[skyer]

Patience: I was looking online for symptoms of depression because I think that's what I've had now for two months and sure enough I have most of the symptoms they listed. I know it's due to my withdrawals and should pass since I've never felt this way before, but this is no fun at all. My problem my whole adult life is that I get too excited and sometimes that turns into anxiety. This depression is all new to me. Anyway, I'm going to paste the link here because it has a story about a couple who went through Effexor withdrawals after the drug caused a negative reaction...thought you might be interested. Hope you got my email, too.

http://www.clinical-depression.co.uk...nlafaxine.html

[skyer]

I'm feeling very 'researchy' today...this is a link to the PBS show NOW and some past shows they did about drug companies. Forest Labs comes up several times.

http://www.pbs.org/now/search_google...ntidepressants

[Hopeful 285]

[QUOTE=elizabethmaria;170531]
Since then, like most everyone else, have had the jerking movements, muscle tightness (actually, like dystonia or something, hands curl up and feet tap and neck gets tight and twists to the side..) depersonalization (mostly gone for now), inability to think, lots of difficulty with lights, tv screens, night lights, loud sounds - emotional problems, etc...

Hi Elizabethmaria,
I am very glad you found this forum. There are some incredible people here as you can tell by how ready they are to help.
I've had the feet tap. Everytime I've had it, I was lying down so I called it paddling. Probably the same thing.
My head jerks to the side. It feels like a tic and my neck is tense. I started taking magnesium as recommended by Patience and Aunty and my neck is not nearly as tense. That was my only change at the time so I credit it to the magnesium.
I also have become sensitive to light and sounds just as you have.

Sounds like you've had a very rough time. With all that medication they gave you, you are blessed to be here with your drug sensitivity. God bless you.


Skyer, I've had 3 better days in a row. I haven't fallen once. I have tried to stay positive and upbeat. I know my brain is still very sensitive and I want my brain to heal quickly.
I'm going to try to fight this with a positive attitude. I created some flyers about discontinuation sydrome and when I went to Krogers, I put them at the door by the travel brochures. I did my shopping and by the time I was done several of the brochures were gone so I went to my car and got more.
I am so excited that people picked them up.


Aunty, thank you again for all your information. I have been trying some of your ideas and they help. Can't wait to do the epsom salts bath.
The information on the serotonin syndrome is wonderful information to have. I am going to share the information with people I know that are on antidepressants. The information you are sharing will be saving lives.
I can create a brochure with this information to pass out.



Stellalu, what you are doing is almost like going cold turkey. You could have some very serious symptoms. From what I have been reading, you need to go back on the full dose and taper .5 mg at a time. You can get Lexapro in liquid form. I basically quit cold turkey and ended up in the emergency room with blood pressure 206/116 and I was jerking. I don't know how often you should reduce the dosage, but I am sure someone will answer that is more knowledgable about the tapering. I wish I would have known. It would have saved me alot of pain. Until you get your answers go back on and do not take cold medicine, St. John's Wort, and read Aunty's posting about what not to take with antidepressants. Take Care.

[elizabethmaria]

Thank you Hopeful, and everyone -- everyone is sooo helpful here!!
I'm glad,(well, not glad in that respect, it's no fun ..!) to know that you and others have that muscle problem - it's so disturbing sometimes... I'm so sorry to hear that you were in emergency too- with blood pressure so high and all that, it must have been so scary...
I almost wish that we could get brochures too - I know people where I live that would love to have some more info like that -- that is a great thing to do!!
Skyer, how are you doing? I was wondering, does your depression come and go? or is it all the time ?? I just noticed that when I get really weak, I get depressed, but when I physically feel stronger, it goes away -- like it is connected maybe to the nervous system, adrenals... it's funny how predictable it is (at least at this time)... If I rest a bit, feel stronger, then it's gone, but if get overstimulated, weak, then it returns.... like the body is saying slow down...
Is this like yours? or different? I hope you are feeling better...
lots of prayers for everyone here...
Elizabethmarie

