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subutex and alcohol
  1. #1
    NikNak1 is offline Member
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    Default subutex and alcohol

    Has anyone drank while taking subutex. I was wondering if it would be ok to have one beer as it's my partners B' day and we are going out. I take 4mgs of subutex daily. I should say that I am the sort of person who can and will stop at one drink should it be ok...would it be a problem to have say a pint of stella? No lectures please and thanks in advance.

  2. #2
    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    Quote Originally Posted by NikNak1 View Post
    Has anyone drank while taking subutex. I was wondering if it would be ok to have one beer as it's my partners B' day and we are going out. I take 4mgs of subutex daily. I should say that I am the sort of person who can and will stop at one drink should it be ok...would it be a problem to have say a pint of stella? No lectures please and thanks in advance.



    It won't hurt anything to have A BEER while on subutex. I wouldn't go crazy with it but one beer isn't going to matter. Two beers wouldn't even hurt anything but I would definitely draw the line there and don't make a habit out of it. Have a good day. God bless.
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

  3. #3
    NikNak1 is offline Member
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    Default Thanks Robert

    Thanks Robert, I will enjoy that beer and definitely not make a habit of it. It's just the info leaflet says mixing the both can cause death. I was guessing that it was refering to large amounts of either being taken but I wanted to be sure. I have had a look through some of your posts (hope you don't mind) and it seems you know your stuff, so thanks again.

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    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    Quote Originally Posted by NikNak1 View Post
    Thanks Robert, I will enjoy that beer and definitely not make a habit of it. It's just the info leaflet says mixing the both can cause death. I was guessing that it was refering to large amounts of either being taken but I wanted to be sure. I have had a look through some of your posts (hope you don't mind) and it seems you know your stuff, so thanks again.


    The fact is that one beer could do it. The odds of that happening are very minimal however. The drug company has to list warnings such as that for liability's sake. If even one person out of a billion died they would be liable if they hadn't made a warning. One beer and one xanax can kill you as well, so can one beer and one tylenol if you happen to be the one person who's body can't handle it.

    Enjoy your partner's party and enjoy your one beer. The fact that you are so concerned about doing the right thing shows that you are likely not a person who would abuse the situation. And you are welcome to read any of my posts, that is why I write them. Glad I could help. God bless.
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

  5. #5
    NikNak1 is offline Member
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    Default Can you help me?

    Robert, I have read that you have helped lots of people come off Subutex. I am new to the drug, it is only my third day taking it, but I have been six days without my DOC (dihydrocodeine). I had a terrible time trying to quit ct and by the third day I was in so much pain that I caved in and confessed everything to my GP. Below is a copy of a post I wrote on a different site, it gives an idea of where I'm at. I'm not sure if you can offer me any advice, but I am desperate to be clean and want to come off of Sub as soon as I can. My doctor is not really familiar with Sub and I want to make sure I get this right. I am terrified when I read stories that people can not get off of it, I don't want this to happen to me. Any help you can offer would be appreciated.

    "Help with Dihydrocodiene withdrawal?
    I have been taking Dihydrocodeine for over 3 years. Over the last year my dose hit about 20 times 30mg a day. I originally took them for a stomach condition, that cleared up but I continued to take the drug as I had become dependant. I began to lie to my doctor to get more and more, I even found someone to sell me their monthly prescription. I have also chewed phentenal patches (not correct spelling I know), and took liquid Morphine. A friend is prescribed the patches and morphine and I only took these drugs when she gave them to me, which was not often as she is an addict herself. Up until this morning I had managed to go nearly 3 days cold turkey, I have really had enough of being a slave to drugs, I can not believe I let it get so bad. Anyway, today I really could not take anymore so I phoned my GP and confessed. I told her I was determined to quit and we discussed how to do it. Problem is she does not sound to sure and gave me the option of moving on to Tramadol or Codydromol, I chose the latter and was frustrated as I got absolutely no relief. I should mention I have a back problem and when I stop taking DHC not only is it painful but I have dreadful pains in the bones in my arms and legs and it this symptom above all the others that makes me cave in. My doctor is not sure whether this is caused by withdrawal or my back and I just feel helpless. This morning I have taken 2 10/500 Cocodamol and when that did not work 2 Tramadol. I have managed to get up, the bone pain has eased a lot but my back is still really sore, I feel far from good but I feel I can handle it. I want to know if continuing taking Tramadol, 2, 3 times day will help with DHC withdrawal and will I have to go through severe withdrawal when I attempt to quit Tramadol, because if so I can not see the point. I was hoping to use them for a couple of weeks and then gradually reduce them. Does anyone know if this is a good way to withdraw, my doctor does not seem sure. Any help appreciated, thanks. Also has anyone experienced severe bone pain when withdrawing from DHC?"

