[SchnauzerTime]

Originally Posted by SchnauzerTime

Does anyone else get a bad fishy/metallic taste in their mouth from taking fish oil? I'm on the Carlson's brand and it didn't bother me at first...but since I started taking more (I took 3 this morning), that nasty taste is back. Anyone else get this?

Hey guys,

Just found out that it's normal to have the bad taste if you take the fish oil gelatin capsules...Catherine told me to take the Carlson's liquid instead and it should help this. So if any of you are having the same problem the liquid should take care of it.

[SchnauzerTime]

I hate to hear you're still having problems walking...has your period stopped all the way yet? I'm on the last legs of mine and seem to be getting better all in all.

I'm glad that post helped about the "ups and downs" of recovery. It helped me too...I thought something was wrong with me cause I'd feel better for a couple weeks then worse and back and forth. But now every time I feel bad I'm just going to repeat to myself "Ok, I'm feeling bad...I'm healing then."

Take care sweetie and I hope you feel better soon .

[elizabethmaria]

For anyone struggling w/ anxiety during withdrawals...
There is a bunch of thread/posts on another site that with some people, the fish oil causes/increases anxiety, and some don't take it because of that - a definite difference -- just a thought ! I don't take anything at all, haven't had any anxiety/insomnia really at all - but if that's a coincidence, I don't know - I know the fish oil makes some people feel lots better, soo... Just a thought for anyone with that trouble - I know it's no fun as I had it while on the drug, and it's AWFUL! for me, no stimulation, no excesses of anything = no anxiety/insomnia...
for what that may be worth?? just an idea, thought it was interesting!
take care everyone,
EM

[auntybiotic]

I have not heard anyone withdrawaling from lexapro that had the walking problems you are experiencing. I have spoken to someone who had you exact same symptoms and it turned out that she had lyme disease and did not realize it. Uncanny but she was unable to walk, like her brain signals were crossed. I actually watched her try and walk and it was just as you describe.

Not sure if you may be explosed to outdoors and may have been bitten by a tic but you may want to get tested. It is so surreal that you and she have the SAME EXACT symptoms. She also had mini seizures because the lyme bacteria had gone into the frontal lobes of her brain. Antibiotics made a world of difference. Just a thought. Lyme disease is all over, hence my screen name.

Sorry but I have spoken to hundreds and so far no one with your symptoms except for the girl with lyme disease.

aunty

[Hairyarmadillo]

"There is a bunch of thread/posts on another site that with some people, the fish oil causes/increases anxiety, and some don't take it because of that "

Elizabethmaria Great tidbit! I am not 100% certain but I had stopped taking the old fish oil because I noticed I went back to having these thoughts of past negative incidents run continuously through my mind. This had happened at one point as I was getting off the Lexapro but passed. I had been taking the Omega 3 and it came back and I felt depressed. I stopped taking it for awhile, it went away. But the moodiness came back so I went back on the Omega 3, the moodiness passed but the obsessive thought patterns returned-things that happened YEARS ago would pop unbidden into my mind. I had wondered if it was where the Omega3 was healing the mind and this was part of the effects of all the healing process. I am now taking the Carlson's and still forget it until it is late in the day so it is every other day or so when I take it. Don't know if I should keep taking it or not. If the thoughts get too bad, maybe I'll give it up but it is supposed to have so many benefits.
HelpMe58 When I read your post, it reminded me of the all consuming bad thoughts that I went through during this ordeal. And, yes, night is the worst time for that with me, although there were times when they came when I was occupied during the day. It will pass. When they come, try to put your mind on something else-easier said than done but I have found that if I let myself go down the path of thoughts that were coming, they just kept coming. For a bit, I had thought I "needed" to deal with whatever the thoughts were so I allowed myself to focus on them. Bad Idea, it just made them come more frequently. So, shut them off by tyring to think of anything else. Trust me though they will stop.

[HelpMe58]

Originally Posted by Hairyarmadillo

"There is a bunch of thread/posts on another site that with some people, the fish oil causes/increases anxiety, and some don't take it because of that "

Elizabethmaria Great tidbit! I am not 100% certain but I had stopped taking the old fish oil because I noticed I went back to having these thoughts of past negative incidents run continuously through my mind. This had happened at one point as I was getting off the Lexapro but passed. I had been taking the Omega 3 and it came back and I felt depressed. I stopped taking it for awhile, it went away. But the moodiness came back so I went back on the Omega 3, the moodiness passed but the obsessive thought patterns returned-things that happened YEARS ago would pop unbidden into my mind. I had wondered if it was where the Omega3 was healing the mind and this was part of the effects of all the healing process. I am now taking the Carlson's and still forget it until it is late in the day so it is every other day or so when I take it. Don't know if I should keep taking it or not. If the thoughts get too bad, maybe I'll give it up but it is supposed to have so many benefits.
HelpMe58 When I read your post, it reminded me of the all consuming bad thoughts that I went through during this ordeal. And, yes, night is the worst time for that with me, although there were times when they came when I was occupied during the day. It will pass. When they come, try to put your mind on something else-easier said than done but I have found that if I let myself go down the path of thoughts that were coming, they just kept coming. For a bit, I had thought I "needed" to deal with whatever the thoughts were so I allowed myself to focus on them. Bad Idea, it just made them come more frequently. So, shut them off by tyring to think of anything else. Trust me though they will stop.