[skyer]

Elizabethmarie: I do feel mentally better when I'm physically stronger, but the depression is with me all the time and has been since about Jan 7th (four months removed from Lexapro). I did have a couple weeks in the beginning of this where it was really bad (very dark sadness) but that passed. Now I'm just kinda low and still have a lot of fear about going out too much or too far. Of all the symptoms listed on the depression symptom list I found yesterday I can relate to "no energy", "feeling as if the smallest task is sometimes impossible, "seldom enjoy things that you used to", "social activity hard"...and this one especially..."feeling that life has/is passing you by." Since I've never had depression before I didn't realize that all those things were symptoms of it. So in a way, I was glad to know that the things I'm feeling are because of the emotional withdrawals and not the fact that I'm partially brain dead!

Hopeful: Glad you had a few good days. Don't be discouraged if you have bad days again...that's how this thing goes. I'm also really glad you found that info about (PAWS) post acute withdrawal syndrome. It sounds just like my journey, especially the part about symptoms reaching their peak between months 3 - 6.

[elizabethmaria]

[QUOTE=skyer;170916]Elizabethmarie: Of all the symptoms listed on the depression symptom list I found yesterday I can relate to "no energy", "feeling as if the smallest task is sometimes impossible, "seldom enjoy things that you used to", "social activity hard"...and this one especially..."feeling that life has/is passing you by." Since I've never had depression before I didn't realize that all those things were symptoms of it. So in a way, I was glad to know that the things I'm feeling are because of the emotional withdrawals and not the fact that I'm partially brain dead!

Hello again,
Skyer, yes, I hope it goes away soon for you - (at 6 months usually most things are returning to normal Aunty says? goodness I hope so)... since I'm just at 3 months, I don't know if I will be going into that phase too, soon... but I guess we just have to ride out what comes...
I think we all can feel that life has/is passing us by, especially now (though it's drug withdrawals).. but it helps me to see it as actually being given the 'opportunity' (wow, that's positive to grow, and become more understanding of others who may struggle with lots of things like this, but I could never have really 'understood' before... I don't know, but I always believe everything happens for a very good reason... and that helps a lot.. so I tell myself that all the time!

Aunty, or anyone - should we do like brain exercises, or something? I feel like I have lost a lot of brain cells - anytime I try to think about anything that uses much of my brain, I get a raging headache - or even when people talk to me much, I can't understand them after a short while.. and memory is really bad - Nearly burned the house down 2 times the other day because I forgot simple things - no more stove cooking for me for quite a while ...ah!

thank you for advice on epsom baths and all! That helps so much -- been taking 2-3 HOT showers a day (I know, lots of hot water) since the reaction...but I think that it really helped the nervous system to heal faster, getting so hot and kind of sedated in there... (advice, DON"T fall asleep in the sauna, did that, and it definitely does NOT help

lots of love,
Elizabethmarie

[skyer]

Elizabethmaria: I also think things happen for a reason...I actually think this happened so that I was able to wake up and discover the truth about medication and western medicine. I really don't believe in it anymore; only trauma care. I feel like I've been working on my thesis about health and health care in the U.S. I'm reading a great book right now called "The 100 Year Lie" and it's about how the FDA works, toxins that we are all exposed to everyday, including drugs that are pushed on us, and other related items.

I know what you mean about almost burning down the house! My memory was so bad the first few months and I kept leaving stuff on the stove. My memory is quite good now. I'm also really sharp again when it comes to thinking and solving. Sounds silly, but I started watching Wheel of Fortune (!) some time back to help my brain. Anyway, hope that gives you some encouragement because those things will get better. I have the brain to take of things now, but my depression keeps me from using my brain because I can't care enough about things that I need to care about.