    A reply I received from the above post prompted me to research Tramadol further. It seemed many users and ex users were instigating that the withdrawal from Tramadol was even worse than when they had withdrawn from >>>>>> or Methadone. I was terrified, I could not imagine a withdrawal worse than what I had already been through. Tramadol was taking the edge off withdrawal, but I was far, far from good and on top of this Tramadol gave me a horrible heavy feeling in my head that made me feel like I was going mad. After a day and a half of taking Tramadol I went back to my doctor's and she prescribed Subutex. It was me who suggested it, I had learned about it from a site like this one. I was told to take 4mg every 24 hours and to let her know if there were any problems. I had to wait until 6 hours after I took my last Tramadol pills and so I took my first batch of Subutex at 830pm on Friday. I felt better relatively quickly, not one hundred percent, I was still a little sluggish and aware of a bit of pain, but nothing compared to before. I was amazed because I am on such a small dose; I thought it might not work. I have since read that small doses work better in some cases??? Anyway, when I tried to go to sleep that night it was impossible and I knew it was to do with the Sub. I also had the heavy feeling in my head and sinus area, which I put down to the Tramadol. I noticed that my nose was extra dry and blocked and my throat was dry too. The symptoms were nothing compared to what I had experienced during ct, so I am not complaining. I knew the lack of sleep would become a problem so I called a doctor who said it would be OK to take my next dose earlier. I took this around 1pm yesterday, about 16 and half hours after my first dose. Today I have taken it at 10am and tomorrow I will take it at 6 30am and keep it at that time daily. I imagine all the jumping is not good, but I had no idea Sub would interfere with my sleep. I have noticed that I start getting pain and also I'm more sluggish about sixteen hours after my last dose but because of all the jumping I am yet to know how I will feel with 24 hours in between doses. If I can avoid increasing the amount I am taking I will, but I want to get this right. Its two and a half hours after today's dose. I am aware of some pain in my bones and I don't have much energy, but this is a walk in the park compared to before. I am going to try and push myself physically today in preparation for tomorrow when I will have a lot more to do.

  6. #6
    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    Check out the following link. Then if you want I will be happy to help you with the sub. Remember that sub is NOT a cure, it's only meant to help with opiate detox. It's still best to include things like recovery in your plans as subs ONLY help get us past the initital detox, you still have to do some work on changing yourself. Getting clean is realatively simple, but STAYING clean is a different story. Read the link, then let me know if you want my help. I know how to use and stop this drug successfull but you will need to follow my suggestions to the letter if you want the suggestions to work. God bless.

    http://www.drugs.com/forum/featured-...rap-50887.html
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

  7. #7
    NikNak1 is offline Member
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    Hi Robert, I went to the link and yes I would still like your help. I can not however, find the Glad To Be Here post. I decided to take another 2 mg of Sub not long after I sent my last post because I really do not think I had reached a stable point. I feel better and the difference is, I now have the energy to get up and do stuff. I do hope that was a wise decision...I realise that if I am to succeed, I will need to follow your advice to the letter and I am glad to do that. I just feel a bit lost at the moment. My doctor is not experienced in this feild and I am having to work all this out by myself and before coming here I had absolutely no idea what to do.

  8. #8
    NikNak1 is offline Member
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    Now I am thinking that maybe I should not have taken that extra Sub. Maybe I should go back to 4mg tomorrow. I am so confused, I can not believe I have ended up like this I feel so trapped and really afraid...I'm a wreck.

  9. #9
    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    Quote Originally Posted by NikNak1 View Post
    Now I am thinking that maybe I should not have taken that extra Sub. Maybe I should go back to 4mg tomorrow. I am so confused, I can not believe I have ended up like this I feel so trapped and really afraid...I'm a wreck.


    You need to be stabilized on the subutex before doing anything else. Quite frankly I'm a little confused by the different posts with the varying times you've taken the sub, the different dosing, etc.