Hairy,
Bless you for your post. I thought I would be ok after being off the drug for a month and I was only dealing with a little dizziness. Then came the depression at 3 months. I started feeling sad and everything was horrible and hopeless. I began thinking and worrying about people I had not thought about for years. It was as if the nerve endings in my head were dredging up every depressing thing I had ever experienced. Then my mind shifts to my "hopeless" future. It's not constant and you are right, letting yourself go with it is a bad idea. I feel like I am constantly fighting for my sanity. Is that normal? I am functioning and no one can tell other than I am not as "jolly" as usual but inside my brain is a fog and an intermittent movie reel of sadness. This is strange and I hate it. Thank God it will go away but WHEN?
Thanks again for responding.
Has anyone experienced itching with the withdrawal also?
HELPME

[Aussiegirl]

Originally Posted by HelpMe58

Hairy,
Bless you for your post. I thought I would be ok after being off the drug for a month and I was only dealing with a little dizziness. Then came the depression at 3 months. I started feeling sad and everything was horrible and hopeless. I began thinking and worrying about people I had not thought about for years. It was as if the nerve endings in my head were dredging up every depressing thing I had ever experienced. Then my mind shifts to my "hopeless" future. It's not constant and you are right, letting yourself go with it is a bad idea. I feel like I am constantly fighting for my sanity. Is that normal? I am functioning and no one can tell other than I am not as "jolly" as usual but inside my brain is a fog and an intermittent movie reel of sadness. This is strange and I hate it. Thank God it will go away but WHEN?
Thanks again for responding.
Has anyone experienced itching with the withdrawal also?
HELPME

HelpMe

Yes, I have had problems with itchy and tingling skin also. I want to scratch my skin all the time but when I do, I realise its not really a 'real' itch like you have touched poison ivy or something like that (if you know what I mean). Its extremely frustrating and I empathise! The dizziness is driving me NUTS though, can't turn my head too fast otherwise I'm scared of falling!

[carolleah]

HelpMe58

The third month had been the hardest for me. But it will get better for you. That month my withdrawals really kicked in with severe insomnia, insecurity, depression, anxiety, hopelessness and quite literally worrying about my sanity. Also what made it worse was the disbelief in withdrawal symptoms by my husband, doctor, sister, and close friends who hadn't had problems withdrawing. I still suffer from all those, but not to the same degree. And the brain fog comes and goes, along with the headaches, tingling, and other weird symptoms. In the mornings my symptoms are less.

In order to deal with the depression and anxiety I allow myself two glasses of wine per day which helps tremendously. This you have to be very careful with because it can turn into using alcohol as a crutch. I drink red wine which I think has seretonin in it and calms my nervous system. Unfortunately, it is also a depressant so you have to be very careful about overdoing it.

I also do talk therapy to help cope with the depression. I try to keep busy in all sorts of ways. I recruit friends to walk with me and spend time together and try to be upbeat and positive because undergoing withdrawal means that you can easily come across as being down and out or self-absorbed and friends will only be able to handle so much of that. At three months off, I was truly at my worst. I was needy, depressed, could only see the negatives. It was a really hard time, as it is for you. At that time I found this forum. It was a godsend. I started to see that I was in the picture. This forum promised hope. It uplifted me. I would spend much time reading the posts which served as a virtual support group, which I didn't have in person. I saw that my withdrawals were real and what to expect. I read such heartrendering stories which made me feel like I was not alone in my suffering. I developed a telephone support group that I knew I could call if needed. Depression is a really tricky thing. It zaps the joy from your life. It takes away the ability to see the good. What I would suggest to you is know that you can write as many times AS you need to to this forum to be listened to and comforted. It was consoling to me to know and do this. Find one person, just one, to be there; to see you through. If you can't find this person, please just write to this forum. I will write in support along with the others (I am sure that they will too). Getting through those times of hopelessness early in withdrawal are the worst. There are very few windows early on, but trust me, once you start getting those windows of feeling back to yourself, it offers promise of getting well. The first few months I truly thought that I was going crazy. I called friends for support and reassurance. Eventually, I taxed certain friends so much that they started distancing themselves. Even the ones that were really familiar with antidepressants and/or withdrawal! It was interesting to see which friends remained my friends! That is how you know about who is your true friend, the ones that will deal with chronic problems. Anyway, because withdrawing takes so long you have to find ways to cope. Discussing the hardship openly on this forum helps. I used to be a multitasker, highly productive and out and about kind of person. In the last few months an apathy has overtaken my life and I find getting things done to be really hard. My therapist explained that it takes at least six months to start feeling better off the drugs based on her experience. This also gives me hope because I see that it may be another year for me.

Listen, you will need to get through the worst of it all. And as said by SchnauzerTime, it is not linear. Sometimes, it is going forward only to find it is mixed with three steps backward. The good thing is, that the experience makes you much more compassionate to others suffering. The irony of it all, is that we all wouldn't be on these antidepressants if only others had shown compassion to us through our hard times. But I guess it has to start somewhere and then we can be the ones that show compassion and save others from having to go on horrific drugs. It's like the pyramid effect. And it has to start somewhere. I try to mentor two people, that is all that I have the wherewithal to do at this point. But that is two people that I "pay forward" with the help that I have received. And those two will hopefully help two others and so on. It becomes a domino effect.