[Hairyarmadillo]

Does anyone know if the memory gets better? I wish I had never taken these things. I have done better but for some reason today all I can do is sleep. I am so tired and never told my husband I went back on these, so I hate telling him that I am sleeping again because of withdrawal. he does not understand about depression etc at all. He is one of those people who say it is all in your head. When I went off the paxil that time and had the nightmares and slept , he knew but I didn't want to get into a big discussion on the Lexapro and now I am sure he thinks I am just a lazy slob. Slept until 11, got up and went to sleep now want to sleep again.. And the weird dreams came back. Haven't decreased anymore. Was late taking it last night and I swear I felt nauseous. So am thinking will definitely not decrease again until Spring break. Was getting a little cocky though because I felt so much better, thought I could decrease sooner. sigh

[Hopeful 285]

Elizabeth Maria,
I can email you the brochure if you want. My email address is clmackan@aol.com.
I believe this was permitted to happen to us for a reason also. Each of us have different ones I'm sure.
I believe I got it to help me be more compassionate and to help others by letting them know what the doctors and drug companies are not communicating.
I plan to create another brochure about the information on the site that Aunty sent on not taking certain drugs with antidepressants because you can get serotonin syndrome.
I believe I had serotonin syndrome. I was not diagnosed by my doctors or the emergency room but I had the symptoms.

Skyer, you were right. I am not feeling well again.
I'm just going to try to be more productive on my better days so I don't stress over what I haven't done on days I can't do anything.
Everything is so much harder today.
I took 1/2 a pain pill and I could hardly keep my eyes open. I felt like I had taken 10 pills, not that I know what taking 10 piils is like. I couldn't even function. I was feeling so much panic and anxiety and tired at the same time.
Do you know if you become more sensitive to medications after going through this?
My symptoms also match the PAWS.
Enough about me, how are you feeling now? I'm glad you are getting your clarity back.

Hairyarmadillo,
My memory is good some days and bad some days. I figure that it hasn't left if I have still have some days of better memory. Your memory should improve over time.
I understand how you feel about sleeping long hours and feeling like you're looked at as lazy. My husband is wonderful and he has told me to suck it up.
It really hurts when they don't understand.
Do you jerk in your sleep? My husband knows I have real issues because I am doing the same things asleep as I do awake.
You are not lazy. You have a real health issue that you're dealing with right now. We don't deal with stress like we used to. Maybe you can show some of the writings in this forum to your husband. Maybe put them in the bathroom if he's a bathroom reader

Everyone: Better days are ahead.

[elizabethmaria]

Dear all,
Oh my gosh, that is so good to hear - that the memory and brain do get better! It has really been scaring me badly - if I do see my friends, I end up ignoring them (not wanting to, but..) and playing with their baby, as that is about the level of brain activity I'm at - can play peek a boo quite well, but beyond that is iffy ...
I'm living at home now, and parents are leaving for a long trip, so am putting very large signs on the stove, doors, etc.. to remind about turning things off...! oh well... better than a fire..! sometimes this is all more than a little funny, ... (in a bit if a funny mood today..)
Hopeful - I just read that you took a pain pill and felt so awful... I think we are more sensitive to medications, but am not sure... I just wanted to say, though, that some of us may not be handling the medications like we think we should, just like the SSRI's... I mean, I learned, (it was after I was off EVERYTHING) that sleeping pills, over the counter, or even prescription, give me HORRIBLE PANIC ATTACKs -- never connected the two, and my doctor would probably scoff, but oh gosh, it is sooooo true.. Everytime I would actually be on the sleeping stuff, even days later, I would get a horrible panic attack (I mean, up at night, sweating, can't breath, can't see, fever, etc.. terrible) I didn't connect them (over last couple of years), I thought it was because of whatever I was anxious about, but now, months off of everything, all that is cleared out, and haven't had even the slightest twinge of anxiety, and nothing in my 'situation' has changed... I know it was those drugs - I think it is your body saying that it cannot handle the drug, or that it is over sedating some reasoning part of your mind, I don't know... (since I'm so untolerable of SSRI's, I'm not surprised...) Even anti-anxiety meds caused it too... so.. no drugs for me... (and all feels peaceful and normal, except for the broken head but I wouldn't be surprised if I'm not the only one, as anxiety and panic attacks seem to be rising, and these medications are so common...
Just a thought from my experiences, but everyone is soo different, can't really know...
Hairyarmadillo - maybe your husband could read some of these pages, to know that you are not alone, or making anything up - and see how serious it is?
I know how sleepy you feel - I feel like I could sleep a hundred years, and that wouldn't be enough... struggle not to fall asleep all day long sometimes...
I also jerk when asleep - I'm not married yet, but am glad I'm not, as I would probably drive a husband crazy, and have to sleep on the couch.. or wait, he should sleep on the couch
hope you all have better days coming...
oh - I would love a brochure copy, if you can email it... I will write you Hopeful - that is great work to do....!
lots of love and prayers,
elizabethmarie