    I need to know first of all how long total you've taken the subutex. Have you stayed with 4mg total each day except for today? Forget the post you made on the other location, just tell me exactly how much subutex you've taken today and each day since you've started. From this point forward you need to dose at the exact same time each day but I need to know exactly what you've taken each day and for how many days. God bless.
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

  10. #10
    NikNak1 is offline Member
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    Thank you for replying Robert. I have been taking Subutex for 4 days now.
    Friday 4mg
    Sat 4mg
    Sun 6mg
    Today 4mg
    I took my medication today at 6.45am this morning, I Will keep it at that time from now on. My first ever dose of subutex (Friday 4mg) was taken at 8.30pm and I found I could not sleep. I spoke to a doctor the next afternoon and was told to take that days tablets immediately to avoid another sleepless night, so I ended up taking them early afternoon, but with the view of moving on to taking them in the morning...hope that makes sense, anyway the main thing is I am now going to stick to 6.45am each day. Yesterday I took an extra 2 mg (so my total was 6mg) because I had no energy and I considered it to be a symptom of withdrawal. I also still get aches and pains in my body it’s not unbearable and not constant. I notice it happens when I lie down to go to sleep and some other times during the day, but like I said it's not unbearable. I have taken 4mg today at 6. 45am. It is just after 10am here (I am in London, England) and I am feeling pretty much like I have on the other days. I have not got as much energy as I am used to. I can really feel it if I walk a flight of stairs for example and I really felt it when I walked a five minute walk to my car this morning, but I am managing to do what I have to, it is not like it was when I was going through CT, then I could barely move, it was a struggle to get up and use the toilet. I am still aware of a few aches and pains but again nothing like during CT. I will stick with 4mg unless you say otherwise. Sorry for the long post and a real big thank you for taking the time to help me, it is really kind of you.

  11. #11
    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    IF it's taking 6mg to make you stabilized that is okay. 6mg is not a high dose. I would stay on that for a good week, then if I was feeling good I would reduce back to 4mg at that time. You're going through opiate w/d right now, give the subs a chance to work and help you feel better.

    Stay in touch and let us know how you're doing, but you aren't blowing it by taking 6mg rather the 4mg you started at. Most people don't stabilize at 4mg, so it seems like the 6mg dose is probably where you need to be based on what you've said. Let me know over the next couple days how you're feeling at 6mg. I bet you will feel much better than at 4mg and then when you reduce to 4mg it will go smoothly as well. God bless.
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

  12. #12
    NikNak1 is offline Member
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    I hear you Robert. I have just been so freaked out about increasing my dose...it feels like I am moving a step further from goal, but I know that is not really the case, so I have increasded my dose to 6mg...I will let you know how I get on. In fact I think I will post here daily, It's good for me to log all this. If you have the time to look in occasionally, I would be grateful. Is there anyone else out there who has been through Sub withdrawal? It would be nice to hear your experience.

  13. #13
    NikNak1 is offline Member
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    Today is my seventh day taking Subutex. I still feel a bit tired at times and get the odd pang here and there but if I am honest I feel better than I have in a long while and that is a good thing. I can't wait to start cutting back the Sub...I hate that I am dependent on it. I'm looking into drugs counselling or maybe some sort of day rehab programme...I know I have to if I want to be clean for good.

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    NikNak1 is offline Member
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    I think it is time to start cutting back the Sub now. Are you about Robert? I could really do with your advice. I think I should cut down to 4mgs and then if I am ok in say 4 or 5 days, try taking it down to 3mg. What do you think? I really appreciate your advice. Thanks in advance and sorry to be a pest.
    Niknak1
    Last edited by NikNak1; 03-07-2009 at 01:00 PM.

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    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    Quote Originally Posted by NikNak1 View Post
    I think it is time to start cutting back the Sub now. Are you about Robert? I could really do with your advice. I think I should cut down to 4mgs and then if I am ok in say 4 or 5 days, try taking it down to 3mg. What do you think? I really appreciate your advice. Thanks in advance and sorry to be a pest.
    Niknak1


    Going to 4mg is fine. Same thing with going to 3mg next. Let us know how you're doing next week. God bless.
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

  16. #16
    NikNak1 is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert_325 View Post
    Going to 4mg is fine. Same thing with going to 3mg next. Let us know how you're doing next week. God bless.
    Thanks Robert

  17. #17
    NikNak1 is offline Member
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    Default Help

    I have not been here for a while... life kind of got in the way. Kind of hoping Robert would read this as I seem to be stuck on 2mgs and would really appreciate his help. I have been taking Subutex for nearly six months and I really want off of it.