Anyway, I hope that all of this has helped. My posts tend to be lengthy, sorry about that. Just know that you are a good person, don't let anyone take that away from you. When going through withdrawals, self doubt can be really hard. I like to think that I will eventually get back to who I was years ago if I chip away each day at being that way. I really liked myself then before it all. Hardship in life really throws you for a loop, whether it is loss of a loved one, isolation, health issues, anything. Life has it's ups and downs, you have to make it through the downs to get to the good. AND if you see the good then it is there, if you see the bad, that is ALL you get.

[HelpMe58]

Originally Posted by Aussiegirl

HelpMe

Yes, I have had problems with itchy and tingling skin also. I want to scratch my skin all the time but when I do, I realise its not really a 'real' itch like you have touched poison ivy or something like that (if you know what I mean). Its extremely frustrating and I empathise! The dizziness is driving me NUTS though, can't turn my head too fast otherwise I'm scared of falling!

Aussiegirl,
I know exactly what you mean, it is like it is under the skin and it just drives you crazy. I also have the dizziness and a strange brain fog that I feel like I am constantly trying to get through.
HelpMe

[HelpMe58]

Originally Posted by carolleah

HelpMe58

The third month had been the hardest for me. But it will get better for you. That month my withdrawals really kicked in with severe insomnia, insecurity, depression, anxiety, hopelessness and quite literally worrying about my sanity. Also what made it worse was the disbelief in withdrawal symptoms by my husband, doctor, sister, and close friends who hadn't had problems withdrawing. I still suffer from all those, but not to the same degree. And the brain fog comes and goes, along with the headaches, tingling, and other weird symptoms. In the mornings my symptoms are less.

In order to deal with the depression and anxiety I allow myself two glasses of wine per day which helps tremendously. This you have to be very careful with because it can turn into using alcohol as a crutch. I drink red wine which I think has seretonin in it and calms my nervous system. Unfortunately, it is also a depressant so you have to be very careful about overdoing it.

I also do talk therapy to help cope with the depression. I try to keep busy in all sorts of ways. I recruit friends to walk with me and spend time together and try to be upbeat and positive because undergoing withdrawal means that you can easily come across as being down and out or self-absorbed and friends will only be able to handle so much of that. At three months off, I was truly at my worst. I was needy, depressed, could only see the negatives. It was a really hard time, as it is for you. At that time I found this forum. It was a godsend. I started to see that I was in the picture. This forum promised hope. It uplifted me. I would spend much time reading the posts which served as a virtual support group, which I didn't have in person. I saw that my withdrawals were real and what to expect. I read such heartrendering stories which made me feel like I was not alone in my suffering. I developed a telephone support group that I knew I could call if needed. Depression is a really tricky thing. It zaps the joy from your life. It takes away the ability to see the good. What I would suggest to you is know that you can write as many times AS you need to to this forum to be listened to and comforted. It was consoling to me to know and do this. Find one person, just one, to be there; to see you through. If you can't find this person, please just write to this forum. I will write in support along with the others (I am sure that they will too). Getting through those times of hopelessness early in withdrawal are the worst. There are very few windows early on, but trust me, once you start getting those windows of feeling back to yourself, it offers promise of getting well. The first few months I truly thought that I was going crazy. I called friends for support and reassurance. Eventually, I taxed certain friends so much that they started distancing themselves. Even the ones that were really familiar with antidepressants and/or withdrawal! It was interesting to see which friends remained my friends! That is how you know about who is your true friend, the ones that will deal with chronic problems. Anyway, because withdrawing takes so long you have to find ways to cope. Discussing the hardship openly on this forum helps. I used to be a multitasker, highly productive and out and about kind of person. In the last few months an apathy has overtaken my life and I find getting things done to be really hard. My therapist explained that it takes at least six months to start feeling better off the drugs based on her experience. This also gives me hope because I see that it may be another year for me.

Listen, you will need to get through the worst of it all. And as said by SchnauzerTime, it is not linear. Sometimes, it is going forward only to find it is mixed with three steps backward. The good thing is, that the experience makes you much more compassionate to others suffering. The irony of it all, is that we all wouldn't be on these antidepressants if only others had shown compassion to us through our hard times. But I guess it has to start somewhere and then we can be the ones that show compassion and save others from having to go on horrific drugs. It's like the pyramid effect. And it has to start somewhere. I try to mentor two people, that is all that I have the wherewithal to do at this point. But that is two people that I "pay forward" with the help that I have received. And those two will hopefully help two others and so on. It becomes a domino effect.

Anyway, I hope that all of this has helped. My posts tend to be lengthy, sorry about that. Just know that you are a good person, don't let anyone take that away from you. When going through withdrawals, self doubt can be really hard. I like to think that I will eventually get back to who I was years ago if I chip away each day at being that way. I really liked myself then before it all. Hardship in life really throws you for a loop, whether it is loss of a loved one, isolation, health issues, anything. Life has it's ups and downs, you have to make it through the downs to get to the good. AND if you see the good then it is there, if you see the bad, that is ALL you get.