[elizabethmaria]

Skyer - I wish I could watch tv a bit, wheel of fortune, or most of all, funniest home videos.. but even a couple seconds sends me into muscle spasms, and severe depersonalization - I don't know why that is, but I avoid the tv like the plague... ...

[tavee]

Talk About Memory Loss!! Oh My God!!

I Passed Up Mcdonalds Today After My Hubby Told Me Just Like 4 Minutes Before To Stop And Get Some Food. Duhhhhhhhhhhhhh

I Forget A Lot And My Mom Doesnt Understand!! Shes Like God U Are Only 36. What Is Going To Happen When U Get To 50? She Has No Clue And Does Not Understand Anything About Withdrawals.

Elizabethmarie- I Totally Can Relate About Communicating With People. I Had A Playdate The Other Day With My 3 Year Old And It Was So Hard To Focus On The Other Mother. She Probably Looks At Me And Thinks God What Is Wrong With Her. I Cant Listen To People For Long When They Talk. Its So Hard!!

Skywalk- Arent We On The Same Cycle? Cuz Im So Pmsing Today. I Almost Got In Another Fight Today With The Vitamin Lady!! I Wanted To Tell Her Off So Bad Cuz She Was So Rude And Such An Idiot And Couldnt Answer My Questions!!she Looked At Me Like I Was The Idiot!! She Couldnt Even Answer Omega 3 Questions!!

I Should Not Even Go Out When I Am Pmsing!! I Will Probably Get Into Many Confrontations With People. I Overanalyze When I Am Like This. It Is So Bad U Guys!!

Well, I Hope U Guys Are Doing Ok. Hang In There.

Tavee

[skyer]

Tavee...yes, it's time for you to yell at strangers...lol! Feb. always throws me off, but we are close to that time of the month. At least I feel physically ready for it this month since my body feels a lot better. But like all of you, I am so tired. I can sleep 10 hours at night and could nap throughout the day. I don't allow myself to nap, though, I don't want to confuse my body.

Today is Sunday, so my fiance and I went to look at open houses for fun. I'm glad I did because I build confindence when I'm out and about. I still feel very "brain injured" but I am much better than last month as I spent almost the entire time in bed/on couch. For me, month four was the worst.

Hopeful...sorry to hear you're having a hard day. Just when you get hope one day you crash the next. I've learned to not fear it, I guess.

Hairy: Do you have a timer? I use to carry one around with me when I put something on the stove.

That's all I can write for now...too busy feeling sorry for myself today...I hate this depression...

[skyer]

The question about having a timer was meant for you, elizabethmaria, but actually could be for you, too, Hairy. Funny we talked about memory right before you posted your question, Hairy. Just don't taper too fast.

[Patience]

Hi!

