinity binding of the M1 metabolite. In animal models, M1 is up to 6 times more potent than tramadol in producing analgesia and 200 times more potent in µ-opioid binding. The contribution to human analgesia of tramadol relative to M1 is unknown."

http://opioids.com/tramadol/prescribe.html




verwon@gmail.com

My information is not guaranteed correct. I do not get them right all the time, but I do enjoy the hunt~

[cary32]

Thank you all for the advice... My big concern is that I would not be qualified to be on suboxone as maintenance because ultram is not a narcotic, despite my 7year narcotic addiction... Any idea?

Caryh

[lordy]

Oh, that hairsplitting over whether or not Ultram is a narcotic (by your Dr., I mean) must be so frustrating. I've been addicted to it. Yes! It's addicting!! And I can't believe that THAT would be the reason you wouldn't be able to get on Suboxone. I'm not much help here; I'm just scratching my head. Maybe you sould just...lie?! Sheesh.

Nicole

[BSGjunkie]

I will not debate Utram. Even as Zippy's posts states - its unclear exactly how it works.

At least there is one thing we agree on, it attaches to opiod receptors - the same ones the rest of the narcotics attach to. Suboxone works by latching onto those same receptors. It may be hard to talk a doctor into detoxing you off ultram with Sub, but I don't think you'll have a hard time getting on maintenance with your history. Its seems that you are like many others, if its not one opiate, its another (or at least another drug that stimulates the opiod receptors ). Your doctor will understand this. While the saying 'once a user, always a user' isn't true - its still hard for a 7 year habit to be kicked.

You just need to decide if you're ready to be on suboxone for an extended period of time. Read the herion addicts forum, you'll find a lot of people that have been on sub a few years now, and are having a hard time getting off.

Junkie

[cary32]

Thanks so much for all the advice. From what I understand, although I may be wrong- you have to be on narcotics and test positive for them to be on Suboxone maint. I had tried finding a doc with a open spot while I was on a sub. taper only from oxycontin and none were open, but I have a case mgr now with my health ins who has a contact somewhere and is trying to find a doc who has room for me, I guess I was just concerned he would say no since I will test negative for opiates. I guess I will just have to wait and see, I suppose as a last resort I can use opiates before I go in but I would rather not. I am really proud of my 90 days clean from opiates...It was not easy. I do beleive I am ready to be on sub for an extended period of time. I am 32 and have wasted 7 years of my life being an addict and I hate who I was, and I do not think I can get past this (mostly b'cuz w/drawals) without suboxone. I do know though, getting off it at any point would be horrible, esspecially after being on it a long time. Even just having a sub taper like I did was hell for a few days... Anyway, thanks for the advice. I like this board, first one I have found that I can really relate to so much of.

Caryh

[Junkie781]

Only speaking for myself, I think for an addict, the goal should be to end dependance on opiates. while I agree that suboxone and methodone maintence serve a needed purpose in many cases, I question their long-term value, since as it has already been mentioned here, getting off either one is just as difficult, if not more difficult than getting off the substance that these drugs were supposed to get you off....a narcotic is a narcotic, right?

Hey, I quit cold turkey, but fully understand that some people are just not capable of doing that. And I definitely would advocate someone using these drugs to taper off narcotics, but (for example) I have a friend who has been on meth maintenance now for 12 years and he's gone from being a pretty bright, full-time employed application engineer, to being an unemployed, hollow, unmotivated, shell of the man he used to be....

Just a thought for anyone thinking about LONG TERM use of suboxone or methodone. Use them to get clean, not to stay high.

Hope everyone is having a nice weekend. I live in New England and we have a blizzard going on outside [xx(]