Carolleah,
You really do understand what I am going through. It is exactly like that. I actually did get a bottle of red wine before I read your post because I read that it helps with weight loss in the right amounts. I think it was 4 ounces a day. That is another problem I have, the 40 pound weight gain. Even after being off for 3 months the weight is clinging but has stopped climbing.
Two and a half years ago I was thin and happy. I have always been the anxious and high strung type but like you, I was a multi-tasker and very productive. My husband got sick two and a half years ago with leukemia and was only alive for three months after the diagnosis. I began taking the Lexapro while staying in Cleveland Clinic with him. It was the only way to cope with his impending death. Lexapro saved my sanity and now it is costing me my sanity.
Now I am without my husband and with 40 extra pounds. My mother is not well and my son is leaving for college. No matter what I will not get back on the medication. The after effects are too horrible. Your list of symptoms at three months is the same as mine exactly. I am up most of the night..at least until 2 or 3. I am a teacher and will return to work soon. I'm glad, and then I'm not. It will be a distraction but then it will not allow me to rest when I need to.
You said you had another year of withdrawal. Why so long? Where are you in the process?
Actually I have no friends that would understand. I exhausted them during my husband's illness. I may just have to use this forum to get through. I have good friends but some have never even taken as aspirin and some are coping with their own depression and it brings me farther down. In other words, I start to talk about me and it ends up about them. I am ok with that and want to be there for them but it makes me frustrated for what I am going through, I have another friend who goes on and off Lexapro at will with no ill effects. My doctor says this withdrawal is not possible! She thinks I have an anxiety or depression disorder that comes back when the medicine is gone. I have never felt like THIS before.
You said you were only mentoring a couple of people but may I still write to you some? I know it would be impossible for you to answer everyone's responses but we seem to have a lot in common in the way of withdrawal. There are so many nice people on here but some of the withdrawal issues are hard for me to relate to. By the way, by talk therapy do you mean just talking to a friend or to a tape or what?
Anyway, whatever the case, I am trudging along and deeply appreciate your answers and your concern.
HelpMe

[anna bella]

Hi everyone

I'm having really bad migraines going from 5 to 4.5mg....Anyone else experience this....and how did you deal with it.... They are insane, i was thinking about getting some physio and acupuncture?????? Also after three days with the same migraine, as well as a small meeting with my boss i burst into tears... had to hide in the toilet and couldn't pull myself together....IT was over nothing...my boss was really sweet just told me i had missed a sample yesterday and could i make up some wash buffers..... I would never cry over something so stupid... I don't know if it's the lexapro or the stress of the new job... either way i don't want my work mates thinking i am a nut case.... I said i was just upset as my head hurt so much.......

The weird thing is i've noticed they seem to ease in the evening... but then come back the next day and hit full force by midday.....Does anmyone else experience this....

[carolleah]

HelpMe,

Listen I wrote you a really long post, but somehow it didn't take. I am really really sorry. I will try to write again tomorrow morning. Please hang in there. And you can write to me as often as you would like and I will try to respond. If
I can be of any help to you I will try. I said much in the last post. It must have timed out.

Each day is going to be hard, but you can do it. Find faith in yourself and the others that care about you. You'll see, time has a way of healing.

[tavee]

Can U Describe Ure Taper To Me.

Did U Go Cold Turkey??? Can U Break It Down For Me.

U Said It Hit U The 3rd Month??? What Did U Feel?

Tavee

[HelpMe58]

Originally Posted by carolleah

HelpMe,

Listen I wrote you a really long post, but somehow it didn't take. I am really really sorry. I will try to write again tomorrow morning. Please hang in there. And you can write to me as often as you would like and I will try to respond. If
I can be of any help to you I will try. I said much in the last post. It must have timed out.

Each day is going to be hard, but you can do it. Find faith in yourself and the others that care about you. You'll see, time has a way of healing.

Thank you Carolleah, I do feel better after getting your posts.

[HelpMe58]

Originally Posted by tavee

Can U Describe Ure Taper To Me.

Did U Go Cold Turkey??? Can U Break It Down For Me.

U Said It Hit U The 3rd Month??? What Did U Feel?

Tavee

Tavee,
I broke it down very slowly like you did, 10% every two to three weeks. When I got to 1 mg. I quit cold turkey. I am in my third month completely off the medicine.
For the first month after quitting I was ok except for dizzy and a little foggy. The second month I had a strange flu, aching joints, dizzy, brain fog and HEADACHES, as I moved into the third month the depression and anxiety started. I had two days of constant crying and now I have periods of hopelessness and sadness. I have really bad brain fog now. I feel like I am constantly trying to break through the barrier. I know this will pass but I hate this.
HelpMe

[SchnauzerTime]

Instead of continuing with the 10 percent decreases you went off 1mg cold turkey and are going to have a harder withdrawal because of it. It probably won't be as bad as if you quit the full starting dose cold turkey...but if you had been going down slowly then at 1mg decided to just quit, that IS a cold turkey withdrawal. You've been off of it a long time and can't reinstate so you'll just have to go through the withdrawals and tough them out so to say.
If you would have gone down by 10 percent still from 1mg , like .9mg, .8mg and so on it would have been a little easier but you cant' change that now. So, try to stay positive, I know it's hard...and eat right , take your supplements and it will get better. You'll have times of ups and downs though...you may feel bad for a week or 2 then better then bad again but that is normal...it's your brain healing.