So, I know that we are much more sensitive to drugs in this state. In December I was actually doing really well for almost a week and one night I decided I should take an Ambien (sleeping pill). Well that just kicked the crud out of me and I felt ********************py for a long time after. It makes sense because Ambien reacts directly with your central nervous system. Our nervous systems are so injured that you really cannot take anything, especially caffeine, sugar and alcohol all effect us poorly.

Your memory will come back! I am at month 6 and my brain feels normal again. I can actually recall information and words now. Its great. I felt so "slow" for a long time.

I am at my 6th month and I just started taking my vitamins again. For a long time I would avoid them because my body didnt feel like it could take it, but now they are actually helping. Vitamin B stimulates the nervous system, so I couldnt take it for awhile, but it also REPAIRS nerves too! So now I can take small amounts and not feel yucky and overstimulated.

Skyer, keep your head up and you will get through the apathy and low feelings. watch and read only warm fuzzy shows and movies and get lots of love from your fiance. It will get better. I also emailed you....

Hopeful: My aches are sooooo much less now because of the magnesium, sooo excited

Hairyarmadillo, elizabethmaria, tavee, aunty...hang in there.

XOXOXOXOXOXOXOXOXOXOXOXOXOXOXOXOXOXOXOXOXOXOXOXOXO XOXO

[elizabethmaria]

Hi all -
yes, it's sooo hard to talk to people, even my close family I can't seem to look at them while they talk, but stare off to the side - feel really bad about it but can't help it...
I'm so glad that you are getting out Skyer, to look at houses, etc... that's great!!!
Patience - yes, Ambien is SOOO strong, I took it a couple times in the fall, when I was going through sleeping problems, and had incredible hallucinations -- actually, it was really fun, honestly (the most fun of this whole ordeal..), but I did attempt to climb out of my window because it looked like Narnia ouside... and was stopped fortunately (don't know if would actually have followed through, but..) craziest thing I EVER experienced, not having done drugs or anything.. ..

A timer sounds like a very good idea -- thank you for the suggestion! Tavee -- oh, I feel just exactly that same way!!

I think I'm on the same cycle as you all too-- it's that 'time' again, why do all the symptoms get SO much worse now beforehand..? and does anyone's cycle really short, like 22-23 days?? it's so frustrating, barely enough time to recover from the last one... oh well..

take care all...
love, (pardon for the strange mood ..)
elizabethmarie

[skyer]

Elizabethmaria: YES...23-day cycles...I know others on the forum have said the same thing. Mine went back to the normal 28-day cycle last two months, but was 23 days for about four months. Weird.

[elizabethmaria]

Skyer, Hi! That is weird -- it must be doing exactly the same thing with all of us -- funny..do any of you have bad breakouts, and eyes that look kind of like black eyes - like someone punched you ? or really really waxy hair...? cheeks all sunken and skin all papery?? ugh...

I know, I know, not important how we look, but sometimes (most of ?)feel like wearing a paper bag on my head-- people always tell me I look sooo bad too -- boy, does that make you feel worse!!! ugh.. doesn't seem to be improving at all ... I hope there is hope ... sorry for the woe is me here, but am feeling low...
love
elizabethmarie..

[Hopeful 285]

Patience,
I have been kind of freaked out over taking vitamins and wonder if they could be making me worse. I believe the magnesium helped and then I start thinking with my sensitive system. Is 800 mgs too much?
I feel perfectly safe with the fish oil and I leave that out on my counter so I can make sure I take it. I take it 3 times a day as recommended.
Some people get headaches from taking vitamins they don't need. I have just been wondering.
I was walking around last night and this morning like I was in a drunken stuper and I wonder if it could have be the B vitamins. My head, ears, and neck hurt so bad. My head felt like it was huge. The I started feeling panic because I thought my brain was inflamed and swelling. I feel measuarably better now and am glad I didn't go to the emergency room for no reason.

Skyer, Elizabethmaria, Tavee,
I have had shortened cycles also. Last one was very short. It was about 12 days. This one was 23 days.
This stuff effects everything.