  18. #18
    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    Just cut your dose back by 25% from 2mg to 1.5mg. Split that into two equal doses as you can get it and that will work fine. Plan on staying at 1.5mg four days.

    All you need to do it stick with this and don't let "life" get in the way. If you do it you'll be done with this in about a month being at only 1.5mg now. It's worth it to do. You only have to do this one time if you do it right. God bless.
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

  19. #19
    RubyDean is offline Member
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    NikNak, Glad to see you are back. It seems like you didn't follow the plan Robert had set up for you too well, but that is okay. I was on 2mg's for a few months, and have managed to taper down to 1mg, and now I am at .75, we often think we need more than we really do, and I take mine in the morning (just one dose per day) and sometimes at night I feel like I need to take more but I really don't and just go to bed and end up sleeping fine. In my opinion when doing a taper plan, especially the final stretch (2mg -
    .25mg) you need to keep it steady. This is my second go around doing this at .75mg, and by Monday I will be at .50mg, and then by next weekend move down to .25mg, and then I will start skipping days, and be done. Don't beat yourself up too much, you are at a fairly small dose, and if you really listen to robert this time he can help you to get off this. I have been on it for almost 6 months now, and no matter what I will be done by the end of this month. I can't wait! Stay positive and listen to his suggestions, and keep moving forward, and never backwards. We can get stuck on a tiny piece of sub for way too long, and it only will make it harder. You will be fine if you drop to 1.5mg, and do that for a week, and then drop to 1mg, and so on...all the will. stay in touch. peace>

  20. #20
    NikNak1 is offline Member
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    Thank you Ruby and Robert for taking the time to anwer me. Sorry if I come across a bit dumb but do you mean that I should split my daily 1.5mg into two doses? If so, do I take it morning and night? Or do I just take 1.5mg once a day? Also, I saw somewhere that it is best to use a razor to cut the subutex... is that the best way? If I am Sub free in a month, I will be very, very happy lady.
    Last edited by NikNak1; 08-08-2009 at 05:06 AM.

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    NikNak1 is offline Member
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    Sorry, double post
    Last edited by NikNak1; 08-08-2009 at 05:20 AM.

  22. #22
    garysremodel1 Guest

    Default Howdy!

    NicNak1,

    Have a couple of beers if you want. But keep it at that. You'll be fine.
    I have tapered according to Roberts plan, and I am down to 2mg from 16mg per day, with NO w'd's at all, over a three week period! If you follow Roberts plan to the letter, you will succeed just as I have.
    BTW, I use a razor blade to cut up the Sub. I just sorta eyeball slice one 8mg sub into four pieces. If they look pretty even, then I cut the four pieces into eight. For a smaller dose like 1.5 mg, just shave a little off of one. This not Rocket Science here. Anywhere close is good enough. Good Luck!

    Gary

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    RubyDean is offline Member
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    NikNak, It is up to you, I wuld stick with what you have been doing all along. If your body is udes to just taking 2mg in the morning, then I would continue to taper like that. If you took it twice a day all along then I would suggest you continue that...just depends what you think really. Robert will help you out, and your taper should go smooth. The key for me is to keep busy and try not to go take more no matter what. We need to push through the small rough times to make progress. Those little rough patches pail in comparison to full blown opiate withdrawal IMO. peace. You will do fine at 1.5mg. Just be honest with yourself and each day gets better.

  24. #24
    NikNak1 is offline Member
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    Thanks Ruby, you make a lot of sense.
    I cut back to 1mg yesterday. I am doing ok but my body feels a little heavy today...suppose it is to be expected. Are you about Robert? Have I got it right?
    Last edited by NikNak1; 08-15-2009 at 07:08 AM.

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    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    Quote Originally Posted by NikNak1 View Post
    Thanks Ruby, you make a lot of sense.
    I cut back to 1mg yesterday. I am doing ok but my body feels a little heavy today...suppose it is to be expected. Are you about Robert? Have I got it right?


    Sounds like you're doing fine. I'll be on and off all day today. God bless.
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

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    NikNak1 is offline Member
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    Today is day four of being on 1mg. I am doing ok but the last couple of mornings I have woken up feeling really ********py but very soon after taking 1mg of Sub I feel ok. Do you think I should wait a while before decreasing further? and when it is time is .5 the way to go? Also, Robert, I can not thank you enough for taking the time to help me with this, I'm feeling so much more confident about this now. It's really helped knowing that if things get tough, I can get advice from someone who actually knows what they are talking about, my doctor just has no idea.
    Last edited by NikNak1; 08-18-2009 at 08:52 AM.