I'm going through 2 cold turkey withdrawals at one time so I can't definatly sympathize. It's rough but eventually we WILL heal and be o.k. Just know that there is a reason for you having a tough time now...you basically tapered too fast at the end by stopping the 1mg altogether AND you are healing so that will give you pain every time a different receptor in the brain is trying to heal.

It will get better and in the meantime keep a journal and write your symptoms every day and what you ate or did differently...sometimes greasy foods/sugary food and caffeine can bring on worse withdrawals and your period can also. Stay strong and we're here for you .

[KEITH L.I]

Neck pain and dizziness seem to be fading in my 5th month..but guess what has cropped up..insomnia,the last few nights,no anxiety,just my body dosen't get tired,then I start looking at the clock and guess what it's morning.Any suggestions about a remedy for insomnia? Thanks

[elizabethmaria]

Aunty,
I don't think it's Lyme disease... When I had the acute reaction, I also had kind of what is called an acute dystonic reaction -- the inability to walk is parkinsonism - everything started on that day, so I'm sure that it is the reaction -- I did read that tardive dyskinesia (TD) is caused by either an acute reaction or long term use to neuroleptics.. that it damages the dopamine receptors in the basal ganglia.. so, it's not like 'withdrawals' but is a damaged part of the motor neurons.. or something.. I did discuss with the ssri expert doc and he said that was what it was - can take 5-10 years to recover too .. but it ebbs and flows... something about the build up of phenylalanine in the brain which is not being removed adequately due to other brain damage?? hmmm... I can post an article that I found...
I guess I was just hoping you had some experience or heard of others in terms of recovery/healing process for that part! I think it's limited to people who had an extreme drug insult to that part of the brain - probably the combo of neuro drugs they gave me did it.. I guess there are a number of drugs that can cause that to occur.... Or, the longer people are on ssris/neuroleptics = higher probability of developing TD --
I'll try to post one of the articles I found from Kansas University med center, but basic searches for TD and its causes is pretty straightforward... Just doesn't tell me when it will improve! they say the main thing is removing the offending agent, then over long periods of time, recovery occurs.. usually...
Oh well, but thanks so much anyway Aunty - it will be ok, I'm just hoping the is an ebb time, and things will start flowing again soon - I always have it, but it isn't so incapacitating usually.... these drugs are scary that's for sure... Also, I don't think people are aware of the increasing probability of developing TD unknowingly while being on antidepressants for significant periods of time - 5-10 years the chances go up and up... but it 'masks' it, until people go off... scary stuff!
thanks again so much...
take care, love,EM

[elizabethmaria]

Here's what I found, Univ. Kansas Med. Center TD homepage, Parkinson's disease and movement disorder Center...

Tardive (meaning "late onset") dyskinesia (meaning "abnormal involuntary movement") is a term used to describe a syndrome occurring as a result of treatment with medications that block the receptors for the neurotransmitter dopamine in the brain. Dopamine is involved in producing movement. If the receptors are blocked over a period of time, some individuals may develop uncontrolled involuntary movements. Onset of symptoms can range from a few months to several years after initiation of drug therapy. In contrast to a tardive syndrome (which as the name implies occurs only after extended exposure to a causative agent), symptoms may also occur within a few hours to days after initiation of drug therapy. This is called an acute reaction. Acute reactions are more easily managed and usually completely resolve within a few days.

Tardive dyskinesia was first described in the 1950s in patients treated with antipsychotic medications. The tardive syndromes can affect anyone exposed to medications that block dopamine receptors; however, women, the elderly and persons with psychiatric disorders (particularly affective disorders) are at increased risk. The incidence is difficult to estimate as symptoms and severity can vary widely and many cases are probably undiagnosed, but it is believed that up to 50 % of persons with prolonged exposure to medications that block dopamine receptors will develop a tardive syndrome. The tardive syndromes include classic tardive dyskinesia, tardive dystonia, and tardive akathisia.

Classic tardive dyskinesia most commonly appears as repetitive, somewhat rhythmical involuntary movements. Typical involuntary movements include tongue thrusting, lip smacking, lip pursing, grimacing and chewing movements, rocking of the trunk, pelvic thrusting, rotation of the ankles or legs, marching in place, irregular respirations, and repetitive sounds such as humming or grunting.

Tardive dystonia may also be seen as part of the tardive syndrome. Dystonia is characterized by sustained muscle spasms causing involuntary movement and abnormal postures of the affected area. Some examples include torticollis (the head and neck are turned to the side), retrocollis (the head and neck are pulled back between the shoulder blades) and blepharospasm (the eyelids are squeezed forcefully shut). It can also cause excessive arching of the back. Tardive dystonia clinically appears identical to idiopathic or primary dystonia (meaning "of unknown cause") but is classified as a secondary dystonia since it is the result of a known agent.