Elizabethmaria,
I get the dark circles too. This stuff made me anemic. I found that if I drink water and take iron everyday, my dark circles are gone. My dark circles were very bad and people would always remark on how tired I looked.

[Patience]

I agree. I have looked so ratty this whole time--my skin, hair, eyes, everything! My cycles have been 23 days as well.

Hopefull: I sincerely dont think that the magesium is doing that to you. You have to take an awful lot for it to be too much. You are probably just going to feel like that off and on no matter what for a little while. I did, with no rhyme or reason. I would however stay away from B vitamins for a little while. they are too stimulating for your nervous system and can make you feel weird and your skin hyper-sensitive....

[elizabethmaria]

Hopeful -- I've heard B vitamins can be bad as well, from other sources - that the body has to have a delicate balance of all of the B's, and most all vitamin supps. disrupt the balance-- seems like you should be careful, especially when you are so susceptible right now... but I'm not an expert, so... aunty? what would you say?
take care,
elizabethmarie

[skyer]

Hopeful: I agree with Patience, the B's can be too much for us right now. Magnesium never hurt me and actually helped when I had the insomnia. I also had moments were I wanted to go to the ER because of some really scary symptom, but I thought, well...if my vitals are OK then it will probably pass. It always did. I also got a naturopath early on and I called her a couple times and she was able to calm me down. She believes in the ER if it's life-threatening, of course, but if not, she had an explaination for my problem. Like one time when I thought I was having liver failure! I won't get into details, but she was right about my symptoms and how to reverse them. I also like the fact that she was always available. Good luck getting an M.D. to call you back within 30 minutes...

Chamomile tea is great for the anxiety! I didn't believe it at first, but when I tried to calm down with another kind of tea it did not work like the chamomile.

Hang in there, Hopeful...I had really weird, scary pains in my head, ears, neck and stomach at your point.

Patience: I wrote you a novel this morning...

Sorry to hear many of you had problems with the way you look. I just feel, well...felt...like hell, but didn't look it. Although my face does look a little like this icon

[Hopeful 285]

Skyer,
I am drinking chamomile tea as now. This is like getting free medical advice.
Everyone on this forum has helped more than my doctors. I know doctors are blessings but it seems a lot of them are not up to date on this stuff.

Elizabethmaria,
I emailed the brochure to you. I hope your computer can read it. It is a Word document. The PDF file would not send. If you can't open the attachment or can't read, maybe we can figure out another way to get it to you.
I had the waxy hair thing. The beautician even noticed and sold me some clarifiying shampoo. She told me to use it once a week. It works.

Patience,
I appreciate your words of knowledge. Having people that are a step ahead in learning about all this really helps. Hopefully I can do that as I learn from all of you.

[tavee]

skyer, hopeful, elizabethmarie, patience

i totally can relate to the ugly feeling during ure cycle. i get the dark circles. my hair is greasy as hell. i have to wash it everyday(usually i wash every other day).im eating chocolate like a week before every darn night!! i feel like crud and look like crud. i can totally relate to u guys!!
i just want to get my period and be done with it!!

i am feeling ok except for the irritable feelings and getting in fights with people!! lolololol. i cant believe how intense this has become during pms. wow this drug does messes up ure hormones.

has anyone heard forn aunty or sarita?? skyer -i wonder how sarita is doing?

you guys, we will be ok in the longrun!! when we all get better we can have a party!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!yipeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee.


ps are u guys craving a lot of sugar and carbs during all this???

tavee

[felly]

Hey guys.. Me too!

Tavee: I know what you mean about this drug messing with hormones. My periods have completely stopped as of 2 days after I first took lex (mid novemeber). It's freakin me out a bit because I really want to have kids one day and I'm worried something's really wrong. Actually, for a while I thought I was pregnant because of the fat tummy I have now.