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    RubyDean is offline Member
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    I know what you mean, and I have those mornings most of the time. For me it is almost like an instant relief after a 24 hr stretch. It is just great when we are at least moving in the right direction, cause for too long I was just meandering around 1mg for months...now I am down to .25mg, but like yesterday I hit a wall after 2 days, and had to take another .25 last night. So now, like Robert has said before, I will try again to string 4 days at .25, and then my plan is to go to .125 (crazy, I know, but that is what works for me I think)
    I truly feel blessed and very fortunate to have found this site, and get the real deal from Robert. The doc's and the vast majority of patients have little to no idea about an effective taper plan. Jumping at 1mg, or even .5 is insane to a person like me. Keep up the good work, this is a new record for you. See what Robert says, and you will do great.
    4 days in a row at 1mg is major progress!

  28. #28
    Robert_325 is offline Retired
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    Quote Originally Posted by NikNak1 View Post
    Today is day four of being on 1mg. I am doing ok but the last couple of mornings I have woken up feeling really ********py but very soon after taking 1mg of Sub I feel ok. Do you think I should wait a while before decreasing further? and when it is time is .5 the way to go? Also, Robert, I can not thank you enough for taking the time to help me with this, I'm feeling so much more confident about this now. It's really helped knowing that if things get tough, I can get advice from someone who actually knows what they are talking about, my doctor just has no idea.



    I have people take the first dose early and the second dose late afternoon. It's only logical that if you were going to feel any symptoms it would be first thing in the morning. Time has run out for the subs by then, that's the reason I suggest taking them the way I do. I want you to get all you can get from them during the day while awake. Eventually you won't even notice it in the morning either. That's the short term goal.

    Give it a couple more days but by then you should be okay to reduce again. Stay in touch. You're almost done. God bless.
    I am not a dr. My statements are based on years of experience and related education. Consult with the professional of your choice regarding matters of concern.

  29. #29
    NikNak1 is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by RubyDean View Post
    I know what you mean, and I have those mornings most of the time. For me it is almost like an instant relief after a 24 hr stretch. It is just great when we are at least moving in the right direction, cause for too long I was just meandering around 1mg for months...now I am down to .25mg, but like yesterday I hit a wall after 2 days, and had to take another .25 last night. So now, like Robert has said before, I will try again to string 4 days at .25, and then my plan is to go to .125 (crazy, I know, but that is what works for me I think)
    I truly feel blessed and very fortunate to have found this site, and get the real deal from Robert. The doc's and the vast majority of patients have little to no idea about an effective taper plan. Jumping at 1mg, or even .5 is insane to a person like me. Keep up the good work, this is a new record for you. See what Robert says, and you will do great.
    4 days in a row at 1mg is major progress!
    Hey Ruby, thanks for your kind words. You are doing great too, not long now. What I actually meant was that I plan to cut my 1mg dose by half. Yesterday when I was cutting up the Sub, I looked at it and said to myself "how can I be so dependent on something so tiny", It makes you realise how powerful this stuff is. I'm not knocking Sub though, it has been a God send for me. I have noticed that I have become really techy lately, I seem to be angry a lot of the time but I have no idea what about. I have felt like this in the past during CT, so I am putting it down to withdrawal...or maybe I'm just a nut, nut, who knows. Whatever the cause I hope it eases soon or I might have to find myself a new family, LOL.
    Last edited by NikNak1; 08-19-2009 at 05:23 AM.

  30. #30
    NikNak1 is offline Member
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robert_325 View Post
    I have people take the first dose early and the second dose late afternoon. It's only logical that if you were going to feel any symptoms it would be first thing in the morning. Time has run out for the subs by then, that's the reason I suggest taking them the way I do. I want you to get all you can get from them during the day while awake. Eventually you won't even notice it in the morning either. That's the short term goal.

    Give it a couple more days but by then you should be okay to reduce again. Stay in touch. You're almost done. God bless.
    Hi Robert. Today I have split my 1mg dose in to two. I took the first dose at 8am this morning and I am guessing that my second dose should be around 4 or 5pm? I seem to be doing ok, although I have a bit of a cold and sore throat and have also had some mild stomach cramps and all that goes with, not sure that this is down to WD as my daughter tells me she also has a sore throat, so it's probably just a bug. Hope you are well.
    Nickie

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