Tardive akathisia is the third type of tardive syndrome. Akathisia refers to a feeling of restlessness often accompanied by anxiety. In milder cases, the individual may complain of a sensation of inner restlessness and be unable to sit quietly without fidgeting . In more severe cases, the individual may actually be unable to remain seated and must pace or march around the room. Their sense of anxiety increases if they are unable to move about.

While the above tardive syndromes are characterized by excessive movements, individuals may also experience a drug-induced parkinsonism which appears clinically like Parkinson’s's disease. With drug-induced parkinsonism, there is an absence of movement. Individuals have slow movements with rigid or stiff muscles and tremor. When walking, a shuffling gait is present with a stooped posture and diminished arm swing. Facial expression is blunted causing a very solemn appearance. Of all the tardive syndromes, drug-induced parkinsonism is the most reversible. It resolves after the medication is stopped, but this may take up to 18 months.

Some medications that are known to cause tardive syndromes include:

Medications for gastrointestinal problems

metoclopramide (Reglan)
prochlorperazine (Compazine)
Medications for cough

promethazine (Phenergan)
Medications for depression

amoxapine (Ascendin)
perphenazine/amitriptyline (Triavil)
Antipsychotics or Neuroleptics

chlorpromazine (Thorazine)
thioridazine (Mellaril)
trifluoperazine (Stelazine)
perphenazine (Trilafon)
fluphenazine (Prolixin)
thiothixene (Navane)
haloperidol (Haldol)
pimozide (Orap)
Diagnosis is based on the patient's history and a thorough clinical examination. The criteria for diagnosing a tardive syndrome can vary but is generally agreed to be exposure of an individual to a dopamine receptor blocking agent within 6 months of onset of symptoms which persist at least 1 month after stopping the offending drug. There is no laboratory test or x-ray to confirm the diagnosis; although, such tests may rule out other conditions if the diagnosis is questionable.

The longer the drug is taken, the greater the chance of developing a tardive syndrome. Once the symptoms are noticed, the best course of action is to stop the medication if possible. Your physician will work out a tapering schedule to discontinue the drug as most should not be abruptly stopped. With chronic psychiatric conditions, this may not be an option and in these instances the medication should be kept at the lowest possible dose.

Symptoms may temporarily worsen after the medication is stopped, but avoiding this type of medication offers the best hope for a remission. Symptoms may lessen or even disappear if the medication is restarted or the dose is increased, but movements will eventually break through with an increase in severity and be more resistant to treatment.

For some, symptoms may first be noticed after the medication has been stopped (withdrawal emergent tardive dyskinesia). Once again, the best course of action is to remain off the offending drug.

Tardive dyskinesias are challenging both to the patient and medical profession. The best treatment may simply be to withdraw the offending medication and allow the symptoms to resolve on their own. If symptoms are intolerable to the patient, oral medications may be used. Some studies suggest vitamin E may hasten the resolution of symptoms. Benzodiazepines such as clonazepam (Klonopin) may provide some relief of involuntary movements and anxiety. The main side effect seen with this type of drug is drowsiness. Dopamine depleting drugs are probably the most effective medications used to treat tardive dyskinesia. Two commonly used drugs in this class are reserpine and methyldopa. These medications have side effects including depression, apathy, lowered blood pressure and parkinsonism.

Tardive akathisia may be treated with beta blockers such as propranolol (Inderal). Side effects can include slowed heart rate, lowered blood pressure and depression. It should be used cautiously in persons with certain types of heart and respiratory diseases.

Tardive dystonia may be relieved with anticholinergics such as trihexyphenidyl (Artane) or benztropine (Cogentin). If is important to note that these medications (while beneficial in some cases of tardive dystonia) will typically worsen tardive dyskinesia. Certain types of tardive dystonia may also be treated effectively with local injections of botulinum toxin.

Treatment may require trials of different medications at different doses and a great deal of patience. Just as each individual is unique, so must the medication regimen be tailored to their specific needs. While some tardive syndromes are persistent, most individuals gain some degree of relief with oral medications and the natural resolution of symptoms as time off the offending agent increases. Some experts believe the time an affected individual was exposed to the causative medication can be correlated to the length of time needed for symptoms to resolve.

Research is currently underway in both the treatment and prevention of tardive syndromes. As our understanding of the neurochemistry of the brain increases, new medications are being developed that spare the dopamine receptors involved in syndromes such as tardive dyskinesia

[antidote]

Originally Posted by SchnauzerTime

I too get the "hard" heart beat thing. It feels worse when I lie down and it's like it's just beating hard and fast. Also, I get a "vibration" type thing in my chest...it's very strange. I was told it's all anxiety so what you are going through is the anxiety from the withdrawal.

Are you on magnesium and calcium? These 2 things help with anxiety...take about 600-800mg of magnesium citrate or glycinate throughout the day...one pill of 200mg or less every 2 to 3 hours. Don't take it after supper though. And take about 500mg of coral calcium right at bedtime. Take the magnesium with food such as a meal or snack. This is what I was told to do for my anxiety...I've taken more magnesium today and it has helped some. You have to be patient though cause I've heard it takes magnesium awhile to build up in your system (couple months) so it may not be a huge difference at first.

I've been off Wellbutrin cold turkey for 6 months and switched from Paxil to Lexapro cold turkey at that time also. I have periods of ups and downs...like I'll feel better for a week or so then bad again...do you have this also?