Hopeful, elizabethmaria, Patience, Tavee: I can totally relate to the ugly feeling. Sometimes I feel so repulsive I don't even want to go anywhere. I have gotten zits since I started lex too and have got a fat gut now too. Elizabethmaria I sooo know what you mean about the paper bag over the head thing too. Actually an entire sheet would be good because then i could hide my chubby tummy too!

Hopeful: my head feels huge a lot too. It's weird!! Its like every little things exagerated in there, and yeah it just feels absolutely enormous, so much so that sometimes I convince myself my head must be massive and when I see myself in the mirror I get suprised that it actually isn't.

I had a blood test the other day and everything was really good except for my liver. Today I started freaking out about it. Does that mean my liver will get worse and worse and I'll get jaundice, or can your liver repair itself? Does anyone know if lex can stuff up your liver?

Thanks, felly

[tavee]

felly-
what did they say about ure liver???

ask ure doctor. remember that everything in our body right now is so messed up that things we didnt even knew exist are all happening to us. do not be surprised or alarmed.

are u having any other symptoms??


hang in there and take vitamins!!

tavee

ps i am down to 2.6ml. how are u doing and what dose are u on now?

[Hopeful 285]

Felly,
Let us know what they said about your liver.
My enzymes are slightly elevated.
I've heard that SAM'e will help your liver repair itself but it also is a mood enhancer so I don't know if it is safe to take right now. Maybe someone else will have an answer to this. We have to be so careful about what we take.

Tavee,
I am craving carbs, but I always have. During this time of the year, I give up chocolate until Easter and I always lose 6-10 lbs doing this. It usually comes back sooner or later. Maybe if I fasted right before each Holiday I could lose weight and keep it off.
I have a mild wheat allergy and when I behave and stay away from it, I lose weight.


Here is some information I found. What does this stuff do to us? We are blessed to be recuperating.


http://www.nlm.nih.gov/medlineplus/n...ory_44206.html

Antidepressants Linked to Fracture Risk
Patients should have bone tests before taking SSRIs, study suggests

HealthDay

Monday, January 22, 2007


MONDAY, Jan. 22 (HealthDay News) -- Men and women in their 50s and older who take antidepressants known as selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors may be doubling their risk of fractures, a new Canadian study suggests.

SSRIs, such as Prozac and Paxil, are commonly used to treat depression and anxiety. But previous studies had shown these drugs are associated with an increased risk of fractures from falling.

The new research, led by Dr. David Goltzman, a professor of medicine and physiology and director of the McGill Centre for Bone and Periodontal Research at McGill University in Montreal, seems to support the earlier studies.

"There is good scientific evidence that serotonin is involved in bone physiology, and if you alter the system, you can get low bone density," Goltzman said. "Patients should be monitored to prevent the risk of fractures."

The finding is published in the Jan. 22 issue of the Archives of Internal Medicine.

For the study, Goltzman and his colleagues reviewed information on 137 patients -- average age 65 -- who took SSRIs. The patients had their bone mineral density measured at the start of the study and were followed for five years. Each year, the patients were also asked to report any fractures they had and how they occurred.

Goltzman's team found these patients had twice the risk of fractures. They were particularly vulnerable to breaks of the forearm, ankle and foot, and less so to fractures of the hip, rib, femur, and back, the study found.

Goltzman's group also found that use of SSRIs was associated with an increased risk of falling. The effect depended on the dose of the drug. Doubling the dose resulted in a 1.5-fold increase in the risk of falling.

Daily SSRI use was also associated with a 4 percent decrease in bone mineral density at the hip, and a 2.4 percent decrease at the spine, the researchers reported.

Patients need to know there's this risk of fractures with SSRIs, Goltzman said.

"Patients should not be told not to take SSRIs if they need them for depression," he said. "But this is a new risk that has been identified, and patients should take general steps to prevent osteoporosis. And they should have a bone density measurement before starting SSRIs and periodically after that."