Oh also...I bet it was your vacation that brought back some withdrawals when you got home...alot of times when you do things you don't normally do that are physically taxing it won't "hit" you till a day or 2 later. Just try to relax and don't do anything you wouldn't normally do...like push mow the lawn or something .

SchnauzerTime

Thanks a lot for your reply. i was on Magnesium Malate for a while. At first it seemed to help; better sleep at night and in general a better sense of calm. After about a month or so things seemed to get worse like stronger tremors and that electricity feeling in my hands in the morning - so i stopped the Magnesium just to see - and things got better.

I'm starting to subscribe to EM's approach of avoiding as many supplements as possible and just let your body recover naturally.

[HelpMe58]

Originally Posted by SchnauzerTime

Instead of continuing with the 10 percent decreases you went off 1mg cold turkey and are going to have a harder withdrawal because of it. It probably won't be as bad as if you quit the full starting dose cold turkey...but if you had been going down slowly then at 1mg decided to just quit, that IS a cold turkey withdrawal. You've been off of it a long time and can't reinstate so you'll just have to go through the withdrawals and tough them out so to say.
If you would have gone down by 10 percent still from 1mg , like .9mg, .8mg and so on it would have been a little easier but you cant' change that now. So, try to stay positive, I know it's hard...and eat right , take your supplements and it will get better. You'll have times of ups and downs though...you may feel bad for a week or 2 then better then bad again but that is normal...it's your brain healing.

I'm going through 2 cold turkey withdrawals at one time so I can't definatly sympathize. It's rough but eventually we WILL heal and be o.k. Just know that there is a reason for you having a tough time now...you basically tapered too fast at the end by stopping the 1mg altogether AND you are healing so that will give you pain every time a different receptor in the brain is trying to heal.

It will get better and in the meantime keep a journal and write your symptoms every day and what you ate or did differently...sometimes greasy foods/sugary food and caffeine can bring on worse withdrawals and your period can also. Stay strong and we're here for you .

Thank you so much for writing. It is so reassuring to have so many people care and show such empathy. I guess I did go cold turkey from 1 mg and I am paying. It is such a delayed reaction though, you would think at three months it would be over instead of beginning. I am confused about the brain thing. I thought Lexapro caused more of a release of serotonin but did not actually hurt your brain. I guess I never thought I would have to HEAL>
Thank you for your insight and info!
HelpMe

[HelpMe58]

Originally Posted by antidote

SchnauzerTime

Thanks a lot for your reply. i was on Magnesium Malate for a while. At first it seemed to help; better sleep at night and in general a better sense of calm. After about a month or so things seemed to get worse like stronger tremors and that electricity feeling in my hands in the morning - so i stopped the Magnesium just to see - and things got better.

I'm starting to subscribe to EM's approach of avoiding as many supplements as possible and just let your body recover naturally.

I have tried supplements and they actually give me more hot flashes and that burning, nerve feeling. When I am on nothing it is better...go figure.

[HelpMe58]

Originally Posted by KEITH L.I

Neck pain and dizziness seem to be fading in my 5th month..but guess what has cropped up..insomnia,the last few nights,no anxiety,just my body dosen't get tired,then I start looking at the clock and guess what it's morning.Any suggestions about a remedy for insomnia? Thanks

One of my worst problems is the insomnia. Benadryl helps some!

[antidote]

For all of you who are dealing with the long term after affects of Lex withdrawal i want to add some perspective from my own experience.

first month or two - things in general feel pretty good.

month 3: things get pretty bad. Insomnia, sweating, and bouts of anxiety/depression.

month 4: things get REALLY bad. It's really difficult to deal with the emotions and you think about how you can possibly retain your sanity.

month 5: things start to markedly improve - not out of the woods yet but MUCH less severe and a greater ability to cope.

i'm almost done with month 5, i start month 6 next week.

My intent with this is not to scare people but rather to give hope. There absolutely is a light at the end of the tunnel and that is something really important to focus on and hold on to. I remember when i started lex i spoke to a Psych who said that it would take a minimum of 4-6 weeks before it would have a positive affect and then 4-6 MONTHS before it would really start to "kick in". If it takes that long for lex to screw around with your brain it only makes sense that it could take that long for it to UNscrew with your brain - potentially longer because of whatever damage it did along the way.]

So please everyone, please hang in there! I know at the 3-4 month mark things look impossibly bad but they WILL get better - hang on to that hope!!!

[KEITH L.I]

Originally Posted by HelpMe58

One of my worst problems is the insomnia. Benadryl helps some!

Just picked up some this morning,thanks

[KEITH L.I]

Originally Posted by antidote

For all of you who are dealing with the long term after affects of Lex withdrawal i want to add some perspective from my own experience.

first month or two - things in general feel pretty good.

month 3: things get pretty bad. Insomnia, sweating, and bouts of anxiety/depression.

month 4: things get REALLY bad. It's really difficult to deal with the emotions and you think about how you can possibly retain your sanity.

month 5: things start to markedly improve - not out of the woods yet but MUCH less severe and a greater ability to cope.

i'm almost done with month 5, i start month 6 next week.

My intent with this is not to scare people but rather to give hope. There absolutely is a light at the end of the tunnel and that is something really important to focus on and hold on to. I remember when i started lex i spoke to a Psych who said that it would take a minimum of 4-6 weeks before it would have a positive affect and then 4-6 MONTHS before it would really start to "kick in". If it takes that long for lex to screw around with your brain it only makes sense that it could take that long for it to UNscrew with your brain - potentially longer because of whatever damage it did along the way.]

So please everyone, please hang in there! I know at the 3-4 month mark things look impossibly bad but they WILL get better - hang on to that hope!!!

in my 5th month and things are getting better,better digestive,less dizzy and neck pain almost gone..hang in there crew..how do you know things get better?check out all the people who were posting last year,there all gone from the site

[elizabethmaria]

One more thing, found it on the WE MOVE website...

Although the exact underlying cause or pathophysiology of TD is unknown, several theories do exist. These theories all point to an increased sensitivity of the nerve cells or toxicity from the drugs in people who take DRAs. One potential cause that has been proposed is related to a person's decreased ability to handle a chemical known as phenylalanine. This theory maintains that, in people with TD, the inability to clear the phenylalanine leads to an increase of this chemical in the brain and a decrease in other chemicals that are necessary for the nervous system to control smooth and accurate movements.

[antidote]

Carolleah

i think you make a great point in the discussing the wider issues that people have to deal with such as the original anxiety/depression that prompted them to go on the medication. I think there are actually a number of possible causes for us to feel this way:

1. Basic physical withdrawl symptoms. i.e. the lex screwed around with our brain chemistry (and other body chemistry since serotonin is all over) and it still wreaks havoc since it stays in the body for a potentially long time bonded to proteins, liver pathways, what-have-you.

2. Adjustment to dealing with emotions WITHOUT the benefit of an SSRI numbing you. I know that i, for one, was not in a state of giddy euphoria while on lex. I actually felt completely numbed to almost all emotion - good or bad. It makes sense that it takes some time to learn how to deal with normal emotions, stress, etc. without the benefit of the mental novocaine.

3. Damage to serotonin receptors done by SSRIs as described by Dr. Peter Breggin and others. Normal amounts of serotonin in the synapses may not equate to "effective" normal levels if there are not enough receptors to take in the serotonin so they can improve mood as one would expect.

4. Original sources of anxiety/depression. Has the environment/scenarios that caused the original anxiety/depression been addressed? If not, why would things change? And, even if they have changed, once people develop the tendencies to think in ways tinged with anxiety/depression it could be a thinking tendency that sticks with them as they encounter new situations (kinda like developing new neural pathways of that type of thinking pattern)

5. Any combination of the above

humans are so complex that it could certainly be any one or a combination of these that are at play and it would be silly to ignore any of them as real possibilities. Some of them just need time to heal, but others can and should be addressed with changing one's life situation that causes problems, reading and/or therapy in topics such as CBT and REBT which are very logical approaches to thinking that would be useful for anyone - even if they don't suffer from anxiety/depression (just general neuroses that just about everyone has :-) ). Whatever the case we should be careful not to oversimplify the big picture.

[elizabethmaria]

Antidote, Carolleah, others,

As just a reminder, from someone who was not put on ssri/cocktail for psychological reasons, but for a few days for a different health issue - but has still gone through all the lovely recovery/withdrawal symptoms, ie everything... I would really suggest not worrying too much about dealing with emotions/ie tracing to past history, etc depression/anxiety, trying to figure out if it's old things coming back, etc.. until you are WELL out of the woods - ie past 7-8 more months and beyond. These drugs mess with your perceptions, thinking, emotions, everything - as I had no problems before, and then went through everything everyone else feels during recovery... sooooo -- just to remind people that these drugs do amazing things with your head! If I'd had depression/anxiety, strange thoughts, etc. beforehand, would have thought, oh my gosh, it's coming back or something.. but no, a few days/bad reaction then all this recovery time - it really is the drugs I can assure you! I know everyone's different, but just hope to put minds at rest -- just WAIT until your at 8, 9 10 months to beyond, when you feel much more 'normal' then, you can start to analyze.. but definitely don't before 7 months or more, just isn't worth the effort - but this is my opinion only!!! just from personal experience!!
take care,
EM

[SchnauzerTime]

Hey guys,

I don't mean to complain but I'm in need of a virtual hug tonight or something. This past couple days I've been feeling worse , don't know if the fish oil did it to me yesterday or what...but today I'm just depressed. I had a mini breakdown just now and just have that hopeless feeling. I've been trying to keep busy...reading in bed, etc., but my thoughts still roam.

Sorry if I'm complaining...I know alot of you are going through this right now...but I just need a HUG! EM, I could really use some of that positive reassurance right now. If you have any to spare...I know you've been going through a rough patch too and I've been thinking of you.

I've been 6 months off the Paxil and Wellbutrin cold turkey...and things AREN'T getting better for me. I think everyone is different and of course I'm going through 2 withdrawals so it may take longer for me to feel better in the end. I've been trying to "plug along" through this but some days I just want to cry and stew in my own tears and feel pitiful, lol.

If anyone has a word or 2 of encouragement I'd appreciate it . Thanks guys and hope everyone is doing o.k. tonight.