But one expert said he thought the study failed to prove that SSRI use is linked to an increased risk of bone breaks.

"These findings are hard to interpret," said Dr. Robert P. Heaney, a professor of medicine at the Osteoporosis Research Center at Creighton University in Omaha, Neb. "Increased fracture risk has been associated with depression for years," he added.

Heaney said that to really uncover the role SSRIs may play in fractures, a study would have to compare depressed patients taking SSRIs with depressed patients taking other medications. "Then you could see if it was the depression causing the fractures or if it were the SSRIs. It may not be the SSRI at all," he said.

Studies like Goltzman's run the risk that people will stop taking their medication, Heaney said. "These kind of studies do some potential harm," he said.



http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/q...amp;query_hl=4

Association of risk of abnormal bleeding with degree of serotonin reuptake inhibition by antidepressants.

Meijer WE, Heerdink ER, Nolen WA, Herings RM, Leufkens HG, Egberts AC.

Department of Pharmacoepidemiology and Pharmacotherapy, Utrecht Institute for Pharmaceutical Sciences, The Netherlands.

BACKGROUND: Serotonin plays a role in platelet aggregation. Because antidepressants influence blood serotonin levels, their use may be associated with an increased risk of abnormal bleeding. However, previous studies were inconclusive regarding this association. The aim of this study was to estimate the risk of abnormal bleeding associated with the use of antidepressants and to establish the relationship between serotonin reuptake inhibition and the risk of bleeding. METHODS: We used data collected from 1992 through 2000 to conduct a nested case-control study of a cohort of more than 64 000 new antidepressant users. Cases were identified as all patients hospitalized for a primary diagnosis of abnormal bleeding, and they were matched with controls for age and sex. We classified exposure according to the degree (high, intermediate, or low) of serotonin reuptake inhibition and performed logistic regression analysis to calculate odds ratios. RESULTS: There were 196 cases of abnormal bleeding. The risk of hospitalization increased with the use of inhibitors providing intermediate (odds ratio, 1.9; 95% confidence interval, 1.1-3.5) and high degrees of serotonin reuptake inhibition (odds ratio, 2.6; 95% confidence interval, 1.4-4.8). CONCLUSIONS: In a large population of new antidepressant users we found a significant association between degree of serotonin reuptake inhibition by antidepressants and risk of hospital admission for abnormal bleeding as the primary diagnosis. An increased risk of abnormal bleeding was strongly associated with the degree of serotonin reuptake inhibition.

[elizabethmaria]

Hopeful,
Thank you! I received your e-mail, and the brochure works fine on word - so thank you... I will print some out and hand out - they are very well done!!
That's amazing that some were taken from the store before you had even left... so many people need to know what is going on....

Tip I recently read -- Natural sunlight 'strengthens and tones the nervous system' -- cant' remember where I read it, but some nervous system health med site... think we could all use some stregthening and toning! Still March, but the sun is peeking out now at least more often...
love,
Elizabethmarie

[tavee]

Hopeful, Felly

Aunty Had Said To Stay Away From Sam E While We Are Withdrawing. It Is Very Bad For Us. I Think She Had Said That It Can Be Fatal For Us At This Time.

So Felly Whatever U Do, Do Not Take Sam E . Always Check With Aunty About Any New Supplement Cuz With The Way Things Are With Our System U Never Know What Can Happen To Us.


Hopeful- U Are So Lucky That U Can Lose Weight When U Stop Chocolate. I Wish I Could Stop. I Love It Soooooooooooo Much!!

I Hope U Are Feeling Better!!

Tavee

PS DO NOT TAKE SAM E OR ST. JOHNS WORT FOR ONE YEAR AFTER U STOP LEX OR ANY ANTIDEPRESSANT. THATS WHAT AUNTY SAID.

[tavee]

Aunty Said Do Not Take Sam E Or St.johns Wort For One Year After U Stop Taking Antidepressants.


Tavee